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Subject: Games like 7 Wonders or Fairy Tale *Not Magic* rss

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Nathaniel Baker
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I've had my fair share of Magic is days gone past. I'm looking for more of a set board game and card drafting game like 7 Wonders and Fairy Tale. I've had no such luck with internet searches and figure Id try here.

Any such luck by anyone else?
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Paul DeStefano
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Look into Biblios.
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Trevor Schadt
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So... if I'm understanding you correctly, you're looking for recommendations for other games like 7 Wonders and Fairy Tale, that use a card drafting mechanic but aren't collectible like Magic or other CCGs?

Assuming that's correct, you'll probably want to look at games that feature the deckbuilding mechanic: they tend to feature a mechanic where you each have your own personal deck of cards that you use, all of which start out the same, but you can draft cards (usually through some kind of valued purchasing mechanic) from a central supply into your deck, thus customizing your deck as you're playing it. The objective of these games tend to be the accumulation of victory points, whether they lie in cards in the deck, an outside counter mechanic, the establishment of a personal tableau, or some kind of combination of the three.

The first big deckbuilder game that burst onto the scene was Dominion. You purchase a large variation of cards, but only play with a subset of them each game (thus providing the game's replayability). The victory point mechanic (at least for the base game and the first few expansions) is contained within the deck, as victory point cards that give you points, but give you no abilities during the game. Part of the strategy of the game becomes the balance between accumulating the points that you need to win, and the fact that the more victory point cards you have in your deck, the less you will be able to do on an average turn.

The next two entries in the genre were Ascension and Thunderstone. Thunderstone copied relatively faithfully the Dominion mechanic, but added a combat mechanic to make the game more closely resemble a Dungeons-and-Dragons-style adventure. Ascension created two ways to score victory points: by adding cards (which also gave you action abilities) to your deck, or by defeating monsters (which increased an external counter, and also served as the game-end mechanic). Of the two, I prefer Ascension -- the random mechanics of Thunderstone too often led to a frustrating game-end scenario -- but both are worth a try.

From there, the genre diversified into several different types of games, all of which maintained the central deckbuilding mechanic, but expanded the objective outside of a simple accumulation of abstract victory points. A Few Acres of Snow combines deckbuilding with a two-player wargame, and while I haven't tried it, I have heard it is excellent. My personal favorite is Eminent Domain, which combines the deckbuilding mechanic with the tableau building and role-selection mechanics of games like Race for the Galaxy and Puerto Rico/San Juan (all of which I would also recommend). There are many others, but those are the ones with which I'm most familiar.

Of course, if I've misunderstood your initial request, I apologize; please clarify what it is you're looking for and I will be happy to respond.
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Mark McEvoy
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Notre Dame has a draft-and-pass mechanic at play.
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Nathaniel Baker
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ryudoowaru wrote:
So... if I'm understanding you correctly, you're looking for recommendations for other games like 7 Wonders and Fairy Tale, that use a card drafting mechanic but aren't collectible like Magic or other CCGs?

Assuming that's correct, you'll probably want to look at games that feature the deckbuilding mechanic: they tend to feature a mechanic where you each have your own personal deck of cards that you use, all of which start out the same, but you can draft cards (usually through some kind of valued purchasing mechanic) from a central supply into your deck, thus customizing your deck as you're playing it. The objective of these games tend to be the accumulation of victory points, whether they lie in cards in the deck, an outside counter mechanic, the establishment of a personal tableau, or some kind of combination of the three.

The first big deckbuilder game that burst onto the scene was Dominion. You purchase a large variation of cards, but only play with a subset of them each game (thus providing the game's replayability). The victory point mechanic (at least for the base game and the first few expansions) is contained within the deck, as victory point cards that give you points, but give you no abilities during the game. Part of the strategy of the game becomes the balance between accumulating the points that you need to win, and the fact that the more victory point cards you have in your deck, the less you will be able to do on an average turn.

The next two entries in the genre were Ascension and Thunderstone. Thunderstone copied relatively faithfully the Dominion mechanic, but added a combat mechanic to make the game more closely resemble a Dungeons-and-Dragons-style adventure. Ascension created two ways to score victory points: by adding cards (which also gave you action abilities) to your deck, or by defeating monsters (which increased an external counter, and also served as the game-end mechanic). Of the two, I prefer Ascension -- the random mechanics of Thunderstone too often led to a frustrating game-end scenario -- but both are worth a try.

From there, the genre diversified into several different types of games, all of which maintained the central deckbuilding mechanic, but expanded the objective outside of a simple accumulation of abstract victory points. A Few Acres of Snow combines deckbuilding with a two-player wargame, and while I haven't tried it, I have heard it is excellent. My personal favorite is Eminent Domain, which combines the deckbuilding mechanic with the tableau building and role-selection mechanics of games like Race for the Galaxy and Puerto Rico/San Juan (all of which I would also recommend). There are many others, but those are the ones with which I'm most familiar.

Of course, if I've misunderstood your initial request, I apologize; please clarify what it is you're looking for and I will be happy to respond.


You did not misunderstand it. However, I am not new to the deckbuilding scene and own all of the games you mentioned. They aren't exactly what I am looking for here, regardless of how much I like them (just got eminent domain and also love it). Meaning to get Nightfall as its amazon price is ridiculously low. Same with thunderstone Heart of Doom.

But thank you for the responses everyone. Ill be sure to check Biblios and Notre Dame.

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+1 for Biblios, its a great game.
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David Dawson
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thatmarkguy wrote:
Notre Dame has a draft-and-pass mechanic at play.


Another by Stephan Feld is Macao, which has a small draft of the cards each turn.
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Mike Fox
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Call of Cthulhu: The Card Game
Thunderstone
Warhammer: Invasion

Here are some card games that aren't really deck builder/drafting games, but you might check them out. They're still games where you're managing your hand/deck and playing cards for the win!

The Battle for Hill 218---this one has great strategy in a small, quick game. Very popular in our gaming group (although it's 2 player)
Battle Line---simple game, your line vs. your opponent's line, and yet continually have to think ahead and make tough decisions. A good game for card game fans in general.
Pocket Battles: Celts vs. Romans---because sometimes you want do battle, but you don't have the time for drafting lol. The other "Pocket Battles" are good, too.
Battlefields of Olympus---great card game. You're drawing cards and managing your hand (plus piles), preparing for next battle, which could break out at any given moment. This one is cool because sometimes Ares forces you to battle for a land, but you can also choose to battle for one (fate vs. freedom, kind of a hot spot for me lol)
Memoir '44---looks like war game, and I suppose it is, but really you're managing a hand of cards and playing them to do different things with your army. I think it's a card game with miniatures. Check it.
Lost Cities--okay I'm completely outside the box here; just throwing out a competitive card game that's a little different
Iliad---all I can say about this one is that it's on my wish list; perhaps you'll find it intriguing, too.
Haggis---lots of fandom for this one.

Since my son and I really like card games, I'll keep a close eye on this particular thread. Like I said, the bottom suggestions aren't really what you mentioned, but if you like competitive card games, you might find a treasure in one of them. I know my group did. Best of luck!
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knatebaker wrote:
I've had my fair share of Magic is days gone past. I'm looking for more of a set board game and card drafting game like 7 Wonders and Fairy Tale. I've had no such luck with internet searches and figure Id try here.

Any such luck by anyone else?


How about GoSu? It's a head-to-head game for two to four players. The basic rules do not include a draft; everyone gets a starting hand and the game begins. It's a good way to learn, but the game is best with a draft as it's written in the tournament/advanced rules:

GOSU Supplementary Rules/FAQ (Official Style Booklet)

If you haven't played GoSu and want to try it we could probably set something up. You can also play it at boardgamearena.com, but like most card games it's best in person.
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Nathaniel Baker
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foxfan wrote:
Call of Cthulhu: The Card Game
Thunderstone
Warhammer: Invasion

Here are some card games that aren't really deck builder/drafting games, but you might check them out. They're still games where you're managing your hand/deck and playing cards for the win!

The Battle for Hill 218---this one has great strategy in a small, quick game. Very popular in our gaming group (although it's 2 player)
Battle Line---simple game, your line vs. your opponent's line, and yet continually have to think ahead and make tough decisions. A good game for card game fans in general.
Pocket Battles: Celts vs. Romans---because sometimes you want do battle, but you don't have the time for drafting lol. The other "Pocket Battles" are good, too.
Battlefields of Olympus---great card game. You're drawing cards and managing your hand (plus piles), preparing for next battle, which could break out at any given moment. This one is cool because sometimes Ares forces you to battle for a land, but you can also choose to battle for one (fate vs. freedom, kind of a hot spot for me lol)
Memoir '44---looks like war game, and I suppose it is, but really you're managing a hand of cards and playing them to do different things with your army. I think it's a card game with miniatures. Check it.
Lost Cities--okay I'm completely outside the box here; just throwing out a competitive card game that's a little different
Iliad---all I can say about this one is that it's on my wish list; perhaps you'll find it intriguing, too.
Haggis---lots of fandom for this one.

Since my son and I really like card games, I'll keep a close eye on this particular thread. Like I said, the bottom suggestions aren't really what you mentioned, but if you like competitive card games, you might find a treasure in one of them. I know my group did. Best of luck!


Thank you for mentioning Macao dawson_osu, Ill check out that one for sure.

I really like card games and have had a run at Battle for Hill 218, Cthulhu, Pocket Battles, Memoir 44, and others like it. I really enjoy them.

I guess a better way to explain what I'm looking for is 7 Wonders rethemed haha. But no, a card game with a drafting and civ building. More will come I'm sure, I was imply curious as to what else was out there.

Now that we are on the topic of Card Games (Id put links but can't on my mobile): Calaboose (okay western themed), Battleground (basic unit combat, simliliar to Pocket Battles but very fantasy themed), Coppertwaddle (hard to explain, but very inexpensive and worth checking out), and last but definately not least: Nature of the Beast. Well themed and an awesome play. I would recommend all to try it. Check out my review on Nature of the Beast Farm vs Forest to get an idea of it. They have a new battle set on Kickstarter as well at a very good price called Prairie vs. Polar. Check that out as well!

@Wade Nelson: I've never played GoSu. However, I've seen you in the Minneapolis threads...you local? I'm in Coon Rapids and have very little free time, but would love to try it out. There is the Village or Outpost if you are close
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knatebaker wrote:
@Wade Nelson: I've never played GoSu. However, I've seen you in the Minneapolis threads...you local? I'm in Coon Rapids and have very little free time, but would love to try it out. There is the Village or Outpost if you are close


Yep, Saint Louis Park, just west of Minneapolis proper.
 
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You can play Race for the Galaxy with a draft before the gameplay and individual draw/discard piles.
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I love Biblios and heartily recommend it.

However, PAX looks very good. Not crazy about the title, but you should check it out.
 
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knatebaker wrote:
foxfan wrote:
Call of Cthulhu: The Card Game
Thunderstone
Warhammer: Invasion

Here are some card games that aren't really deck builder/drafting games, but you might check them out. They're still games where you're managing your hand/deck and playing cards for the win!

The Battle for Hill 218---this one has great strategy in a small, quick game. Very popular in our gaming group (although it's 2 player)
Battle Line---simple game, your line vs. your opponent's line, and yet continually have to think ahead and make tough decisions. A good game for card game fans in general.
Pocket Battles: Celts vs. Romans---because sometimes you want do battle, but you don't have the time for drafting lol. The other "Pocket Battles" are good, too.
Battlefields of Olympus---great card game. You're drawing cards and managing your hand (plus piles), preparing for next battle, which could break out at any given moment. This one is cool because sometimes Ares forces you to battle for a land, but you can also choose to battle for one (fate vs. freedom, kind of a hot spot for me lol)
Memoir '44---looks like war game, and I suppose it is, but really you're managing a hand of cards and playing them to do different things with your army. I think it's a card game with miniatures. Check it.
Lost Cities--okay I'm completely outside the box here; just throwing out a competitive card game that's a little different
Iliad---all I can say about this one is that it's on my wish list; perhaps you'll find it intriguing, too.
Haggis---lots of fandom for this one.

Since my son and I really like card games, I'll keep a close eye on this particular thread. Like I said, the bottom suggestions aren't really what you mentioned, but if you like competitive card games, you might find a treasure in one of them. I know my group did. Best of luck!


Thank you for mentioning Macao dawson_osu, Ill check out that one for sure.

I really like card games and have had a run at Battle for Hill 218, Cthulhu, Pocket Battles, Memoir 44, and others like it. I really enjoy them.

I guess a better way to explain what I'm looking for is 7 Wonders rethemed haha. But no, a card game with a drafting and civ building. More will come I'm sure, I was imply curious as to what else was out there.

Now that we are on the topic of Card Games (Id put links but can't on my mobile): Calaboose (okay western themed), Battleground (basic unit combat, simliliar to Pocket Battles but very fantasy themed), Coppertwaddle (hard to explain, but very inexpensive and worth checking out), and last but definately not least: Nature of the Beast. Well themed and an awesome play. I would recommend all to try it. Check out my review on Nature of the Beast Farm vs Forest to get an idea of it. They have a new battle set on Kickstarter as well at a very good price called Prairie vs. Polar. Check that out as well!

@Wade Nelson: I've never played GoSu. However, I've seen you in the Minneapolis threads...you local? I'm in Coon Rapids and have very little free time, but would love to try it out. There is the Village or Outpost if you are close


Thanks for the suggestions. My son and I love card games I hadn't even heard of some of these, so seriously, THANKS!
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knatebaker wrote:
ryudoowaru wrote:
So... if I'm understanding you correctly, you're looking for recommendations for other games like 7 Wonders and Fairy Tale, that use a card drafting mechanic but aren't collectible like Magic or other CCGs?

Assuming that's correct, you'll probably want to look at games that feature the deckbuilding mechanic: they tend to feature a mechanic where you each have your own personal deck of cards that you use, all of which start out the same, but you can draft cards (usually through some kind of valued purchasing mechanic) from a central supply into your deck, thus customizing your deck as you're playing it. The objective of these games tend to be the accumulation of victory points, whether they lie in cards in the deck, an outside counter mechanic, the establishment of a personal tableau, or some kind of combination of the three.

The first big deckbuilder game that burst onto the scene was Dominion. You purchase a large variation of cards, but only play with a subset of them each game (thus providing the game's replayability). The victory point mechanic (at least for the base game and the first few expansions) is contained within the deck, as victory point cards that give you points, but give you no abilities during the game. Part of the strategy of the game becomes the balance between accumulating the points that you need to win, and the fact that the more victory point cards you have in your deck, the less you will be able to do on an average turn.

The next two entries in the genre were Ascension and Thunderstone. Thunderstone copied relatively faithfully the Dominion mechanic, but added a combat mechanic to make the game more closely resemble a Dungeons-and-Dragons-style adventure. Ascension created two ways to score victory points: by adding cards (which also gave you action abilities) to your deck, or by defeating monsters (which increased an external counter, and also served as the game-end mechanic). Of the two, I prefer Ascension -- the random mechanics of Thunderstone too often led to a frustrating game-end scenario -- but both are worth a try.

From there, the genre diversified into several different types of games, all of which maintained the central deckbuilding mechanic, but expanded the objective outside of a simple accumulation of abstract victory points. A Few Acres of Snow combines deckbuilding with a two-player wargame, and while I haven't tried it, I have heard it is excellent. My personal favorite is Eminent Domain, which combines the deckbuilding mechanic with the tableau building and role-selection mechanics of games like Race for the Galaxy and Puerto Rico/San Juan (all of which I would also recommend). There are many others, but those are the ones with which I'm most familiar.

Of course, if I've misunderstood your initial request, I apologize; please clarify what it is you're looking for and I will be happy to respond.


You did not misunderstand it. However, I am not new to the deckbuilding scene and own all of the games you mentioned. They aren't exactly what I am looking for here, regardless of how much I like them (just got eminent domain and also love it). Meaning to get Nightfall as its amazon price is ridiculously low. Same with thunderstone Heart of Doom.

But thank you for the responses everyone. Ill be sure to check Biblios and Notre Dame.



Okay now I'm seriously considering Nightfall. Tom Vasel said it's the best deck building game out there! That's high praise any way you slice it.
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Quote:
Okay now I'm seriously considering Nightfall. Tom Vasel said it's the best deck building game out there! That's high praise any way you slice it.


I'm pretty sure he's changed his mind since the review, and now thinks that Thunderstone is best deck builder. At least, it figured very highly in his last Top 100.
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mupdan wrote:
Quote:
Okay now I'm seriously considering Nightfall. Tom Vasel said it's the best deck building game out there! That's high praise any way you slice it.


I'm pretty sure he's changed his mind since the review, and now thinks that Thunderstone is best deck builder. At least, it figured very highly in his last Top 100.


Like I said, it's high praise any way you slice it
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I'd recommend LOTR LCG and Call of Cthulhu LCG, both by Fantasy Flight. Personally, I didn't enjoy Nightfall at all. A discount price doesn't redeem it in my eyes. Good luck!
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mupdan wrote:
Quote:
Okay now I'm seriously considering Nightfall. Tom Vasel said it's the best deck building game out there! That's high praise any way you slice it.


I'm pretty sure he's changed his mind since the review, and now thinks that Thunderstone is best deck builder. At least, it figured very highly in his last Top 100.


I certainly was less than impressed by Nightfall, although I'm told that the expansion helps fix issues with the original release. I'm a huge fan of Thunderstone myself.
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LotR LCG is actually one I've wanted to try...same with Game of Thrones LCG, but unfortunately Id have no other players to join me.
 
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