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Subject: 18xx series, need help rss

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Hype Buster
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Hi,

Which of the 18xx series you recommend? i was about to order 1830 but my friend think we wont be able to bring it on the table because of the listed playing time.
 
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Lacombe
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They're essentially all long games, if that's your concern.
 
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Tim Benjamin
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After (getting crushed in a 6-player game) 1 playing a game of 1830 I did the PnP of 18GA & 18AL. I think they both do very well in presenting the system for 3 players and at minimal cost. The 'bigger' game typically are best with more people and can be significantly longer.
 
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Tom Russell
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Most of the 18xx are long games. Listed play time for 1830 is 3-5 hours-- with new people, expect it take close to 8. You need dedicated people. If you want a deep train stock game that's going to hit the table on a more regular basis, try Chicago Express-- it rarely takes more than an hour to complete.
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Jonathan Tullsen
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+1 for chicago express. It captures the feeling of an 18XX game, but without the length.
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Mark Stadel
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RaffertyA wrote:
After (getting crushed in a 6-player game) 1 playing a game of 1830 I did the PnP of 18GA & 18AL. I think they both do very well in presenting the system for 3 players and at minimal cost. The 'bigger' game typically are best with more people and can be significantly longer.


I would agree that trying the PnP version of 18AL is your best bet: its a simpler version and a good introduction to the game. With a bit of experience, you will get plays in under 3 hours.

A typical 18xx game will take ~4-5 hours once you know how to play; I'm not sure more players make them better ... different, but not better. For me, the sweetspot is 3-4 people.

They are amazing games but not for everyone ...
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Moe45673
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If you want something more complex than CE but not as lengthy as 18xx, have a look at Baltimore & Ohio, which is still a heavy game
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Adam Brocker
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Military Muskrat wrote:
+1 for chicago express. It captures the feeling of an 18XX game, but without the length.


I wouldn't go that far. I enjoy Chicago Express, but it doesn't really scratch the same itch that 18XX does. At their core there are some similarities, but 18XX offers a much deeper experience. CE may be a good first step into economic train games though. Especially if you're looking for something shorter.
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Hype Buster
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When you say Train game... what do you really want to say? Because i own TTR and it is not my favorite game... I was interested into 1830 because of the stock holding and economic aspect. I already own acquire which is a filler and not deep at all.

Im also considering Brass and Steam, Brass is soon to be reprinted and steam is back order at my store.
 
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Jennifer Schlickbernd
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Try 1860. Works well with two players, and doesn't take as long as 1830. I don't agree that CE is a good substitute for 18xx, it doesn't have anywhere near the interesting decisions that 1830/46/60/61 do (those are the 18xx's that I've played). CE was kind of dry even for a stock/train game.
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Brad Miller
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Poseidon is a shorter, nice looking, quick playing 18xx game. It is heavily nerfed though in terms of the sorts of stock market shenanigans you can perform. It's more of a "run good companies" type of 18xx than the "screw around with the stocks/presidencies" branch of the games, (where 1830 clearly sits).
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Eric Brosius
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This is my recommendation:

http://www.boardgamegeek.com/thread/665386/1846-a-fine-intro...
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Tom Russell
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generalpotato wrote:
When you say Train game... what do you really want to say?


When I say train game, I'm usually referring to stock-holding games with a route-building aspect in which inter-player dynamics are hugely important, information is open, and there is little to no randomness.

I'd agree that Chicago Express isn't a substitute for the 18xx-- there's a lot more going on with the latter, and you have far greater tools at your disposal. I suggested it more as an alternative-- if the length puts you off 18xx, and you're interested in non-random stock-holding with butterfly effects, Chicago Express is still very deep (IMHO).
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Jennifer Schlickbernd
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Eric Brosius wrote:


I love '46 the most, but damn it takes a long time with newbies. I finally was able to obtain a copy and have taught it twice in the last two weeks. Both times took six hours. My two player plays of 1860 were 2 1/1 to 3 hours.
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Jimmy Okolica
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jschlickbernd wrote:
Eric Brosius wrote:


I love '46 the most, but damn it takes a long time with newbies. I finally was able to obtain a copy and have taught it twice in the last two weeks. Both times took six hours. My two player plays of 1860 were 2 1/1 to 3 hours.


I have yet to play 1860 (although it is sitting on my shelf staring at me), but personally I'd recommend Steam over Holland as a better introduction to 18xx. It has a lot less exceptions to the general 18xx ruleset. I'm really excited to try 1860 but I just don't think it'd be a good first game.

Steam Over Holland has a fixed number of rounds (5 stock rounds and 10 operating rounds) and then it ends. While it may not give you the full 18xx experience (since it's a fixed number of rounds), it's probably closer than anything else that plays in a reasonable amount of time (3 - 4 hours).

I'll also echo that CE doesn't have the same feel as 18xx (although it is an excellent game in its own right).
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Paul Amala
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I would say 18Scan is worth a try. After you get the rules down you should be able to get through a game in a couple of hours.
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Eric Brosius
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jschlickbernd wrote:
Both times took six hours. My two player plays of 1860 were 2 1/1 to 3 hours.


How many people were you playing 1846: The Race for the Midwest with?
 
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Jennifer Schlickbernd
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Eric Brosius wrote:
jschlickbernd wrote:
Both times took six hours. My two player plays of 1860 were 2 1/1 to 3 hours.


How many people were you playing 1846: The Race for the Midwest with?


Four both times. Both times one player (not the same player) had played it once before and the other two had not. I have to keep teaching it so that one day I'll get to experience a really nice smooth experience, but getting there calls for a lot of patience.
 
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Johan L
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Eric Brosius wrote:


Be prepared to wait though - extrapolating on how my order has moved so far I won't get my copy until 2014 at the earliest. meeple
 
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Matt Brown
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generalpotato wrote:
When you say Train game... what do you really want to say? Because i own TTR and it is not my favorite game


TtR isn't a train game. It's a set collection game with a pasted on train theme mostly due to the train pieces.
 
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Joe Huber

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jschlickbernd wrote:
Four both times. Both times one player (not the same player) had played it once before and the other two had not. I have to keep teaching it so that one day I'll get to experience a really nice smooth experience, but getting there calls for a lot of patience.


OK, Jennifer, next time I can get out that way we need to get in a 3 or 4 player game. I promise that with 3, we'll get through in under three hours, probably in under 2.5.
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Eric Brosius
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Johan wrote:
Be prepared to wait though - extrapolating on how my order has moved so far I won't get my copy until 2014 at the earliest. meeple


John Tamplin, the one-man marketing and processing engine of Deep Thought Games, LLC, has just started a new job after an fairly protracted job search. I'd expect the queuing time to return to the usual 7-11 months soon. He has, by the way, enlisted Scott Peterson of All-Aboard Games to share production and shipping duties, so it might go even faster than that. But Scott can't process the incoming orders, so he's been on hold, too, while John moves to a new job.

If anyone has any interest in any of the games John offers, I strongly encourage you to make an order. You don't have to pay until he's ready to manufacture your game(s), and even better, if you decide at that point that you don't want them, you can cancel your order, so that it cost you nothing to wait in the queue.
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Eric Brosius
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jschlickbernd wrote:
Four both times. Both times one player (not the same player) had played it once before and the other two had not. I have to keep teaching it so that one day I'll get to experience a really nice smooth experience, but getting there calls for a lot of patience.


We can play with you at the Gathering next year if you want. Joe Rushanan and I taught Larry Levy (a 3-player game with one newbie,) and it took 2 hours flat. Even better, Larry won in a very close game.
 
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Eric Brosius
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matthean wrote:
TtR isn't a train game. It's a set collection game with a pasted on train theme mostly due to the train pieces.


I think it's more than a set collection game, because you have a network connection game going on as well. Furthermore, network connection is a clearly train-linked mechanism, so I don't agree that the theme is unrelated to the game play.

I will concede that it's not a strongly trainy game.
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General Norris
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1825 Unit 2 and the other two units are the shortest good 18XX I know about since it's faster than 1846, 18TN and all the single state 18XX games.
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