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A Game of Thrones: The Card Game» Forums » Rules

Subject: Intimidate + plot card timing rss

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Det var bara en hake...
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Another couple of questions:

1. In the rulebook, the rules for Intimidate say that "characters with a lower STR", with no additional qualification, do not count their STR for that challenge. Does this include characters on the same side as the Intimidate character? As written it would seem it does, but it seems slightly counterintuitive.

2. I have Victarion Greyjoy and Longship Iron Victory in play and when revealing my next plot card they'll give me my 15th power. My opponent's only chance of stopping this is playing the Valar Morghulis plot card. According to the phase diagram in the FAQ, revealing cards is step 1 in the phase and actually resolving the plot card effects is step 4. Is it correct that Victarion's ability will resolve as a passive effect and end the game before Valar Morghulis can kill off any of the characters with power tokens?
 
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Eder Monaco
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1. Yes it includes characters on your side. As you can see from the definition it doesn't make any distinction between characters you control or opponent's so intimidate affects all characters in play.

2. Victarion would die before he gets the power token because his ability is a Response and not a passive ability. Responses are resolved during step 5 after passive abilities. But beware that even if his ability was a passive ability he would still die before he gets the chance to get the power token because when revealed effects of plots are resolved as last event of the framework action window. Only once you have resolved all the framework events you can start with step 4 of the framework action window (resolve passive abilities).
Although because of the moribund state, victarion is still considered in play and will only leave play during step 6 so he still gets his chance to resolve his response and thus ending the game. The only way your opponent can prevent this is by canceling his response or by somehow blanking Victarion's text in the pre-plot action window.
If you still have any doubts you could check out this article:
http://www.cardgamedb.com/index.php/index.html/_/game-of-thr...

EDIT: the number 4 you see beside the "When revealed plot effect resolve" in the plot phase window is just there to indicate that is the 4th event that happens in the 1-3 steps of the framework action window displayed on the previous page.
 
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Thanks! The key to answering rules questions seems to be to read the FAQ thoroughly, not just do random word searches or scan it until you find something that seems to confirm your initial assumptions.

Also I obviously goofed when calling Victarion's ability a passive one when it's a response, however I find the proper rules difficult to deduce from the rulebook alone, which states responses are "used specifically when the card in question states they may be used", which could be interpreted to mean they happen "immediately" (especially since the rulebook doesn't seem to include the concept of "framework actions").
 
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Andy Mills
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Eder is correct, but I thought I'd attempt to clarify a bit. Here's how the plot phase framework action window would go (and this is using the flowchart in the FAQ.)

-Beginning of Plot phase
-- Player actions.
1) Plots are chosen and revealed.
2) Initiative is counted.
3) First Player is appointed.
4) "when revealed" effects occur in the order chosen by FP.
--Saves/cancels may be played here. Note that this will not affect the outcome in this case, but if you wanted to trigger "Outwit", here is where you'd do it.
--At this point, Valar Morghulis will kill all characters. Assuming none are saved, they are all 'moribund' and will leave the table at the end of step 6.
5) Responses may be triggered. HERE is where you trigger Victarion. If that's your 15th power, you have just won the game.
6) End of framework action. All moribund cards leave play. If you didn't win the game with Victarion in step 5, you'd lose him and his power at this point.


I hope that helps clear things up. So it's true that Victarion will be killed, but he is able to trigger his response before he physically leaves the table, and you are able to win the game in this way.
 
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Eder Monaco
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For casual and fun play the most important things to read and understand on the faq are the moribund part and the charts for player actions winows, framework and phases.
For the rest you can check it out when you have doubts.

It is very hard to fully understand everything in the agot world, even experienced players have doubts on how new cards work.
If you want to take things more seriously I heavily suggest you to check those articles I mentioned above (quill and tankard articles over at cardgamedb, they are extremely well done, cover all kind of questions and you always learn something new).
Here are the links for all 5 issues released till now, they are weekly:

Issue 1: http://www.cardgamedb.com/index.php/index.html/_/game-of-thr...
Issue 2: http://www.cardgamedb.com/index.php/index.html/_/game-of-thr...
Issue 3: http://www.cardgamedb.com/index.php/index.html/_/game-of-thr...
Issue 4: http://www.cardgamedb.com/index.php/index.html/_/game-of-thr...
Issue 5: http://www.cardgamedb.com/index.php/index.html/_/game-of-thr...
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Det var bara en hake...
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manydills wrote:
I hope that helps clear things up. So it's true that Victarion will be killed, but he is able to trigger his response before he physically leaves the table, and you are able to win the game in this way.


I see. Then we actually called that one correctly, although not for entirely the right reasons.
 
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