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Subject: I want to support this very badly but... rss

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Sam London
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where are the rules!? To be frank I am shocked that they have managed to gather so much funding based on what I can only guess are production values alone. Is there some information that is putting backer's worries at ease that I am missing? I would really like to jump on this if I can (especially now that I could get Chuck Norris) but 100 bucks is a little steep for what could be an absolutely gorgeous unplayable game.
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Thiago Aranha
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AnotherHorrorFan wrote:
Is there some information that is putting backer's worries at ease that I am missing?

Well, yes. There's plenty of rules information on their websites' Designer Notes, plus the gameplay video and the breakdown someone on this forum made based on the rulebook pages glimpsed in the videos. With all the information released, I can attest that there is very little left in the rulebook that people have not seen one way or another.

I'm just about done translating the rulebook into portuguese, and I believe most of the other languages translations are on the same foot. With the final editing notes being added by the translators, I believe the final PDF can't be far from release.
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Sam London
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Hmm, I have not seen the designer notes so I will have to check those out. The gameplay video did leave me wanting though. Thanks for the tip.
 
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Geo
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People who pay $100 should have the rulebook available, instead of looking around to find videos and threads to figure out how the game plays.

For me the unavailability of a rulebook (even in semi-final form) is an indication that the game may not say much (from a gameplay standpoint).

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Thiago Aranha
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GeoMan wrote:
People who pay $100 should have the rulebook available, instead of looking around to find videos and threads to figure out how the game plays.

For me the unavailability of a rulebook (even in semi-final form) is an indication that the game may not say much (from a gameplay standpoint).

Or it's an indication that this is not a pre-sale, but a kickstarter project for a game that's still in the final stages of development.
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Sam London
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Well frankly even though I am swaying towards supporting now, I seriously disagree with that statement. I have supported a large number of kickstarter games at this point and have read rules that are black text on white paper. I am of course always aware that these are a work in progress but are just out there to give people an opportunity to see that there is meat in the project and that they are confident the game can sell itself. The biggest thing that disturbs me about this project is that even though many many people have requested seeing the rules they have not rushed to toss out a beta (or even alpha) version.
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Michael Jordal
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Some people that have backed it have played it at Cons like Adepticon.
 
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Sam London
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And I have heard that too, a lot. I would really have liked to have heard their actual opinions on the game though. Seeing as how I cannot know what their experience with the game was (they could have simply walked by and thought the setup looked promising), it is hard to make a 100+ dollar decision based on that.
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Alexis Perez
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The lack of rulebook this late is making me antsy as well. I backed it initially thinking some of that would come out as we went forward.

But now I'm thinking I'd be better off cancelling my pledge and waiting for the review. I'd much rather back projects that have demo'd or been tested like Tammany Hall or Ground Floor (Backing Both as well).

I agree the production is great but what about gameplay? I own some great games that don't have great production values but are good games....

Very nervous 3 days out.
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Sam London
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My point exactly. I was expecting a similar treatment to Zpocalypse, where I was very antsy until they released the rules at a pretty late stage. The fact that they have still made no mention of plans to release the rules, or even acknowledge people asking for them, makes me very nervous.
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Jason Cookingham
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I had a bad feeling when Miskatonic School for Girls looked very pretty, but hid the rules. I passed on that, and it looks as if that game isn't very good.

I am not going to support any game in Kickstarter unless the rules are posted, and/or reviewers I trust weigh in...

Examples, game play videos, and recollections from convention goers is not going to cut it. Period.

And if the game is still in development, then that is an more troublesome sign of their priorities-- I don't need pretty miniatures more than I want a good game.

I wish them luck. I hope the game is awesome. I am not going to gamble my money to find out because they are dangling pretty things on a string.
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JR Wr
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Personally im in on it.
I figure if nothing else im paying less than $1 a figure.
If the rules are not solid we tweak and have a slick game with sick minis.

Warhammer models are more than that. So im in.

My two cents.
 
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JR Wr
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Beyond the above, the base mechanics seem sound.
 
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Sam London
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In retort, I did back Miskatonic School for Girls. That was a game that had awesome looking components that I thought was going to be amazing just because it was pretty. No amount of "tweaking" will fix a completely broken or lackluster game. I am not saying this is broken or lackluster, and in fact I hope it isn't, but I do not need 100 bucks worth of zombie minis and I am not looking to gamble.
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Stephen G Roy
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For me playability is secondary. These minis are gorgeous and can be used in so many other games.
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Joshua Harris
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They have a video demonstrating a complete turn, right on the main page, and a large portion of the rules have been released via designer notes and pictures.

Besides...100+ well sculpted minis will be worth a "gamble" even if the game stinks. If you have use for the minis that is...
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Sam London
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We obviously are aware of the video and the designer notes, as they have been mentioned previously. The minis, as I have also said, are great if you want them, but I have no need for a hundred dollars worth of zombie minis. I am finding it increasingly odd how vehemently people are trying to encourage hesitant people to buy into this game without actually addressing or acknowledging their concerns. For those of you who have chosen to support the game, I sincerely hope it is a great production and I lament my missed opportunity and will have to hunt to get it later. For myself, and apparently others however, the asking price is a bit much when we cannot see the rules or even hear thoughts on the game that don't come from someone involved with it. My two cents...
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Robert Beachler
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Mister_Barista wrote:
For me playability is secondary. These minis are gorgeous and can be used in so many other games.


Not that I need more minis but I am right there with you as well my friend. The simple cost alone for such great looking minis is cheap as all get out. Granted it will take me a long time to paint them all.

For what it is worth I agree that not having the rules does annoy me but not so much as I would test them for myself but that others would and give me a review to go on.
 
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Bruno Gaia
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As you may have noticed two threads like this were launched before. One by me.
It's true thta the fact they didn't make the PDF of the rules is... strange BUT: we've gathered enough actual fact on these (the rules) to get a quite detailed view of the game.
It's going to be based on a few mechanincs (aka simple) replayability being assured by scenarios and card-driven spawning of zombies and discovery of equipement.
I'm into tough as nails euros and backed this EVEN after I had doubts on the actual gameplay AND notwistanding the fact that I don't need the minis if the game is crap because I think that the amount of info we gathered on it were sufficient.

To summarize:
1) sound mechanics and "I see I eat" mechanics for zombies meaning dumb zombies (always a good thing thematically)
2) get swarmed by number thrill (especially with the added figs from kickstarter)
2) special skills that you upgrade while you gain experience
3) easy to learn and manage rules that means you could very well play that with a group of your non-gaming friend (could be handy for me and mean I can stop playing Smallworld everytime I invite people, at last (this said, I LOVE smallworld!))

The designer answered me very early on the dice factor, sending me part of the game's stats to prove that luck wouldn't be too great an issue in the game.

Anyway, it's true that their NOT releasing the rules was a "faux pas". But that doesn't mean that the game is not good.
I don't know about Miskatonic School for Girl's rules but they very well could have released them and have a crap game hidden behind these (rules are not everything! components balance do much of the work in a game's mechanics!)
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Adam Souza
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Has it occured to anyone that they just might not care about the 20 guys on the internet holding out because they haven't seen the actual rulebook ?

At $311,319 PLEDGED OF $20,000 GOAL they don't need to jump through hoops to please anyone at this point.

There will be a copy of the rules at the Guillotine Games
http://guillotinegames.com/en/gamestuff

If your wondering why people are getting snappy, it could be because this is Nth thread complaining about this, on a forum full of people who have already agreed they want the game without seeing the official rulebook.

A quick search of existing threads would have shown this.

Before the internet we would just read the outside of the shiny box on a store shelf and make our decision based on that. We have video of game play, developers notes, a thread here detailing a tons of the rules, most of the scenarios, etc... Having to see the Official Rulebook seems like a form O.C.D. at this point.

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Adam Kazimierczak
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Hey at this point Zombie-(insert-suffix-here) will sell if the chrome is shiny enough. Who cares if he gameplay is like Candy Land? It's freaking zombies! With minis! And it's rated 10/10 on BGG! I don't see how anyone could pass that up...

When people are already rationalizing their support with statements about how the minis alone are worth it and that they don't care if the game is any good there is only one thing to do: run. Run fast. And don't look back.
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Stephen G Roy
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kaziam wrote:
Who cares if he gameplay is like Candy Land?


Heh heh Candy Land heh heh..
WITH ZOMBIES THAT EAT YOUR BRAAAAAAAAAAIIIIIIIIIINNNNNssssssssssssss!!!!
 
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Mike Russo
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kaziam wrote:
Hey at this point Zombie-(insert-suffix-here) will sell if the chrome is shiny enough. Who cares if he gameplay is like Candy Land? It's freaking zombies! With minis! And it's rated 10/10 on BGG! I don't see how anyone could pass that up...

When people are already rationalizing their support with statements about how the minis alone are worth it and that they don't care if the game is any good there is only one thing to do: run. Run fast. And don't look back.


Yeah because if people are backing it for reasons like that, that must mean the game is bad.
 
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Mike Russo
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Adam Souza wrote:
Having to see the Official Rulebook seems like a form O.C.D. at this point.


Exactly! At this point I think that if the official rules were out there people would start complaining that images of all the game tiles haven't been released.
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Stephen G Roy
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I was thinking that earlier actually...
 
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