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Subject: Some optional house rules musing rss

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Mark MooseMCA
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Hi everyone!

First time posting, but have been following BGG for years. I recently got my abomination pack of zombicide and frankly I'm loving it. I've played a number of group and solo games thus far.

One of the things I'm a huge fan of are the tools being given to players to create their own content (campaign editor, blank character sheets, etc). Right now I'm whipping up Scooby Doo characters from hasslefree minis and preexisting survivor stats.



Anyways, in the spirit of tweaking I was thinking of some optional house rules. Granted some may make it easier for survivors, but don't all have to be used. Feedback is really appreciated!!



1. Rolling 1 on ranged attacks hit any survivors in zones within the line of fire.

2. Survivors each have three wounds, on third they die. (each wound taken still takes up a spot in inventory. This is to slightly buff each survivor so players can take one each in group games and not have them drop so quickly. They still will be vulnerable I feel, but this could be too strong a buff.)

3. Survivors drop equipment in zone they were standing in when killed. Another survivor may stand in zone and spend an exchange action to pickup/drop, assuming it is free of zombies.

4. Abominations have two activations like runners. (I want the big guy to feel even bigger, faster, and scarier.)

5. Abominations can "smash" through locked doors to get at survivors. (The whole impenetrable barricade thing bugs me. Maybe allow fatties to break doors too?)





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Alex Holker
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MooseMCA wrote:
1. Rolling 1 on ranged attacks hit any survivors in the zone or in zones within the line of fire.

This is not a good rule. It is the antithesis of how you're supposed to be playing the game. Shooting a friendly should never be considered a matter of bad luck - if you're not willing to kill them, you have no business shooting at them.
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Mark MooseMCA
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I actually like the shooting rules as written. I was just curious what other people would think..
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Henry Durand
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I think he meant that survivors in zones along the line of fire, who'd normally be immune to being hit (think a rifle, shooting at zombies two spaces away, any survivors in the zone between the shooter and the targets could not normally be hit). This rule would add a chance of them being hit just for being in the way, not just for being in the target zone.

I think it's an interesting idea, but I am finding the game tough enough without helping the zombies even more!
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Storm Kerr
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Zombies killed our entire party three games in a row. I hate to see players killing players...

Abominations smashing open doors is thematic but should not be allowed for doors that have been closed with "lock it down" ability. (assume they boarded it up) 2actions for a zombie that can't be killed by anything but a Molotov is a little too much.

I have considered making the Scooby gang too. I love Kevin's new sculpts and he has "Shaun of the Dead" too.
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J Ry
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I like the idea of each wound a survivor takes giving them less spots for inventory.
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Jason Sly
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Sorry to kinda go off on this tangent in a house rules thread, but how big are HassleFree Miniatures exactly? I guess, the Adventurers specifically...since those are the pop culture spoofs that would fit in the best.
 
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Mark MooseMCA
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@Jason:
I have a number of them myself. They fit, size wise, just fine as long as you don't mind that they are heroic scale. Meaning their heads and hands will be a bit bigger.
 
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Yoki Erdtman
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I really like your ideas Mark, especially numbers 3-5, they are aspects that I've already thought of changing myself, and I haven't even received the game yet.

Edit: Dangit, as I wrote the above, in the corner of my eye I spot a box with USPS stickers on it, the box being about the size to house the two Abomination level Zombicides that I'm expecting, but of course not... It was nothing game related at all.
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Magic Pink
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AlexHolker wrote:
MooseMCA wrote:
1. Rolling 1 on ranged attacks hit any survivors in the zone or in zones within the line of fire.

This is not a good rule. It is the antithesis of how you're supposed to be playing the game. Shooting a friendly should never be considered a matter of bad luck - if you're not willing to kill them, you have no business shooting at them.


No, it's a great rule and works incredibly well. And don't even try to tell us how we're "supposed" to be playing a game. The ranged damage rule as is is ridiculously stupid and makes zero sense; there is absolutely no reason that Survivors would automatically get hit with every shot fired towards them no matter how many zombies are on the space with them AND that it's impossible for them to get hit if you shoot through their space. It's moronic. If you wanna keep the crazy deadliness of the original rule while still allowing for a shred of physics you can rule that all misses rolled are hits on Survivors instead. That pretty much guarantees a player death while still leaving slight room for a survival.

I love the Abomination ignores doors rule; definitely going to use that.

I would not increase hits or use the drop inventory rule; that makes things too easy. If you incerease the number of hits taken you actually COULDN'T use the modified range damage rules.
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Mark MooseMCA
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@Magic Pink:
Great reply, thanks! Why couldn't you use the change to range shots with extra wounds? In my mind I see it as a grazing shot that may not fully put down a survivor unless they are already injured.
 
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Jason Sly
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MooseMCA wrote:
@Jason:
I have a number of them myself. They fit, size wise, just fine as long as you don't mind that they are heroic scale. Meaning their heads and hands will be a bit bigger.

Excellent, I'll definitely be considering picking up a handful in the future.
 
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Dan Keller
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Magic Pink wrote:

No, it's a great rule and works incredibly well. And don't even try to tell us how we're "supposed" to be playing a game. The ranged damage rule as is is ridiculously stupid and makes zero sense; there is absolutely no reason that Survivors would automatically get hit with every shot fired towards them no matter how many zombies are on the space with them AND that it's impossible for them to get hit if you shoot through their space. It's moronic. If you wanna keep the crazy deadliness of the original rule while still allowing for a shred of physics you can rule that all misses rolled are hits on Survivors instead. That pretty much guarantees a player death while still leaving slight room for a survival.


So you make melee pointless with that rule. You might as well remove all the melee weapons from your deck then because there's no reason not to roll around with just ranged weapons at that point. Your change also removes a lot of tactical decision-making. You rarely have to worry about how to engage a zombie group, you'll always choose to be at range. When given a decision between the Chainsaw and the Pistol, you should almost always choose the Pistol. It's called *Game Balance*.

Of course play how you like. I just can't imagine it's as satisfying a game win as with the rules as printed.
 
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Mike Malley
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I'll bet that a win with their tweak is way more satisfying for them than a loss without it.

The change they're making doesn't make melee pointless. They *are* adding the fact that shooting through zones can now injure players. Saying that they might as well remove all the melee weapons is going a bit far. Granted, it does skew the weapon-choice in favor of range, but let's face it: against a zombie horde, barring melee skills, that's where you want to be.
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Matthew M
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Moved to Variants
 
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Mark MooseMCA
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So my intention was to throw out some rule tweaks to make the experience, as a whole, a bit more difficult and to get some feedback and possibly some other ideas to folks. Hopefully some people see and might want to add some flavor to their games. If the idea is of no interest a response with "ZoMG!!!!1!!one!!11 that's the worst idea ever!!" without something constructive, really isn't needed. Let's not waste each others time. Thanks!

I'm fine with how target priority works with shooting, I'd like to add an element to my games that can cause a grazing shot to survivors in a zone between shooter and zombie target. Right now this would only really affect the rifle since it's range 1-3.

Cheers!
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3. Survivors drop equipment in zone they were standing in when killed. Another survivor may stand in zone and spend an exchange action to pickup/drop, assuming it is free of zombies.

that's how we played it, it just makes sense.
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Alex Holker
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Magic Pink wrote:
If you wanna keep the crazy deadliness of the original rule while still allowing for a shred of physics you can rule that all misses rolled are hits on Survivors instead. That pretty much guarantees a player death while still leaving slight room for a survival.

Your misinterpretation of my point only reinforces my argument. What must be preserved is not deadliness but the appearance of deadliness, to force the player to take the danger of shooting into melee seriously and thus force them to not take senseless risks at the other survivors' expense.
 
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Kai Price
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Very nice. I'll run these suggestions past my group.

Some house rules we are considering to cut the random death in favor of stronger strategic elements are "no manhole spawning upon building population" and "zombies get extra move, not extra activation." such random, instant death does not make sense to us in a game where death is also so quick and so final.

We were thinking about adding more wound capability to the survivors too, perhaps per level, but maybe what you do, increasing everyone from two to three is enough. Briefly considered pooling wounds based on turn (no more than one would could be taken per turn) but that would seem far too easy.
 
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J Ry
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Ive not played much, but for shooting we did this:
Roll to hit as normal,
Misses hit the players in the zone.
Reroll hits,
Misses hit the players in the zone.
Second rolled hits, hit zombies.

We found that this allowed some 'Ill save you' heroics but usually still lead to the players being gunned down.
I think the reason behind the original rule was for balance of the game.

The rule we came up with listed above gives you a chance to save your buddy, but at a huge risk.

And a less aggressive, easier and quicker way we have thought of doing is"
Roll to hit as normal
Hits hit zombies
Misses hit players
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Billy Kumohara
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MooseMCA wrote:

1. Rolling 1 on ranged attacks hit any survivors in zones within the line of fire.

4. Abominations have two activations like runners. (I want the big guy to feel even bigger, faster, and scarier.)

5. Abominations can "smash" through locked doors to get at survivors. (The whole impenetrable barricade thing bugs me. Maybe allow fatties to break doors too?)


My group played with these this past weekend with a few adjustments to
House Rule #1:

Any roll under "Success" is an automatic failure. Survivors caught in the "crossfire" roll. Lowest roll gets hit.

Rules 4 & 5 made our session pretty awesome.

We also rolled for initiative. Survivor turn begins with highest roller going clockwise.
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Mark MooseMCA
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@Billy:
How did change to survivor start order go?
Did you do both changes to the abomination? cool! what happened? :-D
 
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Ebon Hawk
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If you assume that it is ridiculous that you hit survivors first, that means that the entire targeting system makes no sense. Why would I only hit walkers than fatties than runners? Game balance makes it necessary.

I agree that I first thought the rule was crazy, but I played several games and cannot imagine how easy the game would be without that risk. It really adds tension to the game and makes the decision to engage in melee more interesting.

I have my own variants I am considering, but changing this rule is not one of them. (My variants are more about blockages and a fire truck/hose.)
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J Ry
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Truth be told, we play it simple.
Roll to hit, misses hit survivors in the same space.
Weve even toyed with a roll of 1 hits a survivor between the shooter and the target.
Weve found that this tends to still keep us from firing into a survivor occupied zone.
But its been better received at least having the choice.
To each their own and all that.

Another addition we came up with rotating the experience.
When you get to red, you start over, keeping unlocked abilities.
Once you get to orange, you unlock the 2nd, and red you unlock one of the remaining two.
Just food for thought, it made it a bit more fun. Not so much to win, just to ice more Zds
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Mike Walko
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In our games the only change we've made is that you can pick targets with range weapons if you are shooting into the square you are standing in. Essentially range zero. Shooting outside follows the same rules as the book.

It might make the melee weapons less desirable, but I can't think of a fight where I'd want a baseball bat over a pistol anyway.

I wish range weapons had to worry about ammo, but I haven't come up with an elegant and intuitive solution yet.
 
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