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Summoner Wars» Forums » Strategy

Subject: Magic Drain and turbo-champions. rss

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Alex Brown
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I've been playing iOS only.

So far I've hit two big hurdles.

How do you play effectively against Magic Drain?

How do you effectively counter a strategy aimed at getting champions out as quickly as possible (specifically JE and GD)?
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oldschoolgamr
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Alex Brown wrote:
I've been playing iOS only.

So far I've hit two big hurdles.

How do you play effectively against Magic Drain?

How do you effectively counter a strategy aimed at getting champions out as quickly as possible (specifically JE and GD)?

Thirty plus iOS games later and I am starting to come up against the same thing. I like playing all the factions and getting the full experience. However, it seems there are a ton of players focusing on the Phoenix Elves.

The strategy involves taking out starting units and cycling magic/magic drain to pull out the champs. This is a valid strategy of course - but it can hit you quick if you are not prepared for it. I have had success with Jungle Elves early attacks, but the factions that require slower and steady build up are quite ineffective.

The issue I have is that I go up against this same Phoenix Elves strategy in games over and over - I am assuming because people are so concerned about their record that they would rather play out a rote patterned strategy as opposed to creative play...

I suppose I will start cycling through my list of friends and cull it for people who play with more variety. It just gets old playing the same game over and over. I bought Summoner Wars - not Wars vs. Phoenix Elves... or am I just whining too much?

So - if you keep you unit count low and/or your magic points near 2 you can sometimes counter it. Once I play out 2-3 games that are basically the same, I just start picking the Phoenix Elves as well versus that player... and everyone knows how fun mirror matches are.

I was convinced all the faction were amazingly balanced - but as people begin to get more familiar with the intracacies of the factions I am wondering how truely balanced they are... If the strategy to make it a good game under certain conditions removes the fun I have an issue with that...

Other thoughts?

OSG (GC ID: oldschoolgamer - in carrot brackets)

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Fede Miguez
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heh, Cave Goblins are good at that. Rush/Rage/Horde and it's 18 dice on Miti/Gror.
The way to play around Magic Drain is just to keep the same number of units than your opponent. If you also play a faction that is good at Assassination (JE/CL) you can punish their lack of units on the board.
About champs, every faction has a way around them so it depends on what you are facing, but in general save the powerful events for when a champ hits the board: TO Freeze, PE Burns, CG Horde, GD Heroic Feat, VG Holy Judgment (actually, they can fight champ vs champ just fine through Healing), FK Forced Summon (plus champ), JE go with Assassination (ignore champ, go for the summoner) or just fight fire with fire, CL kill the champ before it hits the board (if not, go Assassination).
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Jim bo
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The obvious way to counter magic drain is keeping your own unit count lower than or equal to your opponents.

During the periods where you can't you can always try to ensure your magic is at 0 or 1 so the drain doesn't get full benefit and it leaves them with the dilemma of keeping it for a later turn which obviously helps to clog up their hand.

Keeping your magic low tends to go hand in hand with a common rush strategy where you try to overwhelm your opponent and go for a quick kill on their summoner or at the very least block their walls and hence summon opportunities.

The other point to note is if they've spent turns culling their own units for magic then this could leave them exposed to a common rush as they have less units to defend with in the early game and you might force them to use their magic on fielding commons to defend your rush if you keep the pressure on.
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Jeremy Yoder
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In certain match-ups, if you're going to make a strong push, having 1 more unit than them may not a big deal. Because as much as they'd like to play a MD on the event phase, if you're in their face, then they can't afford not to summon, thereby putting them at the same unit count.

Also, sometimes it's good to be wary of magic drain, other times, just ignore it -- if you're going to overwhelm with numbers, then go all out. Your faction has it's own strengths, so even though you want to prevent your enemy's strengths, at times you need to focus on yours and not live in fear of MD.

However, that's not to say I don't hear you -- an experienced player can use the strategy you mentioned quite well, and it can be an upward climb to overcome. And many, including myself, do find the GD to be the best all-around faction that's probably a bit overpowered compared to the others.
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oldschoolgamr
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I agree with all of the above comments regarding magic drain strategy. Unit count, low magic, and early rush are what have worked for me these past two days - I am just really sick of fighting Phoenix Elves!

I actually chose them in frustration aginst the repeat player and we did a mirror mode where the first half of the game was spent mimicing the moves of the other player to a T. I eventually made the first move and surprised him with an archer surround when he only had two health left. I had Precise of one and just needed the other to score a hit...

I love those moments were you have one die and need one hit to finish the game - the tension is thick and the game totally shines... I rolled a six by the way...

OSG
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Matt Connellan
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If you are facing someone who is just killing their own, hording magic, and abusing Magic Drain (I'm looking at you, PE and GD), each faction has a was to punish them for it, but if you really want to hurt that style of play, I'd go with the Cloaks.

Cloaks: They're the easiest faction to punish this strategy with, IMO. With Thieves, Raid, Sin-Sin, Assassinate, Sniper, Spy, and others, people who don't field commons will get shredded. Steal the few cards they don't build for magic with well-timed Raids or Thief+Sin-Sin. So long Magic Drain or Gror. Assassinate anyone blocking their summoner and get hits in. Put a Sniper and Vlox in the back row and punish their walls. Spy out one of their champs. Of course, the most frustrating strategy in the game (imo) is doing this with GD then summoning Gror and pooping on heads. It's such a no-brainer, and since Gror is so godlike it's hard to counter with anyone without wall-swarming so against that I'd just Snipe their walls and Raid until they're forced to make a move.
And if it's PE you face and they fry their own commons vs. Cloaks, well then I pity the fool, because Elien's going to die.
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Noble Knave
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Pintsizepete wrote:
...And if it's PE you face and they fry their own commons vs. Cloaks, well then I pity the fool, because Elien's going to die.




Excellent advice. Plus Cloaks are awesome, and all those people who always play this strategy with PE and GD deserve to get kicked in the shins hard several times until they start doing more interesting things and stop caring so much about their win ratio.
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Alex Brown
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What's wrong with playing to win?

I always try to make the best play. If its boring, isn't that the game's fault?
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Noble Knave
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Alex Brown wrote:
What's wrong with playing to win?

I always try to make the best play. If its boring, isn't that the game's fault?


I always play to win. And thus far, usually do. But I'd rather lose the occasional game by trying different decks or playing the "weaker" factions than getting a higher win rate by always playing the boring champ-spam way with PE or GD.

Of course, both of those decks can also be played in a variety of ways besides the one the OP and I take issue with. Champ-spam is not strictly the best strategy, but it's an easy one to do and it is not as much fun to play against, IMO.
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Noble Knave
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My other complaint is when players always play the same faction. I'd much rather play against PE and GD roughly 25% of the time, than 75% of the time. Obviously those are both great choices for learning the game, but once players have cut their teeth it'd be nice if some branching out occurred.
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Carthoris Pyramidos
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playing to win
I'm always most interested in playing (to win!) with the faction that I've historically lost with the most. I want the satisfaction of having the steadiest eye, not the biggest gun.
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