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BattleCON: War of Indines» Forums » Variants

Subject: New character creation rss

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Artifice Knight
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Okay, I'm working on making my own custom character (because custom characters are awesome) and running into a bit of trouble with one of my planned mechanics.

Its called preparation. The character has a few tokens, each with different abilities (ala Hepzibah, Robert, Hikaru, etc). During the end beat they can discard one of the tokens along with their current attack pair. When they pick up the attack pair the preparation tokens were discarded with, the effects trigger (thus, preparing for 2 turns ahead). The type of benefit that was coming is going to be very obvious, since unlike the above three, if you choose to ante they don't know until the card choice is picked, where with this character it'll be very obvious what bonuses you have and they can plan around it.

So, with that out there, what kind of bonuses should be there? Originally I was planning on Hikaru style bonuses, since where Hikaru can spend one per turn (like our prepared character can) he can't get them back quite as reliably, and our prepared character gets theirs back the moment they get the bonus.

Guess looking for thoughts in general, if there are any to share.
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Nate K
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I think you'll need to make these abilities bonuses that could be used with a variety of attack pairs. Two beats ahead is a LONG time in BattleCON. The field could drastically change in that amount of time. And your opponent will see the bonus coming and be able to prepare for it.

I would recommend utility abilities, such as "Start of Beat: Move up to 1 space," or "+1 Priority." Depending on the type of character, an ability such as "Switch places with opponent" or "Stun Immunity" could be good.
 
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Joe Romero
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It's a fun idea, but kurthl33t does have a valid point. Two beats is a very long time in this game, and the state of the match can be wildly different in that amount of time. I don't know anything else about the character, but these tokens want to be very statistically strong, or with a lot of utility.

In my mind, the character can afford to have strictly better tokens than Hikaru, to make up for the immense preparation time. So for these preparation tokens, can there be multiple tokens cycling through the discard? As in, can there be a token in discard 1 and discard 2? If it was limited to one token in the entire discard, you could probably make the abilities absolutely silly.
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Artifice Knight
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Every turn they can discard a preparation token to the recycle, so yes, there will be a token on 1 & 2 if they are constantly playing tokens (which they might as well, as is there isn't bonus I can see for not spending some token).

And mostly I was just looking in terms of scale. Hikaru's tokens are pretty basic, though in comparison to Hepzibah, he is quite a bit better-only Priority +2 is matched, the range gives him a bit more variety, more power, and higher amounts of soak. Where as the next 'tier' from that I figure is like Vanaah, who has an incredible +2 power and +2 priority on the same token.

My fear here, and the reason I'm asking now before I get heavy into committing myself to one or the other is I don't want to over estimate the amount of boost. I figure the telegraph was worth at least a small increase, just wanted confirmation so I didn't just make 'Broken Character 2-The Brokening'
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Nate K
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ArtificeKnight wrote:
Every turn they can discard a preparation token to the recycle, so yes, there will be a token on 1 & 2 if they are constantly playing tokens (which they might as well, as is there isn't bonus I can see for not spending some token).

And mostly I was just looking in terms of scale. Hikaru's tokens are pretty basic, though in comparison to Hepzibah, he is quite a bit better-only Priority +2 is matched, the range gives him a bit more variety, more power, and higher amounts of soak. Where as the next 'tier' from that I figure is like Vanaah, who has an incredible +2 power and +2 priority on the same token.

My fear here, and the reason I'm asking now before I get heavy into committing myself to one or the other is I don't want to over estimate the amount of boost. I figure the telegraph was worth at least a small increase, just wanted confirmation so I didn't just make 'Broken Character 2-The Brokening'


Given the nature of the ability, it would probably be preferable to start with a broken character and scale back. The ability itself is inherently weak, so the tokens should be either very strong or universally useful (regardless of the board situation).
 
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One Armed Bandit
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ArtificeKnight wrote:
When they pick up the attack pair the preparation tokens were discarded with, the effects trigger (thus, preparing for 2 turns ahead). The type of benefit that was coming is going to be very obvious, since unlike the above three, if you choose to ante they don't know until the card choice is picked, where with this character it'll be very obvious what bonuses you have and they can plan around it.


Make it less obvious.

Give him 2 copies of each token, so if there are like 4 tokens, he has a total of 8. The idea being that you have enough where seeing one token doesn't mean you can automatically deduce the remaining ones.

But here's the fun part. The tokens all have a blank back, and they're played to the discards FACE DOWN.

When it cycles around, you flip it up and reveal it during the Ante phase.

You can then add abilities that are based on adding a second token, swapping one from discard with one in hand, or having to reveal a face down token (perhaps when stunned, you have to face up the token you're playing that beat?)

Possibility would be tho have the tokens be relatively small, but you play 2 of them.
+1 power, +1 priority, +0-1 range, Stun Guard 2, Soak 1, StartOfBeat Advance/Move 1
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Artifice Knight
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As much as I like Palmerkun's idea to make it less obvious, the main problem right now is that the person I'd playtest this with requires us to use the Vassal Mod to play against each other. Pretending Hikaru's tokens are different is easy-making them face up/down is out of that reach. Though that is something to try!

Anyway, did a bit of testing, and right now she holds her own against Hikaru, (though still loses more then she wins) I give you...



Unique Ability-Preparation!
Twilight Sparkle has 4 different preparation tokens. At the end of beat, after recycling her current attack pair, she may place one of the tokens on top of the attack pair-it recycles through with them. Upon picking up an attack pair, the bonus is activated. Twilight Sparkle starts the game with a preparation token on Discard 1.

1-Red style-
Exhasperated

+0 range
+1 Power
+0 Prioirty
Push the opponent spaces up to damage dealt

2-Yellow Style-
Sleepless

+1-3 range
-1 priority
-1 power
After placing a token from Twilights Unique ability, you may cycle the tokens forward an additional space.

3-Green Style-
Isolated

+0-1 range
-1 power
+0 priority
After activating:Retreat any number of spaces

4-Orange Style-
Organized

+1-2 range
+0 power
-1 priority
Start of Beat-You may move nearest opponent up to one space
Start of beat-You may move up to one space

5-Blue Style-
Magical

+0-1 rainge
+1 power
+0 Priority
On hit-Oppoent gets -2 priority next turn.

Unique Base
Study

N/A
N/A
4
After activating-move anywhere on the board
End of beat-You may place 2 prep tokens


Tokes (no fancy names yet)
+3 Power
+4 Priority
Move to Any space during Ante Phase
Stun Immunity




Thoughts so far-
I was trying to make Twilight Sparkle a range controler. Able to be inside or outside an opponents ideal range, and using preparation tokens to be really good. A lot of her styles have range modifiers, and few have strong bonuses to power or priority-she'll need preparation for those. Study and Sleepless are powerful preparation cards-Sleepless will cycle two tokens through on the same turn (at the expense of having a pair with no tokens on it later) and study gives two bonuses the same turn.

Using this, its possible to get +4 priority and +3 power for a turn-but the enemy will *surely* see it coming, and you can bet they'll have a response for when it does. Hikaru was able to soak it with an earth token, and used a focused shot to get through the stun anyway with his own retaliation, and I'm sure others would have countermeasures as well.
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Joe Romero
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Huh. Ponies. Didn't see that coming. Anyway, incoming theory prattle:

How many times have you given this a playtest? It looks fun on paper, although, I can't imagine the stun immunity token is going to be used that often. Twilight plays a controlling range game, as you said, and with her telegraphed super bonuses, it looks like Twilight is in complete control over the pacing and spacing of the battle.

That telegraph will be her downfall however, so it looks like she'll create some interesting matches. Whenever she activates study, it'll be hard to imagine a situation where I wouldn't choose to put down priority and power.

Her middling natural priority greatly appreciates that gigantic surge of speed, and she'll be clamoring for it whenever she can. Scratch that earlier statement about always using priority/power with study. Priority/teleport looks very useful as well. Priority/teleport Exasperated Grasp catches a ton of dashes, and will chuck the opponent clear across the field.

I'd say this is a very solid start if I've already had this much fun putting together attack pairs in my head
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Artifice Knight
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Yeah, Stun Immunity got one or two uses, and usually after playing a Sleepless Study or other hand where literally everything was being played. Best use for it usually combining it with a power boost via Study or Sleepless and sitting in the middle of the arena and using shot. Outside of that though, priority/power/teleport were the three that got the most use.

And thanks! So far she seems a touch on the weak side, though I think that may just be learning curve so far. And only a few fights against Hikaru-still need to see if she can handle a Demitras or a Cadenza.

Again though, appreciate the feedback.
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Nate K
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Well, let's see. She's got plenty of movement and ways to control positioning. She's got decent range. Her Priority is barely below average when looking solely at her styles, but she can get a massive +4 bonus every three turns, which is just sick. And her maximum rotational damage output isn't bad at all--about 17, if my math is correct.

The problem will be her predictability. Your opponent will always know exactly which bonus to expect, and can use that to extrapolate your best move. I expect that, despite her relatively simple abilities, she will be a moderately difficult character to play. She'll require the player to think outside the box and run unexpected attack pairs.

If played by a master BattleCon player, I think opponents will be extremely frustrated by her. Most other characters will have difficulty keeping up with her ability to maneuver and manage board position, even if they can see the bonuses coming.

Obviously, you'll need to test her against a variety of opponents, but my guess is that this is a pretty solid foundation.
 
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Alec
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Pony theme aside, This is probably the best custom character I've seen yet. Most of the customs that I've seen posted are either crazy unbalanced, or not unique or interesting enough to stand on it's own.

The unique ability here is both unique and powerful, with a significant drawback, that encourages mindgames and clever play by both players. I think it's pretty brilliant. The tokens as you have them now seem to be an appropriate power level, but could probably become even more interesting with some real thought.

As a thought, I think the unique finisher could be pretty cool with this character. Maybe a new token you can only ante when you're at 7
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Artifice Knight
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Thanks for all the positive feedback!

Been working a little more with Twilight-as much as I want to move on to make more, she has a few more kinks to work out. Magical tends to be a dead style-it never gets used and waits in the hand, so it may need either a general buff to be more feasible or get changed so it sees more use.

Stun Immunity is also a rather odd duck-I had thought it'd be useful against more speedy enemies like Demitras, but instead it seems it gets the most use when there isn't another token (any other token) that can be played instead-Twilight simply isn't dependent on before or after activating effects enough to be bothered.

That said, did start working on a finisher-still in the early works as I judge if its too powerful.

Element of Magic
Range N/A
Priority N/A
Power N/A

Effect:
Twilight activates a base and style from each of her discard piles this turn, forming two attack pairs. Any tokens on top of those discard piles apply only to the attack pair they are on.


Twilights Finisher lets her attack twice from her discard, and any preparation tokens one either discard give her thier bonuses seperately. The rather wonky wording was in case she is fighting Lixis-If she were able to get multiple attacks and pairings from her finisher becuase she had additional base cards in her discard would be a trifle silly.

The biggest draw though from this trick was for it to be good, it requires the player to prepare for it-making sure to have good attack pairs in the discard on the time that she triggers her special. A fun way to tie the theme together.

That said, it also strikes me as a bit lacking and a touch overly complicated, and trying to brainstorm other ways of using tokens/her special trick in order to land her big attack.
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Nate K
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I wouldn't change Magical just yet. It might just not be conducive to your testers' play styles. I would definitely use it as-is. Magical Shot followed by Isolated Drive would be pretty good against close-range enemies.
 
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