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Battlestar Galactica: The Board Game» Forums » Rules

Subject: Unclear about discarding non-skill cards... rss

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Dan
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...like the Crisis or Quorum cards after they've been resolved. Are they discarded face-up in seperate piles, or face-down on the bottom of the deck? Does it matter?
 
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Mark L
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Faceup into separate piles, but it doesn't matter except for the Pegasus destination Mining Asteroid.
 
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Crisis cards form a discard pile when played. If they are scouted (or via Boomer's Recon), you can choose to place them either on top or bottom of the deck. There are a few cards that can interact with the bottom of the deck (one examines the bottom card and Thirty-Three reshuffles the deck).

Quorum cards also form a discard pile unless a card states that it should be removed from the game (via a successful Inspirational Speech or Food Rationing, for example). If the Quorum deck ever runs out, shuffle the discards to form a new deck.
 
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Robert Stewart
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In theory, you'd also reshuffle the Crisis discards to form a new Crisis deck, but I'm not sure if it's even theoretically possible for the game to continue that long without either side winning - if it is possible, it's fantastically unlikely...
 
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Dan
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Okay, so am I just being blind? I can't find this anywhere in the rules or the FAQ. If there are cards that let you see the bottom of the deck then it certainly matters.

If the rules don't specify, which I believe they don't, then I suppose it's reasonable to assume that discarding into separate piles would be the default, but it is unclear.

It's also unclear whether or not the discards are shuffled back into the draw pile when the game calls for the "deck" to be shuffled.
 
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Rianane wrote:
Okay, so am I just being blind? I can't find this anywhere in the rules or the FAQ. If there are cards that let you see the bottom of the deck then it certainly matters.

If the rules don't specify, which I believe they don't, then I suppose it's reasonable to assume that discarding into separate piles would be the default, but it is unclear.

It's also unclear whether or not the discards are shuffled back into the draw pile when the game calls for the "deck" to be shuffled.


Pegasus adds a Qcard called Consult the Oracle that lets you look at the bottom.
 
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Robert Stewart
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Rianane wrote:
Okay, so am I just being blind? I can't find this anywhere in the rules or the FAQ. If there are cards that let you see the bottom of the deck then it certainly matters.

If the rules don't specify, which I believe they don't, then I suppose it's reasonable to assume that discarding into separate piles would be the default, but it is unclear.

It's also unclear whether or not the discards are shuffled back into the draw pile when the game calls for the "deck" to be shuffled.


The relevant rule for what to do when a deck runs out is top-right of page 28 (first paragraph under Component Limitations):

Rulebook wrote:
Whenever a deck of cards runs out, the current player shuffles the appropriate discard pile to form a new deck. This includes Skill Cards, Quorum Cards, Crisis Cards, Super Crisis Cards, and Destination Cards.


Second paragraph under Hand Limit and Discarding (top right of page 15):

Rulebook wrote:
Whenever a player discards a Skill Card, it is placed in a
discard pile faceup next to the appropriate Skill deck. When
a deck runs out of Skill Cards, the discard pile is shuffled to
create a new Skill deck.


Other card types appear to have less complete rules support, so you could argue for a unified Quorum-and-(Super)-Crisis discard pile (Destinations are never discarded, so there's no way they could ever run out when playing by the rules) that gets shuffled to form the new Quorum deck, but since effects that tell you to draw Quorum cards tell you to draw Quorum cards, any non-Quorum cards that end up in the Quorum deck would be stuck there, also preventing the deck from becoming empty (open to interpretation whether that counts as "running out" or not).

As far as I can find, the rules don't even say that non-Skill cards should go into a pile when "discarded" - the existence of "appropriate" discard piles for the other card types has to be inferred from the instruction to shuffle them to form the new deck. On the other hand, the existence of discard piles strongly suggests that that's where discarded cards should end up.

So, yes, it's unclear, but sensible, to discard into separate piles; it's clear that discard piles get shuffled to form new decks when the old ones run out (it sometimes matters whether a pile gets shuffled when the deck runs out, or when someone tries taking a card from the empty deck).
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Pieter
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BSG has three ways of dealing with cards:
(1) Discard: the card is placed openly on a discard pile for the deck. This is the most common approach in dealing with cards that are used (crisis, skill cards, quorum cards).
(2) Remove from the game: the card is openly returned to the game box. This is sometimes done with quorum cards, e.g., an Inspirational Speech that is successful.
(3) Bury: the card is placed on the bottom of the draw pile without showing it. This is done when a player gets to see secret information and can decide what to do with it, e.g., after successfully scouting.

Usually what needs to be done with a card is clear, it is either in the rules or on the card itself. There is a slight discrepancy with Caprica between the base game and Pegasus/Exodus. In the base game, a crisis that is not selected with Caprica is discarded (so everybody gets to see what the Cylon did not pick); in the expansions the card is buried.
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Robert Stewart
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Flyboy Connor wrote:
Usually what needs to be done with a card is clear, it is either in the rules or on the card itself. There is a slight discrepancy with Caprica between the base game and Pegasus/Exodus. In the base game, a crisis that is not selected with Caprica is discarded (so everybody gets to see what the Cylon did not pick); in the expansions the card is buried.


I thought it was just in Pegasus - I think the only modification to the Cylon locations (besides adding the Basestar Bridge) from Base to Exodus is that jump icons count on Caprica...
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Joseph Cochran
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rmsgrey wrote:
Flyboy Connor wrote:
Usually what needs to be done with a card is clear, it is either in the rules or on the card itself. There is a slight discrepancy with Caprica between the base game and Pegasus/Exodus. In the base game, a crisis that is not selected with Caprica is discarded (so everybody gets to see what the Cylon did not pick); in the expansions the card is buried.


I thought it was just in Pegasus - I think the only modification to the Cylon locations (besides adding the Basestar Bridge) from Base to Exodus is that jump icons count on Caprica...


Yeah, it's the Pegasus overlay that also changes the location of the rejected crisis to "bottom of deck" instead of "discard." The reason if you think about it is pretty sound: in Pegasus the Cylon Leader/Sympathetic Cylon requires secrecy about their agenda, whereas without the agendas there's really no information to be gleaned out of the Cylon choices.
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Pieter
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I thought Exodus said it in the rulebook, but I never really play Exodus...
 
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Simur el Mago
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Rulebook wrote:
Whenever a player discards a Skill Card, it is placed in a
discard pile faceup next to the appropriate Skill deck. When
a deck runs out of Skill Cards, the discard pile is shuffled to
create a new Skill deck.


Doesn't this rule allow other players SEE wich type cards the player discarded, allowing them to make that player more suspicious if he didn't contribute the needed cards for a skill check? Before seeing this rule, we all threw skill cards into a big pile, and then separate them whenever it was neccesary to create skill piles again (or build the destiny deck). Unless i'm missing something, it takes away some of the neccesary secrecy of the game.


Regards
 
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Robert Stewart
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Simur wrote:
Rulebook wrote:
Whenever a player discards a Skill Card, it is placed in a
discard pile faceup next to the appropriate Skill deck. When
a deck runs out of Skill Cards, the discard pile is shuffled to
create a new Skill deck.


Doesn't this rule allow other players SEE wich type cards the player discarded, allowing them to make that player more suspicious if he didn't contribute the needed cards for a skill check? Before seeing this rule, we all threw skill cards into a big pile, and then separate them whenever it was neccesary to create skill piles again (or build the destiny deck). Unless i'm missing something, it takes away some of the neccesary secrecy of the game.


Regards


Yes, this rule does allow players to see what specific cards are being discarded by other players. It does increase the information available to players, so you may wish to house-rule for face-down discards, with a pause for the heap to be shuffled and separated when a draw-pile needs rebuilding. That doesn't mean it take away necessary secrecy, just that it reduces secrecy relative to the alternative...
 
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Simur el Mago
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Ok. Let's say then that a character has 14 cards in his hand, so he must discard four. The player discard 4 "Tactics" cards. Does he have to discard them one by one face up revealing each card, or can he just place the four at the same time only revealing the one on top?

Regards
 
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Robert Stewart
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Simur wrote:
Ok. Let's say then that a character has 14 cards in his hand, so he must discard four. The player discard 4 "Tactics" cards. Does he have to discard them one by one face up revealing each card, or can he just place the four at the same time only revealing the one on top?

Regards


I'd say that anyone who wants to can look at the cards as/immediately after they're discarded, and the person discarding may make it clear precisely what cards he's discarding, but it's a perfectly acceptable shortcut to just put all four on hte discard pile as a unit so long as no-one cares enough to ask.

This also reduces the likelihood of the situation where, half-a-dozen or more turns later, someone draws their skill cards for the turn and finds an unexpected Treachery amongst their Tactics draw...
 
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Simur el Mago
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Ok, that settles it then. Really apreciate your answers!
 
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