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Subject: Lock n Load vs Conflict of Heroes. NEW POLL rss

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David Sims
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The poll in my other thread was very contaminated by folks voting a game their favourite when they have not played both.

EDIT: Please thumb as you go by

Please only enter a preference if you have played both.

Poll
1. Which games have you played?
Lock n Load
Conflict of Heroes
Neither
2. Which do you prefer?
I have not played both of them
Lock n Load
Conflict of Heroes
      371 answers
Poll created by dssims
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Judy Krauss
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You left out:
"I like them both but for different reasons"

EDIT: I already explained it in the first poll...don't feel like doing it again.
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David Sims
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Jude wrote:
You left out:
"I like them both but for different reasons"


In the words of someone famous ... 'DOH'

EDIT: I guess even if one likes both, it is likely one will have a preference. I will have to believe that or i won't gret a wink of sleep snore
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Eric Walters
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Both are terrific entry-ways into tactical ground wargaming (even better than Combat Commander Series because there are VEHICLES!). But I like the Lock 'N Load series better. For one thing, there's greater variety than Conflict of Heroes, at least at the moment. For another, the leaders are skills/capabilities add a lot of color to the game. One of the best features are the spotting rules that add quite a bit of tension--this is where LNL most rivals the tension that COH has in deciding how to spend those APs when the situation (and your opponent) hands you a thorny dilemma.
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Michael McCalpin
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What is the motivation for the two respondents (as of this writing) who indicated that they have played neither game? Presumably they indicated no preference in the second question. What drives them to answer the poll?

Are they Haters of Binaryness? Were they The One with His Hand Up in primary school? Are they LibDems, Libertarians, or (insert third-party here)? Are they the ever-present 3-9% who are "Not Sure" on every poll question one sees on the news? Is there a Fabulous Prize just for participating? I may have to set up a poll to discover...
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David Sims
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mmccalpin wrote:
What is the motivation for the two respondents (as of this writing) who indicated that they have played neither game? Presumably they indicated no preference in the second question. What drives them to answer the poll?

Are they Haters of Binaryness? Were they The One with His Hand Up in primary school? Are they LibDems, Libertarians, or (insert third-party here)? Are they the ever-present 3-9% who are "Not Sure" on every poll question one sees on the news? Is there a Fabulous Prize just for participating? I may have to set up a poll to discover...


It is interesting, is it not? All your theories have merit, however I favour the "there is a box, I must click in it" desire which has become part of our genetic memory in just a couple of generations.
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Matt Jolly
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Hello there dssims,

maybe they own both but have played neither?

Or maybe not.

I ticked prefer CoH, but that is almost solely driven by the fact I have an opponent for it but not LnL. Yet I acquired LnL when 1st Ed Forgotten Heroes came out, bought the Anzac supplement and have three other games in the line and have yet to play with a living human opponent! I have played LnL, but only against myself!

Cheers,

Matt
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Ken Feldman
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Both are good systems, but I prefer CoH because I like the combat resolution system better and I think it plays faster because it doesn't have the sighting rules that slow down LnL games. And to me, LnL felt like it was derivative of ATS and PanzerGrenadier, whereas the activation system in CoH makes it different then other tactical wargames out there.
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Mike Windsor
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Matt, if you are going to continue playing by yourself, invest in ....



devil


Sorry.
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Mike Windsor
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Quote:
Both are good systems, but I prefer CoH because I like the combat resolution system better and I think it plays faster because it doesn't have the sighting rules that slow down LnL games. And to me, LnL felt like it was derivative of ATS and PanzerGrenadier, whereas the activation system in CoH makes it different then other tactical wargames out there.


I think the reason I like the LnL games is the spotting rule. It seems to comport with the accounts I've read where troops just seemed to disappear, only to pop back up a bit later.
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rexbinary
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I owned both, played both, and sold both.

I sold Conflict of Heroes because while I really enjoyed it, I seemed to outgrow it quickly. I do plan to buy the upcoming Conflict of Heroes release that features a solitaire system by John H. Butterfield since I play solo quite a bit. I am also considering purchasing the the Second Edition of Conflict of Heroes: Awakening the Bear! – Russia 1941-42.

I sold everything I owned by Lock 'n Load Publishing, LLC. and would never purchase a game from them again. First the Lock 'n Load games themselves are not fun, and the rules are awful. I think this is due to the fact hat the designer bills himself as a writer and not a war game designer. This makes for very "gamey" and ahistorical games. Second, component quality of games from Lock 'n Load Publishing, LLC. is the worst I have ever purchased. (i.e. the Nations at War: White Star Rising disaster for one) Finally, Mark H. Walker has demonstrated here and on CSW that he cannot accept any criticism of his games.

Therefore I would recommend Conflict of Heroes over Lock 'n Load or really anything published by Lock 'n Load Publishing, LLC..
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Kev.
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rexbinary wrote:
I owned both, played both, and sold both.

I sold Conflict of Heroes because while I really enjoyed it, I seemed to outgrow it quickly. I do plan to buy the upcoming Conflict of Heroes release that features a solitaire system by John H. Butterfield since I play solo quite a bit. I am also considering purchasing the the Second Edition of Conflict of Heroes: Awakening the Bear! – Russia 1941-42.

I sold everything I owned by Lock 'n Load Publishing, LLC. and would never purchase a game from them again. First the Lock 'n Load games themselves are not fun, and the rules are awful. I think this is due to the fact hat the designer bills himself as a writer and not a war game designer. This makes for very "gamey" and ahistorical games. Second, component quality of games from Lock 'n Load Publishing, LLC. is the worst I have ever purchased. (i.e. the Nations at War: White Star Rising disaster for one) Finally, Mark H. Walker has demonstrated here and on CSW that he cannot accept any criticism of his games.

Therefore I would recommend Conflict of Heroes over Lock 'n Load or really anything published by Lock 'n Load Publishing, LLC..


I've had exactly the opposite experience.
How about some specifics.
Every game I have has great quality parts - boards, maps, scenario cards... dont beleive me look here:
http://meshtime.com/?s=LNL ANY issues I have had were address by the owner quickly. This is a small family business folks not some corporate giant.

Some LNL titles that are WWII based are likened to ASL lite. I think that is a dis service. LNL titles tend to focus on game play, and 'reasonableness' versus the minutiae of aSL - which has its place.


Not fun? You jump from fun to ahistorical.. make your mind up. WaW is fun! fast playing, fast action, easy rules for Gods sake man its less than 20 pages. LNL series longer folksy writing on rules, but superb support from community, check the forum. I noticed you barely tried to seek assistance in teh forums here or on in CSW. I smell puppet. It plays well. Nearly every game comes down to the wire. When you have sweaty palms for your last die roll ....DUH!! of course its fun.

The Vietnam, Falklands war games are not AHISTORICAL... please. very playble, look good, excellent replay value and dam good fun.


The WWIII stuff of course is not ahistorical... it never happened and is based upon novels written by the owner.

So before you throw up on a small company with no facts, place an argument on the table, and present some data. Other wise STHU. People that ass smack companies like this are mean spirited little P#$%W#%%@ so and so's. So sorry you had a bad experience. I hope whoever you buy your games from next treats you better.

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Brandon Pennington
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I have played both and they are both good games. Of the two I would rather play Conflict of Heroes as I enjoy it more. I would rather play Combat Commander than either one of them though if I had the choice. The lack of vehicles does not bother me that much, but if I do have to play one with vehicles I would probably prefer CoH.
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rexbinary
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hipshot wrote:
So before you throw up on a small company with no facts, place an argument on the table, and present some data. Other wise STHU. People that ass smack companies like this are mean spirited little P#$%W#%%@ so and so's. So sorry you had a bad experience. I hope whoever you buy your games from next treats you better.


I'm sorry you don't care for my opinion, but I'm not going to call you names nor debate my own opinion with you.
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Kev.
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its an opinion with no facts.
so b4 u throw some company under the bus with inflammatory remarks provide some basis for the discussion.
There are lots of things wrong with each company. some of uis try to work thru that and help them get better.

I had issues with GMT in the past and got no where flaming them like you.
Its better to seeks solutions offer reasoned comments etc. You just come across really mean spirited.....in my opinion.
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O B
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I've played both. I prefer CoH only because I like how it's a little simpler (though I have some beef with the activation system). At this point I've invested enough in CoH that I'm committed.

I do very much like some of LNL's other games - a huge fan of the World at War series! The components are not as nice as CoH but I quite like the graphic design.
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Sean McNeely
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I have owned and played both systems and I prefer Lock n' Load. Conflict of Heroes just did not feel that fun to me. The components are very nice and the rules well-written but it just didn't grab me.

I like LnL because it is like a Saturday afternoon war movie, not a realistic simulation but quick, guns blazing fun. I also like that other conflicts besides WWII are offered. The new Vietnam module is exceptionally good.

I have played all the tactical WWII games currently offered with the exception of Band of Brothers. LnL and ASL are the two that I always make time for. I would like to get my hands on Ambush and UpFront someday. They both look nice. One can never have too many games.
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The Tak
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Sean has a very good point: Up Front over either!
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theTak wrote:
Sean has a very good point: Up Front over either! ;)


Up Front is awesome... but, um... completely different.
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Roger Hobden
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I like both systems equally so I did not answer the poll.

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Andy Cowen
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At this point I prefer the Lock N Load series because of the great scenarios and wide variety of eras that the games cover. I didn't enjoy the scenarios in COH Storms of Steel much. However, I preodered the second edition of Conflict of Heroes and am eager to try it, especially John Butterfield's solitaire module for the game.
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hey, what ever happened to the computer adaption of LnL? Vaporware?

http://www.locknloadgame.com/Section_Cat_Content_Detail.asp?...
 
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Bob Hansen
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Just out of curiosity, has anyone played both games and also Band of Brothers: Screaming Eagles? Would Band of Brothers: Screaming Eagles be in the same class as Conflict of Heroes and Lock N Load?

The reason I ask this is I am on the fence over getting Lock N Load or Band of Brothers. Band of Brothers looks very intriguing from the reviews I have read. Lock N Load covers some modern(ish) scenarios, which really interests me. WWII has been done to death and it's nice playing something new and a bit more familiar to me (I served in the Army in the 1980s).

I liked Conflict of Heroes, but when I played the more complex Fighting Formations: Grossdeutschland Motorized Infantry Division, which borrows some mechanics from CoH, CoH kind of lost some of it's luster to me.
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Enrico Viglino
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mmccalpin wrote:
What is the motivation for the two respondents (as of this writing) who indicated that they have played neither game? Presumably they indicated no preference in the second question. What drives them to answer the poll?



I like filling little boxes. I also picked the other two options.
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Sean McCormick
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kixdsky wrote:
Just out of curiosity, has anyone played both games and also Band of Brothers: Screaming Eagles? Would Band of Brothers: Screaming Eagles be in the same class as Conflict of Heroes and Lock N Load?

The reason I ask this is I am on the fence over getting Lock N Load or Band of Brothers. Band of Brothers looks very intriguing from the reviews I have read. Lock N Load covers some modern(ish) scenarios, which really interests me. WWII has been done to death and it's nice playing something new and a bit more familiar to me (I served in the Army in the 1980s).

I liked Conflict of Heroes, but when I played the more complex Fighting Formations: Grossdeutschland Motorized Infantry Division, which borrows some mechanics from CoH, CoH kind of lost some of it's luster to me.


I've played them all (including Fighting Formations) and would strongly recommend Band of Brothers. It's easily the best of the bunch.
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