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Subject: Can a fleet and an army be in spain at the same time? (and other questions) rss

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David Folksman
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As per the rules and coastal provinces..

The Fleet,
is considered to be occupying the entire province. Such a Fleet
should be placed on the coastline rather than completely inland.
For example, a Fleet at Spain’s North Coast can’t be ordered to move
to the Western Mediterranean or to the Gulf of Lyon or to Marseilles.
It is, however, considered to be occupying all of Spain.

So my question is, can a fleet occupy a coast of spain and an army be in spain at the same time?

THis applies to all coastal provinces I guess, for example st petersberg

Also, can you move directly from Spains north coast to south coast?

my last question is, why is there a rule that states two of your units cannot swap positions directly.

eg

Spain (sc) MOVE Portugal
- Portugal MOVE Spain (nc)
will fail because the two units would be swapping territories, even though the coasts make it look like they are not moving through each other.

thanks

thanks
 
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M. B. Downey
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Re: Can a fleet and an army be in spain at the same time?
No. Only one unit can be in a province.
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David Folksman
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thanks for the quick reply, I added some more questions
 
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M. B. Downey
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No, you cannot move from Spain SC to Spain NC with a fleet. They are not adjacent. Portugal is in the way. That is why there are two different coasts.

There is a rule that says you cannot have two units swapping directly because you cannot swap directly. You cannot have an army in Gascony move to Brest and a fleet in Brest move to Gascony, they would bounce. You could use a fleet in MAO to convoy the army in Gascony to Brest and move the Fleet in Brest to Gascony.

The example you use is not a valid move because the fleet in Spain is occupying all of Spain. The NC and SC are not discrete locations, it just limits which territories it can go to, but not which locations the fleet in Portugal can go to. So a fleet in Spain SC is still in all of Spain, so the Fleet in Portugal cannot move there. They are technically trading places. You would have to use MAO to resolve it.

Just don't think of the coasts as separate spaces and you're fine.
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David Folksman
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thanks again
 
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Randall Bart
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What part of "occupying the entire province" don't you understand?
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Edward Rustin
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Barticus88 wrote:
What part of "occupying the entire province" don't you understand?


There's no need to be an arse.
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David Folksman
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Barticus88 wrote:
What part of "occupying the entire province" don't you understand?


Hi Randall,

I apologise for the silly questions, i'm just attempting to learn the game. It just seemed a bit illogical to me ( a long time Axis and Allies player) that a fleet and an army could not co-inhabit the coast and the main land mass of Spain. I was attempting to make doubley sure I was incorrect in my assumptions, which as you pointed out, were indeed false.
 
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Matt Shields
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DaveyF wrote:
Barticus88 wrote:
What part of "occupying the entire province" don't you understand?


Hi Randall,

I apologize for the silly questions, I'm just attempting to learn the game. It just seemed a bit illogical to me ( a long time Axis and Allies player) that a fleet and an army could not co-inhabit the coast and the main land mass of Spain. I was attempting to make doubly sure I was incorrect in my assumptions, which as you pointed out, were indeed false.


Don't mind him. That's just Randall...

But yeah, it sounds like you're getting it. Only one unit per province, and regardless of how many coasts someplace has it's always just one "province", so you can never have two units there.

Since there's an explicit rule against two units in adjacent provinces trading places, orders like "Bulgaria/east coast -> Constantinople; Con -> Bulgaria/south" will result in both units bouncing - even though intuitively it seems like the units aren't really trading "places".

If I could offer a small bit of advice - you'll be happier not thinking of Diplomacy as a war game like A&A. It's really not much of a war game in the sense that it doesn't even really try to simulate military combat. It's really more of a multi-player strategy game that happens to be played on a map.
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David Folksman
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Cheers for your insight, i'll take your comments on board
 
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harryj potter
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I think this is the right place to settle a discussion ive had with my father for ages.

The discussion is about the first turn move of the Saint Petersburg fleet.
I think that your aloud to move from Saint Petersburg directly to Norway but my father says your not.

The main point in the discussion is the question where the fleet at the beginning of the game is placed. My opinion is that the fleet is placed at a non specified spot on the land because the rules just say Saint Petersburg (f) but my father says intiutively that the fleet is placed at the west coast adjacent to the Bothnic gulf.

What to you think about this. If i'm right it would be a good starting you can follow with an attack on Sweden getting two extra units the next year.
 
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M. B. Downey
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You are wrong. It specifically starts not on the North Coast. It cannot go to Norway.
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Edward Rustin
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Harrypj wrote:
The discussion is about the first turn move of the Saint Petersburg fleet.
I think that your aloud to move from Saint Petersburg directly to Norway but my father says your not.


The rulebook is explicit about the starting location of all the units and says "F St. Petersburg (SC)". That's according to both the most recent rulebook, and the original 1959, so there's definitely no room for doubt there!

1959 Rulebook
Current Rulebook
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harryj potter
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Thank you all.
 
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Edward Rustin
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Harrypj wrote:
Thank you all.


No worries, and welcome to the geek
 
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