Recommend
12 
 Thumb up
 Hide
31 Posts
1 , 2  Next »   | 

Merchant of Venus (second edition)» Forums » General

Subject: Flip the Board at Gen Con! Win GG! rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
United States
Overland Park
Kansas
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
20 GG plus any donations to the first person to post an image of the other side of the board at Gen Con!

I'll bump it to 50 GG plus donations if it's in the middle of game and you have video.



11 
 Thumb up
1.00
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Железный комиссар
United States
Madison
Wisconsin
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
When this came up in my subscriptions, I assumed you were encouraging random passers-by to flip the board of a game in progress. laugh
31 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
United States
Overland Park
Kansas
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
JohnRayJr wrote:
When this came up in my subscriptions, I assumed you were encouraging random passers-by to flip the board of a game in progress. laugh


Perhaps it would be wise to ask permission before flipping the board in the middle of a game.

Really though, when are we going to see some of the "original" game details?

3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Chris
United States
Cheektowaga
New York
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
JohnRayJr wrote:
When this came up in my subscriptions, I assumed you were encouraging random passers-by to flip the board of a game in progress. laugh


I would tip that!! Seeing as how I couldn't make it this year.
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Eric Summerer
United States
Hamden
Connecticut
flag msg tools
Check out my audiobooks!
badge
Will talk for food!
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I'll see if I can get close to a copy today, but the look of the "classic" side is the same as the "standard" side. There's no turn track on the right, but the market spaces are on the left. Hazard spaces are small starbursts in the proper colors.

The route modification on the left side of the board, which was incorporated in Dathkadan's redesign, IS part of the "classic" side.

Any specifics that you'd like to know about?
9 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
United States
Overland Park
Kansas
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
AmazingIntern wrote:
I'll see if I can get close to a copy today, but the look of the "classic" side is the same as the "standard" side. There's no turn track on the right, but the market spaces are on the left. Hazard spaces are small starbursts in the proper colors.

The route modification on the left side of the board, which was incorporated in Dathkadan's redesign, IS part of the "classic" side.

Any specifics that you'd like to know about?


Wow. That would be awesome to get some more info. You already answered one of my questions - no Dathkaden art. I was hoping he was involved somehow.

Overall, how close to the original will it be? Will the hazard penalties be dealt with by spending money or will they be dealt with based on the new version with ship upgrades?

Will there be a chit pull demand/market system or will it be the fluctuating market system from the new version? As the market track is the same on both sides, I'm guessing the market system will be the same for both versions.

Are there different ships for the classic version? Are they providing a separate set of components to play the two versions?

I'm sure will have additional questions. Thanks in advance Eric!
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Eric Summerer
United States
Hamden
Connecticut
flag msg tools
Check out my audiobooks!
badge
Will talk for food!
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Kevin in Kansas wrote:
AmazingIntern wrote:
I'll see if I can get close to a copy today, but the look of the "classic" side is the same as the "standard" side. There's no turn track on the right, but the market spaces are on the left. Hazard spaces are small starbursts in the proper colors.

The route modification on the left side of the board, which was incorporated in Dathkadan's redesign, IS part of the "classic" side.

Any specifics that you'd like to know about?


Wow. That would be awesome to get some more info. You already answered one of my questions - no Dathkaden art. I was hoping he was involved somehow.

Overall, how close to the original will it be? Will the hazard penalties be dealt with by spending money or will they be dealt with based on the new version with ship upgrades?

Will there be a chit pull demand/market system or will it be the fluctuating market system from the new version? As the market track is the same on both sides, I'm guessing the market system will be the same for both versions.

Are there different ships for the classic version? Are they providing a separate set of components to play the two versions?

I'm sure will have additional questions. Thanks in advance Eric!


The Classic game is nearly identical to the original game. The demand system is the same. The ships are the same. The hazards are the same. There is a set of components specifically for use with the Classic game (right down to a set of 1s and 5s for the demands, which work differently in the Standard game).

What is different? The planets are numbered 1-14, eliminating the As and Bs of the original. The factory goods have the same name as the basic good, and therefore can fulfill demands. In fact, some of the basic goods now have the name of the original version's factory good. The Colony World nav space is included, which some people consider to be a major change. There are some minor differences in the payouts for the fares.

EDIT: I just checked, and it does look like the starports are no longer named, which is a difference from the original as well. I can't figure out how to get the pics from my iPhone to BGG, but I did post a close-up of the Classic board on the Dice Tower's Facebook feed:
www.facebook.com/dicetower/
  • [+] Dice rolls
United States
Overland Park
Kansas
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Nice reporting Eric! I can't wait to try the new version and I hope it will promote more plays of the classic too. I'm glad to hear they were mostly true to the original with the "classic" side.

Soon to come will be the debate of which is the best version: AH original, Dathkaden fan version, FFG "classic", or FFG new version. At least there are a lot of options.

20 GeekGold to you (plus 1 GG donation)!

2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Tim Koppang
United States
Westmont
Illinois
flag msg tools
designer
publisher
"It's a magical world, Hobbes, ol' buddy..."
badge
"For the listener, who listens in the snow, and, nothing himself, beholds nothing that is not there and the nothing that is." -- Wallace Stevens
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I'm disappointed to hear that FF didn't go with the original version of the game for their "classic reprint." Let the version wars begin, I guess.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
jefF, There are some who call me... DuneKitteh
United States
Wood Dale
Illinois
flag msg tools
Dune Kitty really does love you, despite any asshattery.
badge
Useless rollover, booya! Dune Kitty says, "deal with it."
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Kevin in Kansas wrote:
20 GG plus any donations to the first person to post an image of the other side of the board at Gen Con!

I'll bump it to 50 GG plus donations if it's in the middle of game and you have video.





Too bad you didn't think of it earlier. There were a few times on Thursday and Friday that the demo wasn't being run and there weren't any components on the board and I would have been happy to do that. Oh well, guess we just have to wait now.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Chris Miller
United States
Katy
Texas
flag msg tools
Wow you hovered. I'm honored.
badge
My Dog Has Fleas
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
The Dice Tower Facebook page has a picture of the "Classic" side.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Joel Tamburo
United States
Justice
Illinois
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Sounds good so far.

The Colony World Navigation Circle and renaming factory goods so that they can benefit from Demand are both changes that have been in the fan community for a while. Renumbering the races to get rid of the 'a' and 'b' is logical and serves to reduce confusion over which races sell to which. The removal of spaceport site names does cut out a touch of flavor but also eliminates time spent hunting through deeds.

All in all nothing to get upset about. And remember that Stronghold had extensive input (per the agreement that was publicized) into this version so in all likelihood most if not all of this would have been in their edition as well.

I have to say that I am more interested actually in the game on the other side - I want to see how Pirates, Missions, Pilots and the like all work.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
United States
Overland Park
Kansas
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
midnightmadness wrote:
Kevin in Kansas wrote:
20 GG plus any donations to the first person to post an image of the other side of the board at Gen Con!

I'll bump it to 50 GG plus donations if it's in the middle of game and you have video.





Too bad you didn't think of it earlier. There were a few times on Thursday and Friday that the demo wasn't being run and there weren't any components on the board and I would have been happy to do that. Oh well, guess we just have to wait now.


Me too. I was hoping someone would post some info sooner. When it got down to crunch time, I had to go to drastic measures and try bribery.

1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Aaron Bredon
United States
Sunnyvale
California
flag msg tools
badge
mbmbmbmbmb
Joelist wrote:
Renumbering the races to get rid of the 'a' and 'b' is logical and serves to reduce confusion over which races sell to which.


Actually it is the other way around -- changing the numbers increases confusion or changes the game. In the original, goods from races 1a and 1b will sell to 2,3,4a, and 4b (2,3,4). In all cases, to find out where a good can be sold, remove any letters and it sells to the next three base numbers (which will be 4 or 5 races)

In the new numbering, to maintain the original selling pattern, goods from race 1 will sell to 3,4,5, and 6, skipping 2. This is confusing, as 4 races will skip a number in selling patterns, and the other 10 won't.

If you change the buying races to have race 1 goods sell to 2,3,4, and 5, you have changed the rules significantly. Although the game may feel similar, it is not the same, and will play differently for most race distributions. (also, in order to play the classic game, you now need a second set of goods tokens with the old selling pattern)
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Joel Tamburo
United States
Justice
Illinois
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
It's not an issue. All you need to do is look at the new goods counters - they have the buyers clearly marked with both number and unique symbol right on the front of the counter. So no need to change buying races or anything.

The 'a' / 'b' thing was a kludge AH inserted during development to try to combine the flat rules statement in rule 2.51 (that it is always the next three numbered cultures that buy) with the addition of races during development.

Now it is simpler. The rules simply state that the buying races are listed on the front of the Goods counter - which they are. So most goods in the new game have 4 buyers (just like in the AH game) while some have 5 (just like in the AH game).
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Tim Koppang
United States
Westmont
Illinois
flag msg tools
designer
publisher
"It's a magical world, Hobbes, ol' buddy..."
badge
"For the listener, who listens in the snow, and, nothing himself, beholds nothing that is not there and the nothing that is." -- Wallace Stevens
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I think saying that all goods sell at the next three numbers is pretty straightforward. Now everyone will have to constantly look at the chits. What once was a consistent rule that could be held in my head has now been blown up into a reference chart divided across multiple chits. The change (if I understand it correctly) obfuscates information.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Tim Koppang
United States
Westmont
Illinois
flag msg tools
designer
publisher
"It's a magical world, Hobbes, ol' buddy..."
badge
"For the listener, who listens in the snow, and, nothing himself, beholds nothing that is not there and the nothing that is." -- Wallace Stevens
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Joelist wrote:
The Colony World Navigation Circle and renaming factory goods so that they can benefit from Demand are both changes that have been in the fan community for a while.

I am always surprised to hear people brush off these changes, especially the extra Nav Circle, as "no big deal." Just because a certain group of fans changed the game, doesn't necessarily mean that the changes make the game better. I've played both ways and I'm not convinced. Part of the charm and challenge of the original board was that certain areas were tougher to get to -- and so making runs to the lefthand side of the board was a larger investment. Yes, the extra Nav Circle opens up that side of the board, but at the expense of making it feel (somewhat) more similar to the righthand side of the board. In addition, the random distribution of race tokens matters slightly less -- which in turns makes planning decisions at the beginning of the game less interesting.

It's not so large a change that I really get upset about it, but it just doesn't seem necessary. And it does have drawbacks that some people too quickly dismiss.

Quote:
I have to say that I am more interested actually in the game on the other side - I want to see how Pirates, Missions, Pilots and the like all work.

Completely understandable. I was excited to hear that FF was publishing their own version alongside the "classic" version. I'm just disappointed that the "classic" version isn't the "original" version that so many have been clamoring for.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Stefan Lopuszanski
United States
North Wales
Pennsylvania
flag msg tools
So hear me roar! RAWR! (Or ask me about it)
badge
Her Serenity, The Lady of Pain.
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
tckoppang wrote:
Joelist wrote:
The Colony World Navigation Circle and renaming factory goods so that they can benefit from Demand are both changes that have been in the fan community for a while.

I am always surprised to hear people brush off these changes, especially the extra Nav Circle, as "no big deal." Just because a certain group of fans changed the game, doesn't necessarily mean that the changes make the game better. I've played both ways and I'm not convinced. Part of the charm and challenge of the original board was that certain areas were tougher to get to -- and so making runs to the lefthand side of the board was a larger investment. Yes, the extra Nav Circle opens up that side of the board, but at the expense of making it feel (somewhat) more similar to the righthand side of the board. In addition, the random distribution of race tokens matters slightly less -- which in turns makes planning decisions at the beginning of the game less interesting.

It's not so large a change that I really get upset about it, but it just doesn't seem necessary. And it does have drawbacks that some people too quickly dismiss.

Quote:
I have to say that I am more interested actually in the game on the other side - I want to see how Pirates, Missions, Pilots and the like all work.

Completely understandable. I was excited to hear that FF was publishing their own version alongside the "classic" version. I'm just disappointed that the "classic" version isn't the "original" version that so many have been clamoring for.


I'm glad they included the Nav Circle -- if you don't want to use it you can always just house rule it. It is easier to cover it up or ignore it than put a piece of paper with the Nav Circle information on it.

Surprised that they left the station names off; that was always fun. Oh well, still seems like a decent reprint all things considered.
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Frank McNally
United States
Andover
Massachusetts
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Bummer about dropping the A/Bs on races. When looking at the board in the orginal one could see the race numbers and know what routes you might construct, now you need a chart (or to pick up a chit).

1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
United States
Overland Park
Kansas
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
AmazingIntern wrote:
EDIT: I just checked, and it does look like the starports are no longer named, which is a difference from the original as well. I can't figure out how to get the pics from my iPhone to BGG, but I did post a close-up of the Classic board on the Dice Tower's Facebook feed:
www.facebook.com/dicetower/


I uploaded the picture of the "classic" board in the image gallery with permission from Eric. This is Eric's phone pic taken at Gen Con 2012 and shown on the DiceTower Facebook page from the link above.




3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Eric Summerer
United States
Hamden
Connecticut
flag msg tools
Check out my audiobooks!
badge
Will talk for food!
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
FrankM wrote:
Bummer about dropping the A/Bs on races. When looking at the board in the orginal one could see the race numbers and know what routes you might construct, now you need a chart (or to pick up a chit).



I'm not sure I agree. Goods now deliver to the next four, and sometimes five, numbers in sequence. Those that had five sell locations in the original have five sell locations still. I think this is one of those changes that can cause you to bristle upon first hearing of it, but in practice I don't think it's going to be much of a change at all.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Scott Lewis
United States
Thornton
Colorado
flag msg tools
NFHS Football & Basketball
badge
Dread Our Coming, Suffer Our Presence, Embrace Our Glory (Solonavi War Cry)
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
AmazingIntern wrote:
FrankM wrote:
Bummer about dropping the A/Bs on races. When looking at the board in the orginal one could see the race numbers and know what routes you might construct, now you need a chart (or to pick up a chit).



I'm not sure I agree. Goods now deliver to the next four, and sometimes five, numbers in sequence. Those that had five sell locations in the original have five sell locations still. I think this is one of those changes that can cause you to bristle upon first hearing of it, but in practice I don't think it's going to be much of a change at all.

If the same "who sells to who" is preserved, there are some SLIGHT differences, as all the former "A"s would skip one; it wouldn't just be the next 4/5, but sometimes may skip one.

For instance, if 1a Nillis is changed to #1, and 1b Volois is #2, Nillis would not sell to Volois, but would instead sell to #3 (Graw), #4 (Niks), #5 (Dell) and #6 (Humans).

However, being a newbie at MoV myself, I personally don't think this will be an issue, either.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Joel Tamburo
United States
Justice
Illinois
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Um... No one said that they now deliver to the next four or five in sequence. In all likelihood the rules simply say that delivery is to the races on the counter and the races on the counter preserve the original selling sequences.
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Eric Summerer
United States
Hamden
Connecticut
flag msg tools
Check out my audiobooks!
badge
Will talk for food!
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Joelist wrote:
Um... No one said that they now deliver to the next four or five in sequence. In all likelihood the rules simply say that delivery is to the races on the counter and the races on the counter preserve the original selling sequences.


The goods do in fact deliver to the next four or five numbers in sequence. 1's Bionic Perfume delivers to 2-5. 2's Canned Traits delivers to 3-6, etc., with the goods from 8 and 11 going to a fifth number.
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Scott Lewis
United States
Thornton
Colorado
flag msg tools
NFHS Football & Basketball
badge
Dread Our Coming, Suffer Our Presence, Embrace Our Glory (Solonavi War Cry)
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
AmazingIntern wrote:
Joelist wrote:
Um... No one said that they now deliver to the next four or five in sequence. In all likelihood the rules simply say that delivery is to the races on the counter and the races on the counter preserve the original selling sequences.


The goods do in fact deliver to the next four or five numbers in sequence. 1's Bionic Perfume delivers to 2-5. 2's Canned Traits delivers to 3-6, etc., with the goods from 8 and 11 going to a fifth number.

Which means they changed the delivery sequence

I personally don't care, but I can see why purists would not like that change.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
1 , 2  Next »   | 
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.