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Subject: A Pair of Dice and a Bell Curve rss

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Randall Causey
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As most everyone knows if you roll a pair of dice, the probability of possible outcomes follows a bell curve with 7 in the middle and 2 and 12 at the ends.

Catan is the most obvious example of a game using this as a central part of the play. The only other one that comes to mind is Sid Sackson's Can't Stop.

What others are there that I'm not aware of?

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Kent Reuber
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2d6 really isn't a bell curve; the probability distribution is more like the gable on a house. You have to add a 3rd dice for the "curve" to start to form.

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David Kahnt
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kwato wrote:
As most everyone knows if you roll a pair of dice, the probability of possible outcomes follows a bell curve with 7 in the middle and 2 and 12 at the ends.

Catan is the most obvious example of a game using this as a central part of the play. The only other one that comes to mind is Sid Sackson's Can't Stop.

What others are there that I'm not aware of?



If you are speaking of just strait up odds and strategies dependent in the game of those odds:

Craps is certainly one.

-DK
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Jason Hinchliffe
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Stone Age uses a similar mechanic. However, it uses it differently, in that it sets minimum sums you need to roll in order to acquire resources, and lets you assign a number of workers to essentially collect dice to do the job.

So for example, to collect gold, you need to roll a sum of minimum 6, and you collect one for every 6 your roll. You then have to calculate how many gold you are going to need for your purposes, and decide how much of your (limited) workforce you are going to commit to try and achieve that result.

It's not the exact same thing, but at its core, it's using a similar set of considerations.
 
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Steffan O'Sullivan
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Monopoly, of course. If you want a real bell curve, Fudge, but that uses special dice.
 
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Ben Draper
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If I understand the OP's question correctly, neither Stone Age or Monopoly fit. He's looking for games in which the curve (or gable) itself is used as part of the design, not just probability.
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Randall Causey
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BennyD wrote:
If I understand the OP's question correctly, neither Stone Age or Monopoly fit. He's looking for games in which the curve (or gable) itself is used as part of the design, not just probability.


Yes, I couldn't have (and didn't) put it better myself.

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Jason Hinchliffe
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BennyD wrote:
If I understand the OP's question correctly, neither Stone Age or Monopoly fit. He's looking for games in which the curve (or gable) itself is used as part of the design, not just probability.


You're correct. However, I couldn't think of any games that fit the criteria perfectly, so I provided an alternative that uses a similar concept.

That said, the OP is looking for a game that will have a Settlers feel to it. (See Recommendations thread). Hence, it using the exact same mechanic I believe, is less important to him than it having a particular "feel".

So I will reiterate my point from both threads. If you are looking for something to play that will make Catan fans happy, go with Stone Age. It maintains some similar mechanics (dice rolling for resources based on statistical probability) and introduces new ones in worker placement, set collection, and end game scoring.
 
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Maurice van Valen
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BennyD wrote:
If I understand the OP's question correctly, neither Stone Age or Monopoly fit. He's looking for games in which the curve (or gable) itself is used as part of the design, not just probability.


I'd say the curve is the essence of rolling 2d6. Games like Warhammer use a 2d6 roll for different tests, where the units in the game have a statistic from 1-10. Choosing the values for each unit cannot be seen separate from the 'gable' if you want balance between value and cost of units.

I can only imagine that the probability distribution is considered during game design and used to balance things. This must also have been used in a game like monopoly to choose the placement of the different locations you can land on.
 
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Gregorio Morales
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Senet, with its four-stick dice has a nice probability curve strategically used to get to "safer" spots.
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Ben Draper
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clockwerk76 wrote:
You're correct. However, I couldn't think of any games that fit the criteria perfectly, so I provided an alternative that uses a similar concept.


Same concept?

Quote:
That said, the OP is looking for a game that will have a Settlers feel to it. (See Recommendations thread). Hence, it using the exact same mechanic I believe, is less important to him than it having a particular "feel".


Fair enough. I wasn't aware of a crossover with another thread.

De Bawa wrote:
I'd say the curve is the essence of rolling 2d6.


I guess. But the way it is utilized, particularly in its relation to Can't Stop, is not similar to the way it is used in Stone Age or Monopoly.

In Settlers of Catan and Can't Stop, high rolls are not inherently more desirable and low numbers are not inherently less desirable. However, the statistical likelihood of numbers being rolled factors into player choices.

In Stone Age, high rolls (as I recall) are always more desirable than low rolls. In Monopoly, doubles are more desirable, and high and low rolls can be desirable or undesirable, depending upon where the player pawn is, but basically independent from the actual result of the roll itself.

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I can only imagine that the probability distribution is considered during game design and used to balance things. This must also have been used in a game like monopoly to choose the placement of the different locations you can land on.


Possibly, but it doesn't make the bell curve function similarly.
 
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Joel Hills
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I think the Temple location in Talisman qualifies.
 
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Jason Hinchliffe
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BennyD wrote:


In Stone Age, high rolls (as I recall) are always more desirable than low rolls.


You're correct. The trick in Stone Age is how many of your workers you commit to trying to achieve that roll. So the consideration is similar to you initial placement criteria in Catan in that you want to give yourself the best odds for what you require. Except in Stone Age, you want to be careful not to over commit, and the consideration must be made each round over and over.
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Ben Draper
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clockwerk76 wrote:
You're correct. The trick in Stone Age is how many of your workers you commit to trying to achieve that roll. So the consideration is similar to you initial placement criteria in Catan in that you want to give yourself the best odds for what you require. Except in Stone Age, you want to be careful not to over commit, and the consideration must be made each round over and over.


I get the comparison now. That makes sense.
 
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Mitchell
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clockwerk76 wrote:
BennyD wrote:


In Stone Age, high rolls (as I recall) are always more desirable than low rolls.


You're correct. The trick in Stone Age is how many of your workers you commit to trying to achieve that roll. So the consideration is similar to you initial placement criteria in Catan in that you want to give yourself the best odds for what you require. Except in Stone Age, you want to be careful not to over commit, and the consideration must be made each round over and over.


In stone age, you just figure each person adds 3.5 to your total when placing, so it isn't quite what is being asked for I believe.

Perhaps Flash Point: Fire Rescue works? from what I understand the fire is randomly seeded based on a d6 and d8.
 
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