Hey, all of you who are reading this!
I've been interested in the L5R CCG especially as an alternative to ... another card game (*cough* MTG) but I find it tremendously more complex. How expensive is the start in and of itself? Is there even any good chance to get into this game from Germany?
I have been looking all over the web for somewhere to start and found the free decks of the kolat edition and while these seem to be the perfect gateway to Rokugan, I can't help but look for something more refined.
For this Reason I have made 9 deck lists (1 for each clan) and would now like to hear not only your opinion on the deck as a whole but also constructive criticism and a rough estimate as to what buying the cards for those decks would cost.
Update: whoops, maybe I should post one of said decks so here is my idea for dragon enlightenment (the only one of the nine I built completely from scratch)
Pillars of Virtue
Border Keep exp
Bamboo Harvester exp
Benefices of the Emperor
The Seeker's Temple
Gold Mine x3
Tranquil Garden x3
Temple of Harmony x3
Second City Dojo x3
Togashi Korimi x3
Togashi Torazu x3
Togashi Hizumi x3
Togashi Kasuru x3
All the five Rings of course
Nerve Strike x3
Sincerity of the Dragon x3
Martial Instruction x3
Meeting the Keepers x3
Deception Revealed x3
Engulfing Flames x3
Falling Leaf Strike x2
A Game of Dice
Bonds of Coin
Preserving Honor x3
Snake Tattoo x3
Steadfast Defense x2
Whew, I knew this would become a long post
As I said: please give me constructive criticism on the first L5R deck I've ever built
- Last edited Wed Aug 8, 2012 12:04 pm (Total Number of Edits: 1)
- Posted Wed Aug 8, 2012 11:12 am
There is a thriving L5R scene in Europe (bunches of storyline tournaments, plus the World Championships this year are in Barcelona and the L5R brand manager lives in France), including Germany.
For an idea of the cost of buying a particular deck from singles, it's probably easiest to go to L5Rsearch, eBay, or another singles dealer to look things up.
For feedback on a particular deck, the best way to get more comphrensive discussion is to join one of the clan-specific forums and post a deck there. I can come back later and muse on your enlightenment deck (I don't have time at this particular second), but you'll get more opinions if you post it to TheDragonClan.net.
If you find L5R very complex then I suspect you haven't had up to now a lot of experience in actual L5R play. Like Magic the Gathering what seems complex at first soon becomes second nature. I'd suggest the MTG is actually very complex with it's 'stack' and timing mechanisms, just look at it's 'comprehensive' rulebook compared to L5R's. L5R tends to have more critical choices during actual gameplay, esp. in bigger battles, than Magic the Gathering which may make it seem more complicated.
Depends on who you are going to play with. If it is a casual play group that may or may not attend the local Kotei then I'd suggest just getting the Emperor Edition base set starter decks and expand from there. Many players play with cost limitations and yet still go to the Kotei just for the fun and without much expectation to really win. If you really want to go for hard core competitive play then forget the cards, what you really need is top notch opponents to play and test against. Assembling decks from expensive singles purchasing before getting a lot of play experience might not be the best way to go. You might end up with cards that don't have general deck usefulness if your one deck design doesn't pan out.
Sounds to me that you are just starting out and should focus on getting a play group together. That's where the real fun is. Thus try to get a good selection of standard and cheap cards together for friends, ie. something like what a MTG cube draft would employ.
Bowing and with respect believe your enlightenment deck would be a tad too slow in a competitive environment. I haven't seen a enlightenment deck win a tournament for a long time but maybe that's just the fault of my local group. Although as a Crane player I don't know much about enlightment wins.
- Last edited Wed Aug 8, 2012 1:25 pm (Total Number of Edits: 3)
- Posted Wed Aug 8, 2012 12:39 pm
Wow, first of all: Thanks for the quick replies!
Is it really? I thought as much, since from what I've gathered it seems that enlightenment is just too dependant on drawing the right cards at the right time. But still, I've got 8 other decks in the works Up to now I find Crane, Scorpion, Lion and Crab most interesting but Crab seems a bit ... blunt? Or maybe straightforward would be a better word.
So those Kolat starter Decks would be a good start? Because I'm really damn poor :/ or would it be a good idea to buy a set of commons from some editions and expand from there? You mentioned drafting. Is that a thing with L5R? It always seemed to me that it's much too clan dependant to be drafted, since you can't really switch mid-draft like in MTG
Drafting is currently an option with the Emperor Edition booster packs. Each comes with a generic drafting stronghold: 'The Governor's Estate'. The Drafting rules are included in some boosters or can be found on AEG's website. In many ways drafting is less limited than Mtg, the drafted decks aren't clan dependant because of the draft format stronghold. The trick is each player has to draft a balance of fate and dynasty cards.
You're right that enlightenment decks depend on drawing the right cards at the right time. That's why when enlighenment decks were winning tournaments in the (distant) past it was because certain key 'search' cards existed in the format. Personally I believe that's one of the reasons why 'Monk' doesn't exist as a playable clan anymore.
If you're short of funds then the print and play Kolat edition starter decks are great. Gee I wonder what inspired AEG to take them off the company's website....
Legend of the Five Rings is a slightly more expensive game to start than MTG but far cheaper to be tournament competitive. The Emperor edition starters are $25CAN and come with four different strongholds, a large selection of basic needed cards, cardboard token sheets, the full rulebook, three expansion booster packs, plus a bunch of very useful 'rule' cards. Currently each clan tends to have four 'themes' of deck design and the EE starters show off all four. The EE starters are really a great way to enter the game, far better than any past L5R base set starters.
Remember that unlike MTG, there is really only a standard format for L5R. Unlike MTG, older editions of Legend of the Five Rings cards aren't really playable with the current rules. The L5R rules have changed in subtle but game shaking ways since the game was first published. A Legacy format exists but has a lot of rules for how cards from earlier editions and arcs work together, very complicated. It is very rarely played. In the past actions weren't limited to once per turn, followers didn't add force to the unit if the personality was bowed, the rings were different, Open actions could be used in battles, the Imperial Favour was more awesome, etc. etc. etc., and honor running Crane could actually win. In other words it's best to stick with cards that are currently 'standard' format, ie. with the Emperor edition printed bug.
- Last edited Wed Aug 8, 2012 1:30 pm (Total Number of Edits: 6)
- Posted Wed Aug 8, 2012 1:07 pm
Never know what's next.
Crab most interesting but Crab seems a bit ... blunt? Or maybe straightforward would be a better word.
They are. They have to be. Demons and zombies don't care much for pretty words.
That said, you should look at the Crab Clan's Yasuki family, and their associated decks. They are the merchant house of the Crab, and are tasked with ensuring the Crab have all the supplies they need to fight the shadowlands. As such, the Yasuki use some... shall we say... underhanded tactics.
Ok, they make used-car salesmen look like saints.
They have dishonor decks built around manipulating your opponent's gold and forcing them into "bad-choice or worse-choice" situations.
- Last edited Wed Aug 8, 2012 9:19 pm (Total Number of Edits: 1)
- Posted Wed Aug 8, 2012 9:19 pm
Again thanks for all the Feedback!
So what I've gathered for now: Since I like the Idea of Drafting quite a lot maybe I should buy a set of commons and fixed(?) cards. But on the other hand I like to have a deck pool so large that I am able to build a lot of different decks and I don't think that's possible with, let's say, just all the Emperor Edition commons.
So the other solution would be starter sets. How many cards are in there exactly? How long are those cards legal? How sensible would it be to lurk ebay for a while and get all EE cards or and some from other editions?
And to the above: I already know a fair share about the clans and familys but I just don't like the Yasuki's Style. Tbh I want a deck as flexible as possible which for the clans of my choice seem to be: Crab Siege, Lion Paragons, Crane Duelists and Scorpion Magistrates. As much as I like having decks, my girlfriend really likes crafting a deck of her own so there the drafting comes back again :/ argh! advice and money! I need them both!
I got into this and played during Diamond and Lotus. I have experience of other card games. The main complexity I found in this game was in the shear number of possible card combinations there were.
There is a lot going on in a turn and if you don't have a card playing CCG background it can be a bit much. I was lucky and had a person who was willing to play with me with decks they owned back then before I jumped in.