Ben Friedberg
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So, I am in the very vocal minority of people (perhaps just me?) that doesn't think that the second 'half' (really 4/5) of Galaxy Trucker is any fun. People talk to me about how funny it is when their ships get blown apart and all of that, and I'm like 'well... I GUESS...'. It just doesn't feel like I'm making DECISIONS. I'm getting punished (or rewarded) for the split-second decisions that I made at the beginning. My problem is that in the three games of GT I have played, each one has taken nearly 2 hours with about 10 TOTAL minutes of ship building. In my opinion, all of the fun of the 2nd half of GT was had by Vlaada Chvatil as he wrote the dang thing. I want a game that USES the ship that I built to do something FUN for the PLAYERS, not the designer.

(For anyone that has played Kingdom Hearts, I'm using the gummy ship minigame as an inspiration and indication of a light, fun activity using the thing that I have created).

So, my idea which I aim to flesh out in this thread is basically using the ship that has been constructed in the building phase to DICTATE the makeup of a deck of cards that will be used in a direct pvp dogfight between the players. So, phase 1: build your ship/deck with a time crunch, phase 2: duke it out in a last-man standing (or first to go out) dogfight.

Here are some initial thoughts:

- no need to make it 'spatial', positioning can be abstracted out
- # of crew members == playing hand size
- once a ship is built, each tile represents one card in your deck.
- lasers are the primary card you play on your turn (shooting at your opponents). Double lasers are two damage.
- playing an engine + a hull card equals one point of ramming damage
- the responses to a laser hit or ram can be: use engines to evade, deflect with shield (spend a battery), jettison all cargo of one color, jettison a crew member (and a card from your hand to reduce hand size), lose a card and a correlating ship card (ship destruction rules in process since the chain reaction thing needs to be handled).
- playing a cargo card allows the player to fill the corresponding cargo hold. (these cargo cubes are points at the end if we go with the game end condition of first person to be completely destroyed)


More to come when I'm not at work, but at this point, this sounds like a game that I would actually want to play.

What I would really appreciate from the community would be
a. dogfighting games that already implement things along these lines that I could steal mechanics from
b. reasons why this is a dumb idea
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Lacombe
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Suddenly a shot rang out! A door slammed. The maid screamed. Suddenly a pirate ship appeared on the horizon! While millions of people were starving, the king lived in luxury. Meanwhile, on a small farm in Kansas, a boy was growing up.
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Re: Making the second phase of Galaxy Trucker fun: A deckbuilding dogfighting game.
You're not supposed to be making any decisions in the second phase. It's just an elaborate mechanism for judging how well you did in the first phase.

Ideally, you'll be playing the game by the advanced rules where you get to look-ahead and 3/4 of the cards you'll see during the race, and prepare for them.

that said... your idea sounds like a very fun variant game.
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David Runkle
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Re: Making the second phase of Galaxy Trucker fun: A deckbuilding dogfighting game.
It seems a bit like you're trying to make a cow into a horse. Galaxy Truckers is all about making "split second decisions" and then seeing the (often comical) consequences there of. That's what it is. I can see how that might not be everyone's cup of tea - but a game doesn't have to be all things to everyone. The hypothetical game you sketch out actually sounds very similar to the upcoming game "Gunship:First Strike" - perhaps you should take a look at that?
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Ben Friedberg
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Re: Making the second phase of Galaxy Trucker fun: A deckbuilding dogfighting game.
I totally agree that I'm trying to change the game fundamentally. I'm going to change the title to making it fun FOR ME. Watching the results of my decisions for 4/5 of the game should not ever be a goal. If the timeline was reversed (ie: 4/5 of the game's worth of decisions plays out over 1/5 of the game) it would be acceptable. otherwise, I'm just playing through a simulation with varying levels of brutality.

this is definitely a variant and will (in all likelihood) change the decisions that are made in the first phase with this new phase in mind. I think my real motivation is that I find the concept of the first phase SO compelling, that I wanted to have a game that I enjoyed playing that makes use of it...

As an aside, I find that many games with these modular 'systems' could be used to implement OTHER games. For instance, taking the R4tG cards and laying them out in a grid to make a sci-fi adventure game or using the fruit bits from Finca to make a fruit-delivery dexterity / stacking game...
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Ben Friedberg
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Re: Making the second phase of Galaxy Trucker fun: A deckbuilding dogfighting game.
dapperdave wrote:
It seems a bit like you're trying to make a cow into a horse. Galaxy Truckers is all about making "split second decisions" and then seeing the (often comical) consequences there of. That's what it is. I can see how that might not be everyone's cup of tea - but a game doesn't have to be all things to everyone. The hypothetical game you sketch out actually sounds very similar to the upcoming game "Gunship:First Strike" - perhaps you should take a look at that?


I looked at gunship but I wasn't sure how variable the ship construction was. one of the things that I love about phase 1 of GT is that the ships come out COMPLETELY different every time...
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Ben Friedberg
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Re: Making the second phase of Galaxy Trucker fun: A deckbuilding dogfighting game.
NateStraight wrote:
You're not supposed to be making any decisions in the second phase. It's just an elaborate mechanism for judging how well you did in the first phase.

Ideally, you'll be playing the game by the advanced rules where you get to look-ahead and 3/4 of the cards you'll see during the race, and prepare for them.

that said... your idea sounds like a very fun variant game.


Nate, isn't that like having a 5 minute foot race and then analyzing the photo finish for 25 MINUTES to figure out who won? Feels that way to me...
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Lacombe
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Re: Making the second phase of Galaxy Trucker fun: A deckbuilding dogfighting game.
benfriedberg1981 wrote:
NateStraight wrote:
You're not supposed to be making any decisions in the second phase. It's just an elaborate mechanism for judging how well you did in the first phase.

Ideally, you'll be playing the game by the advanced rules where you get to look-ahead and 3/4 of the cards you'll see during the race, and prepare for them.

that said... your idea sounds like a very fun variant game.


Nate, isn't that like having a 5 minute foot race and then analyzing the photo finish for 25 MINUTES to figure out who won? Feels that way to me...


You really need to have one single person who is very familiar with the cards to manage the race phase of the game, handling all the distribution of goods / credits, rolling of dice, movement of tokens on the board, etc. If it falls to everyone to collectively flip over, discuss, look up, activate, resolve, etc every card, it's obviously going to take too long. I find the game flows relatively smoothly if someone who knows what they're doing handles the race phase, and the other players pay attention during the die rolls [really the only part they need to understand].
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Benjamin Bentley
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NateStraight wrote:
You're not supposed to be making any decisions in the second phase. It's just an elaborate mechanism for judging how well you did in the first phase.

Ideally, you'll be playing the game by the advanced rules where you get to look-ahead and 3/4 of the cards you'll see during the race, and prepare for them.

that said... your idea sounds like a very fun variant game.


There are a fair number of decisions to be made, usually regarding whether you should be using your batteries to pass a given event or save them.
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