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Battlestar Galactica: The Board Game» Forums » General

Subject: Fixing the loyalty deck in game with only 1 Cylon? rss

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Ecosmith Ecosmith
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I might end up hosting a 3 player game with 2 noobs soon. I was considering fixing the loyalty deck somehow so that I end up Cylon. That way, my rationale is, I can sort of act as a tyPe of 'GM' as wwll as playing normally.

I guess that means I assume that its harder to be a Cylon straight off than a human player. I haven't had any experience as a cylon yet either, however, but I have played enough games to be familiar with the rules and how spiking works etc.

Any thoughts?

Eco
 
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Darren Nakamura
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I say don't do it. Not only does it take away from the intrigue of "maybe I'll find out I'm a Cylon halfway through the game..." but it also gives you an unfair advantage in choosing a character that better suits a Cylon's needs. It may be just as mysterious for the other two players, but you will lose a lot of what makes this game great.

Just make sure your new players have a good handle on the basic mechanics before you really play. Perhaps even do a dummy round or two before handing out starting Loyalty and then reset everything for the real thing. I have had players in the past spike checks as Humans simply because they didn't have a good grasp on the "these colors count positive for this check, these colors count negative for this check" idea.

If you want to make anything easier without even bending the rules, then just do your best to make sure you are President. I've found that the Quorum deck is more confusing to new players than being a Cylon is.
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Jerry Martin
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I would say no. It isn't that hard to be a Cylon and in general it seems like the Cylons have an advantage.

But it wouldn't be that hard to stack the deck, just put the Cylon card on top and deal it to yourself. They are learning a new game and probably wouldn't know what is going on enough to tell.
 
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Whenever I introduce new players to the game, I always deal the new players a 'You are Not a Cylon' card during the first half of the game. That way, I can properly advise them on good human actions to take (even if I'm a Cylon... I put aside wining the game for the first 4-distance in order to teach).
 
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Patrick R
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I'd vote against that as well. Generally, I've found the game to already be weighted towards the Cylons as it is (at least with new players), so I don't think there'd be any harm in letting one of the new players be one. Plus, the secrecy is a huge part of the fun.

As an alternative, maybe you could just rig the deck so that none of you are Cylons at the beginning of the game, to give everyone a chance to figure out the basic game mechanics before throwing Cylon players into the mix. That way everyone will be familiar with how the game works before the Sleeper phase comes around and they have to start acting against the other players.
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Mindy G
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Mighty Pope wrote:
As an alternative, maybe you could just rig the deck so that none of you are Cylons at the beginning of the game, to give everyone a chance to figure out the basic game mechanics before throwing Cylon players into the mix. That way everyone will be familiar with how the game works before the Sleeper phase comes around and they have to start acting against the other players.


I agree with this! Rig pre-sleeper loyalty only, then let the Lords of Kobol decide from there.
 
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Bob Smithy

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Just let it be. My first game was a 3-noob 3-player game, with me starting out as PrAdmiral William Adama, card-carying skinjob. Went to sleeper phase after 3 jumps ( :0 ), but no further. Actually one with centurions for once!
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For more people, being a/the cylon is typically harder since you lose that aspect of teamwork. In a game with 2 cylons, at worst you're truly alone since you either don't have a cylon buddy yet, or it's close to the end of the game and despite pleading, and suggestions from ALL players, he's still too shy/reserved/afraid to reveal. On average, you know he's helping you, but don't know who it is yet. At best, you've identified each other, and despite whatever the situation may be, you both get to share in the thrill of being cylons working together for the other team.

In 1-cylon games, you're truly alone. You can find some solstice in the void, or game itself as the crisis deck and cylon ships now help you in different ways, but it can be tough to get past how objective some advice is from team humans even if one person is "modding" the game. I guess it's like overcoming certain fears or uncertainties like asking a girl out or public speaking, it's something that everyone should try at least once.


It's your call. Having a "them vs. you" mentality may prove to be a bonding experience for them. The fact that you haven't played as a un/revealed cylon yet may even things out. OTOH, some groups adapt a "just let him play the game, even if it doesn't work out". You can certainly chime in to state why it's a bad idea to move his viper into a clould of 6 raiders, but in the end, some people prefer that type of experinece instead. If he keeps doing sub-optimal moves without any sort of subjective justification, then it may be time to reevaluate the whole situation.


Ripshawd wrote:
Whenever I introduce new players to the game, I always deal the new players a 'You are Not a Cylon' card during the first half of the game. That way, I can properly advise them on good human actions to take (even if I'm a Cylon... I put aside wining the game for the first 4-distance in order to teach).
Admittedly one of my groups have abused that on several occassions. We'd often XO-ed the newbie(s) since we knew he was given a human card blush


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Pieter
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I have dealt with this in two ways:

(1) Make sure the two Cylon cards are in the second stack. That way, everybody starts human (but do not tell them that, of course). This works well, as with newbies Cylons have an advantage anyway.

(2) Deal the cards as normal, but not look at my own card. I make that abundantly clear: "I do not know whether I am a Cylon or not, so you can trust my advice. I will look at my card when the sleeper-agent phase hits." I then give advice for both humans and Cylons.

The main trick of playing with newbies is not to dominate the game. Let them make mistakes, as long as they follow the rules. The Cylons will probably win anyway, so consider it a learning experience.
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Ecosmith Ecosmith
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I've been raeading through the Crisis Deck, and it seems a bit harsh towards the humans (understandably). I was wondering what a 3P game with NO cylons at all would be like. It might be a good way for us to learn how to play properly without worrying about a noob getting a Cylon card and not knowing how to play it. I'm afraid of the Cylon revealing early through accident, and then spendign the rest of the game not having a lot of fun..

I don't want the game to be a cakewalk for the Humans, though.

Eco
 
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Darren Nakamura
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If you really wanted to, you could try the official fully cooperative variant. It loses a lot of what makes BSG great, but it should suffice as far as teaching the basic mechanics. Of course, you may run the risk of your players thinking, "Well, this isn't very good, and it's a significant time investment. I don't want to play this game again."
 
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Alexander Mercer
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We've managed to miss-build the Loyalty Deck (actually I think we picked up the wrong pile of cards in the sleeper phase) and had no cylons. We lost and it was the most crazily paranoid game ever - no one trusted anyone enough to XO, and everyone was convinced that whoever they Cylon was had an ace to pull out at the last minute.
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Nathan M
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My suggestion... build the loyalty deck, remove 2 you are not a cylon cards, shuffle the remainder. Put the two "you are not a cylon" cards on top. Deal normally ( to yourself last ) and barring Boomer or Baltar you'll have guaranteed that neither of the other two is a cylon pre-sleeper while retaining some degree of mystery on your own account. By the time you reach sleeper phase, the other players should be familiar enough with the rules to understand the implications of being a cylon.

Even if they know how you rigged the deck, this leaves just enough uncertainty to ensure paranoia...
 
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Ecosmith Ecosmith
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We played, but it turned out there were four of us. I used Another Sympathiser Variant from the variants forum, and it was a fun game.

I'm thinking of trying a 3P game with a loyalty deck of 1 YAAC, 2 YANAC cards, with no sleeper phase and a straight 6 jumps to a human win. Anybody triued anything like this?

Eco
 
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Ecosmith wrote:
We played, but it turned out there were four of us. I used Another Sympathiser Variant from the variants forum, and it was a fun game.

I'm thinking of trying a 3P game with a loyalty deck of 1 YAAC, 2 YANAC cards, with no sleeper phase and a straight 6 jumps to a human win. Anybody triued anything like this?

Eco
So 6 jumps, NOT 6-distance? How do you resolve the various jump distances on the Destination cards then? If you don't use Destination cards, then how do you balance the game without them?

I have a hunch, but you do lose the uncertainty of how long the game will last (in extreme cases, the game goes an extra hour to 4 hours, or wraps up in 2.5 hours). I've seen cylons lose and get slaughtered to 4 jumps, or cylons pull ahead since Colonial Fleet ended up doing 2 more jumps.
 
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Ecosmith Ecosmith
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Oops i meant 6 distance.

Eco
 
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Ecosmith Ecosmith
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I'm aiming for a less random gamelength, although i see that two lucky destination draws could mske for a very short game lol.

Maybe I coukd remove all 3-distance destination cards, or do something like:

4 jumps minimum, then 2 dist to win

?

Eco
 
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Keith B
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You might want to look at the fuel as well. With only a distance of 6 to travel this resource might be too easy to manage.
 
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I inquired about a 6-distance game here....
http://www.boardgamegeek.com/thread/765271/your-thoughts-on-...

It could work, but it really does wreck alot of the game as it was intended. Plus, any Cylon Leader who needs to look at resources for his Agenda needs to be tweaked for all of this as well.
 
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