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Subject: Ogre re-print pre-Order $69.99 A $30 savings off the Kickstarter version... rss

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For those of you that missed the Kickstarter version, or couldn't quite bring themselves to pull the trigger at $100+ (myself included), here's a 2nd chance. From what I can tell, the only real difference between this and the Kickstarter version are 2 counter sheets. A $150+ commitment would have gained you a pocket Ogre game that will eventually sell for less than $10 anyway.

I find it interesting that despite assurances that they would barely make a profit on the game due to the supposedly astronomical manufacturing costs, a middleman is able to sell the game for $30 less and yet they are both still able to earn a profit.

Regardless, this seems like a good deal and I'm in for one

http://www.coolstuffinc.com/p/Board%20Games/Ogre%3A+Designer...:%20Designer%27s%20Edition

Edit: The price keeps dropping... Miniature Market has it for $65 http://www.miniaturemarket.com/sjg1977.html

Edit #2: Cardhaus has it for $75 and offers 5% off for pre-orders http://www.cardhaus.com/catalog/board_games/ogre/229250

Edit #3: Best price so far, Boards & Bits has it for $64 http://www.boardsandbits.com/product_info.php?products_id=23...
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Mike Malley
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The KS edition has three extra sheets, and getting the game earlier is a definite draw for some people. That's a bigger discount than i expected to see, though to get free shipping you do have to end up spending $100. Granted, you're getting something for it, but if you don't have $100, you don't have $100. Still though, i'm pretty sure the official line is closer to "this game won't earn us anywhere near the profit anything else would", and not "we'll be lucky to afford McD's by the time we're through".
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Frank M.
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Grossing nearly a million dollars up front for several thousand copies of the game sounds like the deal of a lifetime to me. (I KSed it @ $100)

I wonder how many people ordered extra copies expecting to sell them for a lot more when the game sells out? I'm also wondering if/when that will happen.

Sure hope I like the game... blush
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skifreak737 wrote:
I wonder how many people ordered extra copies expecting to sell them for a lot more when the game sells out? I'm also wondering if/when that will happen.



I'm kind of expecting to see this on Tanga eventually to be honest. I bet they end up printing a LOT more copies than the number of games pre-ordered through Kickstarter.
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Boogalou wrote:
I'm kind of expecting to see this on Tanga eventually to be honest. I bet they end up printing a LOT more copies than the number of games pre-ordered through Kickstarter.

Are you saying that not everything someone posts on-line is true? I am just shocked. Okay, not that shocked.
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To be honest, the three token sheets would've cost $24 (you could order additionals through kickstarter).

But I agree, this seems like a large discount. Also, retailers could buy a package that gave them 4 games at $75 a piece (making margins only a meager 25%). So how/where is CoolStuff getting these copies? And are we even sure these aren't the kickstarter edition?

It will be interesting to see what happens with this. If this game will be available for much cheaper than on kickstarter, it will probably be the last SJ game I've kickstarted, and I suspect I'm not the only one. So they are killing their own cash cow if that's how it works.
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Nathan Ehlers
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FWIW...Cool Stuff tends to be pretty bad with their preorder system. Not saying they won't eventually get the game, but I'd be surprised if it shows up anywhere close to November.

I think the general idea, when the KS started was that SJG didn't think there was as much support for Ogre as there ended up being. Their thought was if they could scrounge up the cash to print a few hundred copies then they could probably break even on the whole project between both front and backend costs and end up with making a really cool game. But the golden rule of manufacturing is the more you make, the less they cost. So since they ended up with thousands presold through KS at the original price, they certainly had enough buying power and liquidity to print hundreds or thousands beyond those already sold to put into store fronts at a cost that is lower than originally projected (since it was tied to the moving a couple hundred units projection).

Now, I will highlight that SJGs has made a big deal out of supporting Brick and Mortar stores, so if in fact all the OLGSs end up having the game at a huge savings compared to Brick and Mortar, it'll be a statement on how much SJGs really puts it's money where it's mouth is. But again, that's a big IF and we won't know about that till the end of the year. This certainly wouldn't be the first time a store took a bunch of preorders and never got the product to fill them.
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sirgalin wrote:
But the golden rule of manufacturing is the more you make, the less they cost. So since they ended up with thousands presold through KS at the original price, they certainly had enough buying power and liquidity to print hundreds or thousands beyond those already sold


This highlights the difference between games like D-Day Dice and Ogre. As D-Day Dice grew more profitable, they provided more VERY generous stretch rewards.

Ogre on the other hand instead provided us with more ways to give them more money, spend $150+ for a pocket Ogre, you can now buy Car Wars soon, buy more counter sheets, etc.. The stretch rewards were sad in comparison. But then again, these are the guys that spam stores with Munchkin.
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Aaron Silverman
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$100 is MSRP. 30% off is a pretty standard preorder discount for online retailers like Coolstuff.

I'd like to say that I was surprised that SJG didn't seem to get the concept of a stretch goal, but I'm not.
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Adam Chance
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"barely make a profit" thats Steve Jackson for "nowhere near munchkin profit levels"
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Try as hard as you like, you won't make me regret spending $150 on the Ogre reprint.
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Todd Walden
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UndeadViking wrote:
Try as hard as you like, you won't make me regret spending $150 on the Ogre reprint.


That's as may be, but I don't think it changes the fact that this is a bit.... questionable.
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JesterPoet wrote:
UndeadViking wrote:
Try as hard as you like, you won't make me regret spending $150 on the Ogre reprint.


That's as may be, but I don't think it changes the fact that this is a bit.... questionable.


Sure, but my comment was more towards the OP trying to downplay my expenditure as I was only getting a few counter sheets and a cheap version of pocket Ogre for my money.

That is not, in fact all the swag I am getting...but even beyond the "extras" that may or may not be monetarily worth my money, I am actually quite pleased at the fact that I contributed towards getting one of my favorite games of my youth reprinted in a deluxe format, and I am even MORE pleased that I helped convince them reprint Car Wars, one of my all time favorites.

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UndeadViking wrote:
I am actually quite pleased at the fact that I contributed towards getting one of my favorite games of my youth reprinted in a deluxe format, and I am even MORE pleased that I helped convince them reprint Car Wars, one of my all time favorites.


THAT is a great point.

Its hard to remember that when I contribute to a Kickstarter project, am not buying something in the strictest sense. The words pledge and contribution are used quite a bit on the site for a reason.

When I pledge financial support to a Kickstarter project, I am almost always doing it for the reward. But I could see cases where I would contribute an amount for a reward I don't care about (the "main" product, plus a t-shirt/coaster/stickers/poster) because I want to help the company - I want to show the company that I appreciate what they do, and want to see more from them.

A personal example would be that for me, everytime a BioWare game came out, I would be more than happy to pay $100 for it, just because I want to make sure I do my part to keep them in business.


So actually, I guess what I'm saying is that you guys suck. You completed the circle by over funding a game that was funded by Munchkin, and now those overfunds are going to be used for more Munchkin.
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jobin13 wrote:
So actually, I guess what I'm saying is that you guys suck rule. You completed the circle by over funding a game that was funded by Munchkin, and now those overfunds are going to be used for more Munchkin Car Wars.


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RobertDD wrote:
...this seems like a large discount. Also, retailers could buy a package that gave them 4 games at $75 a piece (making margins only a meager 25%). So how/where is CoolStuff getting these copies? And are we even sure these aren't the kickstarter edition?


I'd be willing to bet that CoolStuffs pricing is based on their normal wholesaler to retailer price breaks, not the kickstarter buy-in.

RobertDD wrote:
...It will be interesting to see what happens with this. If this game will be available for much cheaper than on kickstarter, it will probably be the last SJ game I've kickstarted, and I suspect I'm not the only one. So they are killing their own cash cow if that's how it works.


I agree with you here, in part. At the same time, I often feel that mathtrades are filled with kickstarter copies of games for quite a while after the games are delivered. Is this due to a buyers remorse? A quick devaluing of the game? Or just people buying into games that they have not played and once in-hand deciding that it really isn't to their taste?

Regardless, I won't be upset that I bought into Ogre, I enjoyed before and haven't played it in years.
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UndeadViking wrote:
Try as hard as you like, you won't make me regret spending $150 on the Ogre reprint.


Come on Lance, take off those rose-colored glasses and put down the SJG kool-aid.

I had Ogre as a kid as well and liked it. But that little game was quickly set-aside for better more interesting games (some from SJG). Nicer components and updated rules don't hide the fact that this is just a little SJG micro-game at heart. I was stunned at the KS success for the new version, but I think many of us are just trying to recapture that childhood glee at playing Ogre for the first time. I think many folks will be disappointed and will be looking to sell after a play or two. Hopefully I'm wrong.
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Poor Lickstarter non-funders. They hate when other people spend their own money.

Don't you know they are trying to make the world more pure by ridding us of Kickstarter. We should bless their little hearts.
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Good psycho-analysis. You seem poised to overtake the world of therapy. Bonus points for you.

FezAZ wrote:
UndeadViking wrote:
Try as hard as you like, you won't make me regret spending $150 on the Ogre reprint.


Come on Lance, take off those rose-colored glasses and put down the SJG kool-aid.

I had Ogre as a kid as well and liked it. But that little game was quickly set-aside for better more interesting games (some from SJG). Nicer components and updated rules don't hide the fact that this is just a little SJG micro-game at heart. I was stunned at the KS success for the new version, but I think many of us are just trying to recapture that childhood glee at playing Ogre for the first time. I think many folks will be disappointed and will be looking to sell after a play or two. Hopefully I'm wrong.
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Hey, look at it this way. Supporting Ogre at $100 was actually a value of $300 (as reported by various BGG posters)

So really, those getting the pre-order are just saving $230 instead of $200... only a 10% difference from the total value!
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FezAZ wrote:
UndeadViking wrote:
Try as hard as you like, you won't make me regret spending $150 on the Ogre reprint.


Come on Lance, take off those rose-colored glasses and put down the SJG kool-aid.

I had Ogre as a kid as well and liked it. But that little game was quickly set-aside for better more interesting games (some from SJG). Nicer components and updated rules don't hide the fact that this is just a little SJG micro-game at heart. I was stunned at the KS success for the new version, but I think many of us are just trying to recapture that childhood glee at playing Ogre for the first time. I think many folks will be disappointed and will be looking to sell after a play or two. Hopefully I'm wrong.


While I will fully admit that I owe tons of my early gaming enjoyment in my life to Steve Jackson and crew, nothing they have produced recently (other than Revolution!) has really excited me in any way. Maybe I am looking back at my teenage years with a little more fondness that is warranted, but I used to play Ogre with my buddy Jason every day after school for about a month straight, and I can assure you, the two of us will be doing it again the moment I get this sucker in the mail. Hard to put a price tag on that, at least for me.
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Nope. Can't argue with you on that.
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Boogalou wrote:
sirgalin wrote:
But the golden rule of manufacturing is the more you make, the less they cost. So since they ended up with thousands presold through KS at the original price, they certainly had enough buying power and liquidity to print hundreds or thousands beyond those already sold


This highlights the difference between games like D-Day Dice and Ogre. As D-Day Dice grew more profitable, they provided more VERY generous stretch rewards.

Ogre on the other hand instead provided us with more ways to give them more money, spend $150+ for a pocket Ogre, you can now buy Car Wars soon, buy more counter sheets, etc.. The stretch rewards were sad in comparison. But then again, these are the guys that spam stores with Munchkin.


So true and the reason I eventually pulled out of this.

GOAL REACHED! we'll now have an expansion in 2013....
GOAL REACHED We will start interviewing for a full-time Ogre line editor in the Austin office....
GOAL REACHED We will do some kind of special launch event in Austin....

It became a joke.

Back up plan in gear..pick it up cheaper somewhere else.
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My .02, I think both consumers are going to get a good value. After really thinking about it, I couldn't kickstart a 100 dollar game that I was so unsure I would enjoy. I have never played Ogre and really question how much it would see the table. Figuring it would be cheaper (but less full of cool bits) later, seemed like the right choice for me.

Backers also got their value worth. They get to back a game that some of them feel an emotional attachment to. That is wonderful. In addition, they get a bunch of goodies that I will likely never have. Those two factors are worth a great deal more than 30 dollars to some people so they also got a great bargain.

I think the multi-faceted distribution (kickstarter and distributor) was inevitable for this game due to it's popularity and I'm glad to see it actually working as well as it is.

I, for one, hope everyone who kickstarted it feels great about their purchase and enjoy the game immensely.
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sirgalin wrote:
FWIW...Cool Stuff tends to be pretty bad with their preorder system. Not saying they won't eventually get the game, but I'd be surprised if it shows up anywhere close to November.
Really? I've spent quite a lot at CSI over the years, much of it on preorder items, and have always gotten them in very close to the release date.
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