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Subject: Lending resources you do not have rss

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Torsten Hasforth
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I assume, that I can promise to lend a resource even though at the start of the turn such transfer would not be possible. In anticipation of being able to do so at the end of the turn.

Thanks in advance.

T.
 
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Jesper Noget
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The situation is that Damascus and hence Syria is controlled by FF, but the railway leading into Syria (Allepo) is controlled by Axis troops. So can the FF lend the oil from Iraq to CW, whom then stores it in e.g. Kuwait at the end of the turn?

Also a thx in advance from the other side of the Syrian skirmish.
 
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Torsten Hasforth
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:-) Not quite. My question is actually as stated.

In our group we agreed, that I can not lend an oil resource received from a trade agreement, but will have to store it first in a town/port.(Q5.0-4 from the FAQ), but now its unclear to me whether I could lend it on in the same turn. Which would seem to be the conclusion from Q5.0-1 in the FAQ.


They may be transported as either the giver's or recipient's resources and/or build points at the giver's discretion, until they arrive in any city or major port controlled by the recipient that they can be
transported to, at which point they become the recipient's (if not already)


T.
 
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Steve Fowler
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You can state to lend any amount.
Res and BPs from trade agreements cannot be lent.
You must fulfill any lend possible using the priority of your choice (if there is a choice).
The amount of lent Res or BP not shipped cannot be used by the lender.
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Jesper Noget
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Fargofootball wrote:
Res and BPs from trade agreements cannot be lent.


I guess that answers the question whether the Iraqi oil can be lend by the FF to CW.

See also Q5.0-4 in the FAQ. It is basically the same problem, just swap Persia with Iraq, CW with FF and Russia with CW.
 
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Torsten Hasforth
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Steve - a rules reference would be nice. To assuage my trepidation.

Unfortunately FAQ Q5.0-4 has one word, that opens for an alternative interpretation.

Can the CW directly Lend Lease to Russia the Persian oil it's receiving? - No, only oil it controls.

If it wasn't for directly I would agree the answer precludes transferring Persian oil to Russia, but what if that oil is first shipped [for the sake of argument] to an allied controlled Beirut and then railed to Russia?

In this way the resources go indirectly to Russia. Since from FAQ Q5.0-1 I learnt that when they [the resources] arrive in any city or major port controlled by the recipient that they can be transported to, [...] they become the recipient's (if not already).

(And why it has to be a major port and not just a port raises a whole new question - but no need to go there)
 
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Jesper Noget
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My interpretation on the Persian oil:

CW can place two CPs in persian gulf. They use one for transporting the oil from Persia til Kuwait. If they have en oil from a previous turn there, they can use the other CP to transport that oil from Kuwait to Persia and onwards to Russia. That way they circumvent the "directly", since its not the same oil that is shipped directly from Persia to Russia.

In the case of Iraqi oil:

Controller of Syria transports the oil from Iraq to Syria (a city or Beirut port). Then they take another oil from a previous turn and transport that oil to a city or port controlled by the recipient of the lending. That oil now becomes the recipients and can be transported onwards or stored. Again they circumvent the "directly" by using a stored oil.

In both cases, if they haven't stored any oil, then they have to wait one turn until they have oil stored.

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Wendell
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You cannot specify which resource you lend - you just commit to giving X resources and you have to do so. But if you commit to give one oil to the Soviets and then capture that Persian oil that turn, you could make it the oil you give (assuming it can go by rail thru Allied-control spaces, etc). And correct - you can only lend oil you OWN, not oil that is coming to you by a trade pact.

And in the example Jesper gave, no France couldn't lend-lease the Iraq oil to CW. It is IRAQI oil not (Free) French, so it isn't FF's to give away.

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Steve Fowler
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You dont control the oil Persia does.
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Jesper Noget
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But now the question arise, can you lend stockpiled resources to a fellow MP?

Do CW control any oil them self? Arent all their oil from trade agreements? If so they cannot lend oil at all in the game or at least until they conquer some oil fields.

 
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Wendell
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Pectin wrote:
But now the question arise, can you lend stockpiled resources to a fellow MP?

Do CW control any oil them self? Arent all their oil from trade agreements? If so they cannot lend oil at all in the game or at least until they conquer some oil fields.



CW has oilfields in Canada, Burma, and British Guyana (Port of Spain if using America in Flames map), so those can certainly be given away.

And yes you can lend stockpiled resources.
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Jesper Noget
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So you can lend stockpiled resources, meaning you could do the two CP in persian gulf set up. Hereby you could lend the persian oil to Russia. Or you could as FF in the Syria case, stockpile the iraqi oil somewhere and then lend it away the turn after.

Then the "directly" issue raised by Torstenis also solved.

Thanks for taking the discussion with us noobs.
 
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Steve Fowler
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wifwendell wrote:
Pectin wrote:
But now the question arise, can you lend stockpiled resources to a fellow MP?

Do CW control any oil them self? Arent all their oil from trade agreements? If so they cannot lend oil at all in the game or at least until they conquer some oil fields.



CW has oilfields in Canada, Burma, and British Guyana (Port of Spain if using America in Flames map), so those can certainly be given away.

And yes you can lend stockpiled resources.


You mean only saved oil, correct? I didn't know you could stockpile resources.
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Wendell
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Fargofootball wrote:
wifwendell wrote:
Pectin wrote:
But now the question arise, can you lend stockpiled resources to a fellow MP?

Do CW control any oil them self? Arent all their oil from trade agreements? If so they cannot lend oil at all in the game or at least until they conquer some oil fields.



CW has oilfields in Canada, Burma, and British Guyana (Port of Spain if using America in Flames map), so those can certainly be given away.

And yes you can lend stockpiled resources.


You mean only saved oil, correct? I didn't know you could stockpile resources.


Right, stockpiled oil.
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