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Dust Tactics» Forums » General

Subject: Battle outcome dilemma! Who is the winner?? rss

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Andy Old_Skool_Jedi
England
Rayleigh
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Hey everyone, after seeing all the positive comments on on here bought the Revised Core set 10 days ago. We had our first play last night- I was the Allies and my wife and 6 year old son (Captain of dice rolling!)were Axis. After the brief introduction scenario we moved on to scenario 2 of the Victory Bridge campaign - Bridge in Sight! It was a great battle with the momentum swinging both ways across the 8 rounds. At round 8 Rhino and my one remaining hammer prevented the Axis troops from finishing the round on the bridge but were both killed in the process. This meant we had succeeded in achieving the scenario objective for the Allies but had been wiped out in the process, where as the axis army had two remaining Heavy Flak Grenadiers and an undamaged Walker.

By definition of the scenario the Allies were victorious by preventing any Axis troops being on the bridge at the end of round 8. However my wife's argument was that the Axis forces had wiped out the Allies and were now at liberty to stroll on to bridge unchallenged!

After much debate we decided to call it a draw and the BGG Dust Tactics community decide the final result!

So over to you- who should be declared the winner, Axis or Allies?

Me and my wife have both agreed that whoever the majority of you say should be declared the winner that is the outcome we will register for the campaign.

Also any justification for your decision would also be helpful (but not essential). Thanks.
 
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Chris Campos
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Id say the allies won.

1> There are gameplay reasons for time limits on objectives, it's part of balance.

2> Thematically, yes, the Axis could no cross the bridge at will, but how do we know there was no time limit on whatever they were trying to cross the bridge to accomplish? Maybe delaying them 8 turns (and dying a heroic death worthy of a greek tragedy in the process) was enough to keep them from succeeding.

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Thiago Aranha
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Allies definitely won.

The mission objective was to take the bridge, the allies being wiped out had zero to do with it. If the axis failed to take the bridge, they lost. Hail the victorious dead!

Storytelling-wise, you could say that the allies delayed them enough that after the 8 rounds, reinforcements came and bombed the outskirts of the bridge, crushing the axis. If they had been on the bridge by then, the allies wouldn't have risked destroying the bridge to crush the axis, as it was too valuable strategically.
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Joseph Saucedo
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The attacker must have at least one minature alive, on the bridge by the end of turn 8.

If they did the axis won, if not the allies one.

Some games have victory conditions and also say somehthing like or eliminate the other player. I could see your wifes arguement. But i dont beleive dust has those conditions
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Roberto Gualtierotti
Italy
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I am sorry for your wife blush and the little Captain, but I agree with the other guys. Your men heroically sacrificed their lives, delaying the Axis invaders while reinforcements arrived. In cases like this you have to think strategically...

By the way, when we played the scenario it had the same outcome, with my single Flak Grenadier survivor one space away from the bridge, and we called it a victory for the Allies.
 
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K G
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the rulzs is da rulzs .

unless you create a house rule , PRIOR to game play , all official rules , including scenario rules , are in force .

so unless you and your wife agreed before the game that a "total destruction" rule negates the stated objective of the game , the allies won .

the problem is that we tend to think of a single game ,as the whole of the battle , instead of just a tiny little slice of the pie , a single scene of the movie .

imagine the 8 turns of the battle as a single scene , in terms of a campaign , thats exactly what it is . there were battle before it , and there are battle scenes after it , its all part of a continueing narative of the expansion .

now had they wiped you out before turn 8 , i would suggest continuing to play it out , even if one side is totally gone , just to see if they can move far enough to accomplish the objective within the time limit .
 
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Olivier Zamfirescu
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The Allies won this one. Their glorious sacrifice made possible the late arrival of much needed reinforcements.

Hope the whole family enjoyed the game!

Cheers,

Olivier.
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Andy Old_Skool_Jedi
England
Rayleigh
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Thanks for the posts everyone- I think that's pretty conclusive and will be striking that up as a victory for the Allies! My wife is a lawyer so I dont tend to win many arguments in my house! Thanks for your support in helping me win this one!

Am now looking forward to the next battle of the campaign Saturday night!
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