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Subject: Using the Copy card with the Exchange cards rss

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Richard Hirschman
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I don't know if I'm confusing myself so I thought I would check this out. Could you please tell me if these two examples are correct.

1) Using the Copy card with the 1x Exchange card:
The player first could use the 1x Exchange card's special ability to exchange another drawn card or, of course, he could choose not to use the card's special ability. In either case, he could then copy the 1x Exchange card's special ability and then use that copied ability immediately or later in the fight. With that copied special ability (1x Exchange), he could then exchange the original 1x Exchange card (whose special ability has already been used) for the top card of the Robinson stack.

2) Using the Copy card with the 2x Exchange card:
The player could use or not use the 2x Exchange card's special ability to exchange two other drawn cards. In either case, he could then copy the 2x Exchange card's special ability and then use that copied ability immediately or later in the fight. With that copied 2x Exchange ability, he could then exchange the original 2x Exchange card (whose special ability has already been used) as one of the two cards to be exchanged with cards from the top of the Robinson stack.

Thanks.
Richard
 
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Sebastian
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Yes, both examples are correct. You can exchange cards you already used or you already copied.
 
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Pedro Pereira
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rich10 wrote:
1) Using the Copy card with the 1x Exchange card:
The player first could use the 1x Exchange card's special ability to exchange another drawn card or, of course, he could choose not to use the card's special ability. In either case, he could then copy the 1x Exchange card's special ability and then use that copied ability immediately or later in the fight. With that copied special ability (1x Exchange), he could then exchange the original 1x Exchange card (whose special ability has already been used) for the top card of the Robinson stack.


Yes

rich10 wrote:
2) Using the Copy card with the 2x Exchange card:
The player could use or not use the 2x Exchange card's special ability to exchange two other drawn cards. In either case, he could then copy the 2x Exchange card's special ability and then use that copied ability immediately or later in the fight. With that copied 2x Exchange ability, he could then exchange the original 2x Exchange card (whose special ability has already been used) as one of the two cards to be exchanged with cards from the top of the Robinson stack.


Yes

Both are correct, I just scratched the "or later" because copying is not "keeping" the ability but using the ability of another card.
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Henning Kröpke
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Pedrator wrote:

Both are correct, I just scratched the "or later" because copying is not "keeping" the ability but using the ability of another card.


Pedro's answer is correct. You cannot use an action "later".

Henning
(2F-Spiele)
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Richard Hirschman
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Thanks for all your responses.

Just to be sure I understand: In the instructions it states that when you copy a special ability of another card, that special ability can be used "again" (no time sequence mentioned). So, I assumed that meant that the copy of the special ability could be used anytime during the fight, just like other special abilities, assuming the original special ability (that was copied) had already been used in the fight. But that doesn't seem to be the case.

Example: Let's say I copy the special ability "1x destroy" that is on one of the other drawn cards.

1) The copied special ability (1x destroy) has to be immediately used as soon as the original special ability (on the card) is played. Correct?

2) As soon as I use the special ability "copy" to copy the 1x destroy ability, do I then have to immediately use the special ability of the original card that has the 1x destroy on it and then use the copy of 1x destroy immediately after that?

3) After I copy the 1x destroy special ability, can I wait to use the original 1x destroy ability for later in the fight and then whenever I use it, I have to immediately use the copied 1x destroy ability?

It's all still a bit confusing to me.
Thanks again.
Riohard
 
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rich10 wrote:
1) The copied special ability (1x destroy) has to be immediately used as soon as the original special ability (on the card) is played. Correct?

No

rich10 wrote:
2) As soon as I use the special ability "copy" to copy the 1x destroy ability, do I then have to immediately use the special ability of the original card that has the 1x destroy on it and then use the copy of 1x destroy immediately after that?

No

rich10 wrote:
3) After I copy the 1x destroy special ability, can I wait to use the original 1x destroy ability for later in the fight and then whenever I use it, I have to immediately use the copied 1x destroy ability?

No

I'll try to explain the best course of action in managing the way you use actions.

When you decide to use an action, you tilt the card 90º to indicate that you just used its action.

Your problem is in interpreting the Copy 1 Action special action. Let's take the Destroy 1 Card action, you want to destroy any one card on your tableau, so you turn the card with that special action (destroy 1 card) 90º to indicate that you are just using it, and now you flip over the card you want destroyed.

The same thing happens with the "copy-cat". At any time during the fight, you want to copy any special ability, so you turn the "copy-cat" 90º chose any one available special action and execute it instantly. Later on, you can still use the card you copied from, but it's totally independent from the copy-cat card.

It's important to understand that the copy-cat does not trigger any other card, you just use its special ability as if it was any of the other currently available, and when you use it, you turn the card 90º so you know that you used the copy special action.

Hope this was clear enough not to make it even more confusing!
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Sebastian
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I think you are confused because of the crossing "or later in the fight".

When I explain the crossing the rest might be clear:

You have any spacial card with a special ability. This special ability you want to copy - so far so good. You can copy this ability whenenver you want, even when you used this ability already. BUT you can only copy an ability of a card that is still open!
The copy-card can not HOLD the special ability. Example: You have a special ability you want to copy, but the card you want to copy should even be destroyed. You can NOT copy this ability destroy the source card and use the copied ability later in the fight. So you have to hold the card till you can use the copied ability and destroy it after the copy action.
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Pedro Pereira
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sneuhauss wrote:
You can NOT copy this ability destroy the source card and use the copied ability later in the fight.


This can cause some further confusion! It should read:

You CAN copy the original's ability, then destroy the original without using its ability and you won't be able to use it once it's destroyed!

What you cannot do is destroying the original (so you flip it face down) and then copy the destroyed's cart ability!

Obviously Richard had a bit of a difficulty in regards of timing, and was somewhat confused about when to use abilities and the copy-cat's relation to the original card.

The only special effect that takes effect only "later" is the double strength card. So if you were to use it on a 4, so to obtain an 8, the 4 only is worth 8 once you declare the fight as finished, so you can not double the value, then exchange the card that triggers this ability, since you would then no more be able to double the 4.

Any other card's special action takes effect instantly, and you have to read the text "Copy any 1 special action" as the text of the special action you want to use. Let me give a practical example.

I'm fighting a card that has strength 9 and I can draw 5 cards:

My plateau:

0 - +2 cards
0 - +2 life
4 - no special effect
2 - no special effect
1 - no special effect


my current strength is 7

I tilt the +2 cards and draw:

0 - copy a special action
1 - +1 life

I am now at strength 8 and need one more!

before anything else I decide to get 3 more lives, so I turn (90º) the 0 - +2 life and the 1 - +1 life cards

Now, I still have the copy card and I can decide to use it to get:
+1 life
or
+2 lifes
or
+2 cards

I could get 2 more lives and use one of those lives to buy one extra card or I could buy 2 more cards (getting just one more life would be stupid)

I decide to copy the +2 lives ability, so I turn the copy card and mentally declare: I'm copying the +2 lives ability!

I add 2 lives to my stock and now return 1 in exchange for a new card!

It's a 3 - rearrange the top 3 cards

Before declaring that the fight is over (with strength 11 vs 9) I decide to turn this new card, have a look at the top 3, discard one of those I think is worthless and put the other two back on top of the draw deck.

I now declare the fight as over and in all gained 4 lives and a new card!


Hope this helped!
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Richard Hirschman
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The responses are very clear and helpful. Thanks.

Maybe it's just me, but there was no way I could deduce how the copy card actually worked from the brief line about it in the instructions. As I wrote earlier in the thread, in the instructions it states that when you copy a special ability of another card, that special ability can be used "again" (no time sequence mentioned). So, without any other guidance in the instructions about how the copy of a special ability works, I assumed that the copy obeyed the rules of the special abilities actually on the cards - they could be used anytime during a fight. That logic led me down the wrong road.

I also appreciate the elaboration of related mechanisms and examples in the responses.

I bet it would be helpful to others if the information in this thread is included in the instructions for the next edition of the game.

Thanks again for your time.
Richard
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