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Subject: Would it break the game if... rss

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Matt Anderson
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Ellensburg
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You could spend an operation point to remove one of your IP from a country.

With the obvious benefit of removing yourself from coup friendly countries (ie Non-Battleground South America, Central America, Africa)

 
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Conor Hickey
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It would change things an awful lot.

Thematically it would be a bad idea - if the US or USSR has invested in getting a government to think the way they do, which is pretty much what 'influence' represents in game, the world in general wouldn't think much of them if they decided to pull out of the country just because some nasty men might be plotting against them - they would appear weak indeed.
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Pete Hooper
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TwoShedsJackson wrote:
It would change things an awful lot.

Thematically it would be a bad idea - if the US or USSR has invested in getting a government to think the way they do, which is pretty much what 'influence' represents in game, the world in general wouldn't think much of them if they decided to pull out of the country just because some nasty men might be plotting against them - they would appear weak indeed.


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Alpha Mastrano
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Can try using Realignment and hope to fail the roll
 
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Jack Smith
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Imago wrote:
Can try using Realignment and hope to fail the roll :)


That must fall into the advanced cunning plan category.

Op, it may also help to realise 'US' or 'USSR' influence is often nothing of the sort. It is often the representation of a political or cultural stance of a country irrespective of any outside influence.

As an extreme example countries such as the UK or Australia had less chance of becoming communist as a monkey flying to the moon irrespective of what a superpower tried to do. So it is not something easily turned off (although the same could be said of adding influence in many cases too)
 
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Demaratus Raven
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Brief historical point:

Actually, the chance of Britain becoming communist were much greater than you make them out to be--remember that the Labor party, until Blair, was explicitly and proudly socialist in their official party platform. We can nitpick on the differences between communism and socialism, but it's one of degree, not kind. And of course the Fabian socialists would have been quite happy to see Britain more much further down the socialist spectrum towards communism than it ever actually did. And, of course, the Cambridge ring, which the game covers.

I think the game is quite right in making is possible with the right order of events to flip Britain to the USSR. It doesn't happen often, but it does occasionally, and I think that represents the spirit of the actual history quite well.
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Jack Smith
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Demaratus wrote:
Brief historical point:

Actually, the chance of Britain becoming communist were much greater than you make them out to be--remember that the Labor party, until Blair, was explicitly and proudly socialist in their official party platform. We can nitpick on the differences between communism and socialism, but it's one of degree, not kind. And of course the Fabian socialists would have been quite happy to see Britain more much further down the socialist spectrum towards communism than it ever actually did. And, of course, the Cambridge ring, which the game covers.

I think the game is quite right in making is possible with the right order of events to flip Britain to the USSR. It doesn't happen often, but it does occasionally, and I think that represents the spirit of the actual history quite well.


The Fabians (who currently have only 6,500 members) and 5 people from Cambridge is hardly 50 million population any more than Amis represents the typical US political view (although he did it for money of course) We certainly had our share of gullible fools though, including many pie eyed Union leaders and actors/actresses.

All countries have Communist elements. Fascist too for that matter. It does not follow they had any chance of political power or any real influence.

The closest we got I think was at the time of the Russian Revolution. But the establishment was surprised at the lack of reaction in the UK. We didn't even remove the Monarchy or bother with riots.

There was an interesting programme I saw about Union leaders in the 1930's and how easily Stalin mislead them when they visited. But again, they did not do much damage politically.

Over the period of the Cold War Communism as having any political force was dead and buried.

The USSR did try and place influence and failed. I think one of the things perhaps missed from a US perspective is that Socialism is not a dirty word in the UK. It is simply a left leaning political philosophy which still strongly adheres to democratic principles and abhors Communism.

Actually I find the whole idea of any Western European country rejecting Democracy in favour of Communism absurd after WW2 (except maybe Italy), even the French. But for the purposes of the game it's fine. I see influence in Europe to be more about excessive concessions to USSR, such as indicated by the Willy Brandt card.
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mark of carnage
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There was talk of a reactionary coup in the UK in 1968 following the sterling devaluation in November 1967 and strangely the Wilson government shifted away from the left fairly rapidly around that time. In game terms I would say this is a pretty good example of the sort of shenanigans players get up to in TS.

The 68 'coup' remains shadowy and in the realms of conspiracy theory but there's plenty on it if you want to google. No doubt prior to his U turn in 68 Wilson raised a few eyebrows in elite circles in the USA as well as the UK.
 
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Jack Smith
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mark of carnage wrote:
There was talk of a reactionary coup in the UK in 1968 following the sterling devaluation in November 1967 and strangely the Wilson government shifted away from the left fairly rapidly around that time. In game terms I would say this is a pretty good example of the sort of shenanigans players get up to in TS.

The 68 'coup' remains shadowy and in the realms of conspiracy theory but there's plenty on it if you want to google. No doubt prior to his U turn in 68 Wilson raised a few eyebrows in elite circles in the USA as well as the UK.


Your right, conspiracy theory stuff
 
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Caerid is just some guy
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Cannon Falls
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Imago wrote:
Can try using Realignment and hope to fail the roll


You cannot realign a country that does not have enemy influence. You could do it to a country you were fairly certain you would be removed from (as long as your opponent also has influence there) , but you would most likely leave them control. Which may be fine if you just scored the area and need to take away a possible coup.
 
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