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Subject: Two questions regarding Machine Guns rss

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Gabriel Gendron
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1. If I fire a MG at a range that is greater than the squad's own range do I have to divide the inherent firepower of the squad in two (long range fire modifier) when I calculate the total firepower of my attack?

Ex: Russian 4-4-7 squad firing a LMG at a range of 6. Is the total firepower 6 or 4?


2. Rule 17.1 states I can fire any one MG without penalty to my squad's inherent firepower, does this rule also apply to a squad with an HMG?

Thanks!
 
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Ethan McKinney
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gab4tac wrote:
1. If I fire a MG at a range that is greater than the squad's own range do I have to divide the inherent firepower of the squad in two (long range fire modifier) when I calculate the total firepower of my attack?

Ex: Russian 4-4-7 squad firing a LMG at a range of 8. Is the total firepower 6 or 4?


Yes. Firepower 4. Everybody and everything uses its own range.


gab4tac wrote:
2. Rule 17.1 states I can fire any one MG without penalty to my squad's inherent firepower, does this rule also apply to a squad with an HMG?


Yes. Is there something that reads as if it doesn't?
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Andrew Walters
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Yeah, I think "MG" means "LMG or HMG".
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Michael Power
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Yep, the total of 4 FP is correct. 2 FP for the LMG + 2 FP (4÷2 long range fire) for the squad.

I've listed below a reading of 143.1 from G.I. Anvil of Victory that is clearer than 17.1 without altering it.

143.1 A squad may fire any one MG or two LMG’s at no cost to its own inherent FP, or any combination of two MGs with normal MG FP effect in excess of 4 FP factors. Squads taking the latter course forfeit their own inherent FP for that player turn except in CC.
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Gabriel Gendron
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Many thanks to all. I think the Machine Gun rules where much clearer in «GI: Anvil of Victory».
 
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Scott B
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hi guys,

if a Russian 4-4-7 fires a Russian LMG (2-6) at 8 hexes, both are halved for LR (3 IFT) and drop to the 2 IFT column. The squad is better of not firing the LMG as it can break but doesn't contribute to the effective firepower.

if this was a captured german LMG (2-8), than its 4 IFT.

or did i miss something?

S
 
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Andrew Walters
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Yup. Support Weapons are units. That's rule number one. Well, 2.1, but 1.0 is introduction.

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Gabriel Gendron
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sbramley1967 wrote:
hi guys,

if a Russian 4-4-7 fires a Russian LMG (2-6) at 8 hexes, both are halved for LR (3 IFT) and drop to the 2 IFT column. The squad is better of not firing the LMG as it can break but doesn't contribute to the effective firepower.

if this was a captured german LMG (2-8), than its 4 IFT.

or did i miss something?

S


Scott: you are right. My example isn't the best since the russian LMG have a range of 6, my bad. I should have mentionned a captured german LMG. I'll edit the original post so it reads a range of 6 (for posterity).

Andrew: That's a really cool way of looking firepower based on range, I love that! Is there a file of this somewhere? :O
 
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Andrew Walters
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No, I just whipped it up in Google Docs to illustrate the range combinations. I could make such a file, but I'm not sure how to choose the combinations, and I am sure no one wants to refer to it while playing. It's just an example.

Still, I need my copper file uploader microbadge, what should such a file look like? It would be fun to make...
 
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Gabriel Gendron
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I thought it was an Excel file that calculated it based on the stats inserted.
 
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Andrew Walters
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Try this:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Avuesry3xdR5dDZ...

I think anyone can see it and enter the firepower and range of their squad and MG for a full example. If you fiddle with the formulas on the right, though, it will break. Just enter the data.
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Gabriel Gendron
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This is awesome.

It really helps me understand the game better. thumbsup
 
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Andrew Walters
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Try it now. Click on the different counters to see their values pop into the table.
 
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Gabriel Gendron
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Andrew, I gave it a try it's a useful tool for getting a hand for decision making.

I have a new question. blush

Rule 5.7 states:
Quote:
An infantry unit can pick up (or drop) Support Weapons at any point in its move, providing it has sufficient MF to do so.


What is the Movement Factor cost to pick up or drop a support weapon? Is it 1 MF? it's not stated, more like implied.
 
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Scott B
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hi,

its based on the total Portage Points of the SWs a squad carries, regardless of distance.

for example, if it carries a LMG (1PP) and a MMG (4PP), then calculate MFs based on 5PP, even if it drops one along the way. The squad has 4MF - 2 MF (5PP carried - 3 normal PP capability.)

see 5.7 for an example.

S
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Andrew Walters
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Portage is a mini-nightmare. I don't know who thought this snarly little system was worthwhile in terms of flavor. There are better ways to make sure a leader doesn't carry a HMG on each shoulder...

Spend a couple minutes with the table at the top of page 3.

There is no MF cost to drop a SW, and no cost to pick up a SW, only to *carry* it (whatever the distance). So a squad can carry up to three points "for free" and pays one MF for each additional portage point. A HMG weighs five points. So a squad (no leader) can carry a HMG, but will only have two MF left. So if the squad moves two hexes (2 MF) it cannot then pick up a HMG, since it only has two MF let and the HMG will cost it five to carry. A squad could move two hexes (2MF), pick up a MMG (four portage points and therefore 1 MF), and move one more hex (assuming clear terrain).

The rules probably should have avoided the words "pick up" and "drop", as they imply a distinct status. The cost is for carrying. I don't believe there is a difference between a squad being in a hex *carrying* a sw and being in the same hex *not* carrying the sw. In other words a squad could, I think, move four MF into a hex with a HMG and then use that HMG for Defensive Fire in the next player turn without ever having spent MFs to "pick it up".

Try reading 5.7 substituting "begin carrying" for "pick up" and see if that doesn't work better.
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