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Mansions of Madness» Forums » Rules

Subject: 1st clue rss

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Robert Ruescher
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In the rule book it says that the last clue to be found is always clue 1, is this to mean that when the investigators find the clues out of order that whatever the last clue is, its just considered clue 1 for activating end game purposes? Sometimes things don't go perfectly and this brought up a few questions the other night in one of our sessions. The last clue found was actually clue 2 on the physical card.

Sorry if this is obvious, I think it is what I stated it as being, the last clue found regardless of number is considered clue 1 for end game triggering, etc.

Thanks and sorry if this is somewhere already, I searched and found no true answer.
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Maddock Krug
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Hi.

thebobymon wrote:
In the rule book it says that the last clue to be found is always clue 1, is this to mean that when the investigators find the clues out of order that whatever the last clue is, its just considered clue 1 for activating end game purposes? Sometimes things don't go perfectly and this brought up a few questions the other night in one of our sessions. The last clue found was actually clue 2 on the physical card.

Sorry if this is obvious, I think it is what I stated it as being, the last clue found regardless of number is considered clue 1 for end game triggering, etc.

Thanks and sorry if this is somewhere already, I searched and found no true answer.


Well, first of all: If the players/ investigators find clues out of order, then something has gone horribly wrong.

But just in case: Imagine, the clue #1 was found earlier then it was supposed to happen, then - according to the rules - the end-game starts.

But in general you go down the line from the highest to the lowest clue:
#3 > #2 > #1
#4 > #3 > #2 > #1
#5 > #4 > #3 > #2 > #1
...

Reason: At the lowest clue you find the right key to unlock the lock/ hindrances to the next clue ...So under normal circumstances you should not be able to get to clue #1, if you were not at clue #2; same for #2, if you were not at #3; and so on ...

All the best!
Mad
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Chris J Davis
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It's not possible to find the clues out of order. You must have set the game up wrong.
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Robert Ruescher
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OK TY I will review what happened
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S. R.
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Basically, what they have said is all there is to it.
You will always put the stack of cards in a room in exactly the order they are shown in the Seeding chart. First named card first, and all others on top of it, in order.
Which means that, in order to get to Clue 1, you first have to open Lock 1. However, to open Lock 1, you need Key 1, which will (usually) be hidden UNDER Clue 2, which is protected by Lock 2, which will be opened by Key 2, which is hidden under Clue 3, etc.

So there is a chain of clues that the investigators have to follow to reach the last Clue, which (up to now) is ALWAYS Clue 1.

The one exception is the PoD scenario "Season of the Witch", which basically has an optional clue. This clue (Clue 3) can be foregone, to get from the Clue before (Clue 4) to the Clue after (Clue 2). However, up to now (and not taking custom scenarios into account), this is the ONLY exception...

If the investigators where able to unearth Clues out of the chain order, you either have made mistakes in setting up the game, have put the cards down in the wrong order on the rooms, or made another mistake (which I cannot fathom). Be very careful and meticulous with the setup, as even one wrongly placed card can throw the game completely...
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Roberta Yang
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Also, even in "Season of the Witch", if you get Clue 2 before Clue 3, you lose the ability to get Clue 3 - so Clue 1 is still the last clue you'll be able to find.
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Jan Meyberg
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IMHO it's a pity that this game is quite linear sometimes... I uploaded my first user-made scenario yesterday (has still to be approved, and it's in German. Sorry!), which can be played not-so-very-linear (even if this need some strange decisions by the investigators). Thus it might be possible to find Clue 2 earlier than clue 3, what could make for strange incoherencies...
Grmph. Yesterday everything seemed to be so great and logical, and today I need to add some rules like "discard all clues with a higher number than the last clue found"...

Thank you all for the discussion! I'll try on some non-linear adventures later... (probably a story which recommends several artifacts or pieces of artifacts to be assembled? Who knows...)

Greetings, Jan Meyberg
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Roberta Yang
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meyberg wrote:
Thank you all for the discussion! I'll try on some non-linear adventures later... (probably a story which recommends several artifacts or pieces of artifacts to be assembled? Who knows...)


Check out Iammars' "Completing the Circle" - it sounds like precisely the sort of thing you're looking for.
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Nick Szegedi
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I understand about the clues.. what about Gloria's (?) Ability....
She has ability to look at any pile of clue cards... what if she uncovers
Clue 1 right off the bat (with a lucky guess of course)... do the
Investigators win if a specific scenario says the Investigators
win if they find clue 1. -SPOILER- (SILVER TABLET scenario)- SPOILER-
-
I would still think you would still have to uncover the other clues
To get the key or Whatever item is needed to open the door to
get to clue 1.

Which is correct? I would hate to have it that easy to win if someone
had been lucky with their guess!
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Roberta Yang
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Gloria Goldberg's ability merely lets you look at the cards in the room. It does not mean you have found those cards. It does not mean you have explored that room. It does not reveal the Objective if you read Clue 1, or fulfill the objective if you need to find Clue 1. In short, the only function it has is to give the investigators information; it has no mechanical effect.

That being said, if you're already familiar with the objectives in a scenario, reading Clue 1 will tell you which objective is being used, which is stupidly powerful. And the ability isn't really worth using otherwise, so overall it's a really horribly designed OPG.
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Nick Szegedi
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I understand that... but as I stated as a "Spoiler"... for the PnP
Of the Silver Tablet scenario... the keeper card says the investigator
Wins as soon as Clue 1 is found. I agree I think you should
have to go to the room and unlock it and get it.

I was just wondering how it was designed as far as that scenario
went... usually you get Clue 1 and you would have to perform
A task or something to win,. In this case it just says "investigators
win if they find clue 1".
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Roberta Yang
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As I said, it doesn't make you win that objective. You have to actually explore the room to find it. It never has any in-game effect. Ever.
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Nick Szegedi
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ok- let me approach it at another angle...

Let me ask you...

If you used her ability to "see" the cards and you locate the clue 1 card in that stack- didn't you "Find it" per se?

I know what you are saying and the funny thing is, I agree with you but, my brother is the one that needs to be convinced not me... but, seeing his view, I can really see it both ways! The card (and rule book for that matter) is wrong... it shouldn't just say find Clue 1... it should say find Clue 1 and retrieve the items in that stack, etc.

Don't you agree?
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Maddock Krug
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No, you did not find the clue, if you use her ability. Period.
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Chris J Davis
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holywolfman wrote:
ok- let me approach it at another angle...

Let me ask you...

If you used her ability to "see" the cards and you locate the clue 1 card in that stack- didn't you "Find it" per se?


No, no, no. You looked at it. That is all.

Quote:
I know what you are saying and the funny thing is, I agree with you but, my brother is the one that needs to be convinced not me... but, seeing his view, I can really see it both ways! The card (and rule book for that matter) is wrong... it shouldn't just say find Clue 1... it should say find Clue 1 and retrieve the items in that stack, etc.

Don't you agree?


Your question has been answered about five times now.
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Roberta Yang
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I have run out of ways to say, "No, her OPG does not win the game." No, it does not win you the game. It does not reveal the objective. It does not leave the cards in that room face-up. It does not destroy any Locks and Obstacles that are over them. It does not trigger any Traps it finds. It does not count as a found clue for the purpose of effects like Test Theories. You return the clue card to the room instead of claiming it like actual found clues. The game continues unaffected in every mechanical sense. I don't think anything that has been said so far is even remotely ambiguous and cannot fathom why you are still asking.

Also, Silver Tablet sucks.
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