Josiah Leis
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I spent 100 GG and all I got was this stupid overtext.....
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Introduction & Background

Before we get into things I think it is important to lay down where I’m coming from. I believe that there is no such thing as an “objective” review, and that all reviews are just people’s subjective opinions. As such I find it helpful to know a bit about reviewers to understand where they are coming from and where I may have similarities or dissimilarities with their various viewpoints. My bullet point reviews are designed to do just that, giving you an overview of my feelings on a game. I don’t get into rules, as there are other reviews that do that much better, so I am assuming you are at least somewhat familiar with 2nd Edition Descent and how it plays. So then, a frame of reference:

1. Understand that I like games. I like all games, Euro Games, Ameritrash Games, Wargames, Party Games, Roleplaying Games (though I’ve only dabbled there), Video Games, everything. My collection is mostly Ameritrash, I know lots of people who have large Euro collections and I play\borrow many of them.

2. Know that I LOVE Descent. It was one of the first board games I ever bought, purchased because I played and enjoyed Doom a great deal. I eventually sold Doom, simply because Descent had replaced it for me. I’ve played nearly every quest from the base game and all expansions, and done multiple campaigns of both Road to Legend and Sea of Blood. So yeah, to say the least I am a fan of First Edition Descent.

3. Understand that despite being a huge fan of Descent 1st Edition, I know it has its warts. Skill cards aren’t balanced against each other, threat costs on cards is screwed up, spawning is too cheap threat wise, treachery cards aren’t balanced against one another, player scaling is non-existent, bloated rules, etc. So when they first announced 2nd Edition Descent back in August of 2011 I was incredibly excited. This was exactly what I’d been hoping they would do and I couldn’t be more thrilled with the prospect of a 2nd Edition for Descent, plus a sweet conversion kit to bring over all my old monsters and heroes. I can say quite honestly that I have NEVER been this excited for the release of a game, except perhaps the original World of Warcraft (certainly never this excited for any board game).

4. Understand that as previews came out for the Second Edition I started to have some reservations. While there was a lot that looked cool, many things looked rather odd. However I tried to save all judgment until I’d actually played it, and decided to pre-order it and the conversion kit regardless, figuring that it was Descent and it was FFG, how could I go wrong?

5. Know that I am a massive FFG fanboy. I love nearly every game of theirs that I have ever purchased or bought. I love the shiny components, the loads of theme, and just in general I really, really like their company. The majority of my games are FFG games and they get the lion’s share of my hobby money. Also note that II am a large fan of the Terrinoth universe, and own every Terrinoth game made.

6. Finally understand that after patiently waiting for what seemed like a very long time (my pre-order was delayed by the Conversion Kit, and delayed further by Miniature Market who I’ve normally had good experiences with being rather dumb) I finally got to play. This review is after playing 2 quests by myself trying to play both sides objectively, and then finally starting a campaign with 4 friends (1E Descent veterans all of them) and playing through First Blood (the intro quest) and 3 Act I quests in a lengthy 10 hour marathon session.

Now having a frame of reference for where I’m coming from, my humble thoughts and opinions....

Things I Loved

New Map Tiles

The new map tiles are way cool. The flashy art on them looks incredibly good and makes the 1E tiles look very boring by comparison. I also really like that they are double-sided with both indoor and outdoor. Finally having them all numbered and being able to see those numbers clearly in the quest guide was a big help in map setup and something that I am really, really glad they did.

Relics

I really thought it was cool how various quests would grant either the heroes or the overlord (depending on which side won) a relic that could be used later in the campaign. It was just a really cool concept and I really like how it played out.


Things I liked

Attributes (besides the wonky distributions)

I really liked the inclusion of attribute tests and what they added to the game. It differentiated heroes, added more narrative, and gave the overlord more thoughts about various cards. This would’ve easily been a thing I “loved” were it not for the wonky distributions. Smarter people than me have calculated them and they work out to be:

1: 11.1%
2: 22.2%
3: 52.8%
4: 72.2%
5: 91.7%

The massive jump in your chance of success from an attribute of 2 to an attribute of 3 is just silly. It makes it so the overlord knows never to play a card on a hero with an attribute of 3 or higher, and similarly the heroes don’t want to attempt quest based attribute tests unless they have an attribute of at least 3. It was also kind of odd that an attribute of 5 meant that you are practically immune. I really, really loved the inclusion of attribute tests, but the strange distribution in the odds knocked it down from a thing I “loved” to a thing I only “liked”, because they removed a lot of the thought and decision making from things involving them.

Defense Dice

Overall I liked the defense dice. Several member of my group did not, truthfully pointing out that it made combat even more luck based and random. I however, enjoyed them. It was kind of fun as the defender, felt like you could try to “do something” to impede the attack against you. And I liked that even the toughest\weakest target could still be hurt\unhurt by any attack, even if it was a slim chance. As far as FFG’s reasoning of reducing the tendency to “math out” attacks though, that was completely untrue. All 5 of us continued to calculate the odds of our attacks beforehand, it just took slightly longer to do because of the addition of the defense dice. All in all though it was a change I enjoyed.


See Below

Monster Abilities

As the overlord I liked that monsters could now spend surges to power various effects. I also enjoyed that some of them could use various “actions” besides just moving and attacking. It helped make the monsters even more unique and opened up some neat new possibilities.

Hero Feats

I really like the heroic feats as it was yet another way of distinguishing heroes and they gave some cool new options. The only thing that was a little strange about them was there was sort of a “use it, use it now” mentality with them, since they came back in the 2nd encounter and each encounter is so short. I was thinking it would be a bit more of a “wait for the right moment”, but instead it was very much a “quick use it before the encounter is over” type feeling. This knocked it down from something I loved to something I liked.

Overlord’s flexibility in choosing monsters

I liked the concept of “open groups” that would still fit the feel of the quest, but yet give the overlord the flexibility to get all sorts of monsters to the table. So you could see a Dragon or Chaos Beast or whatever. This did lead to a bit of AP on the part of the overlord (me) before each quest, but it would probably be helped if you let the heroes setup the map while you choose your monsters (since the quest guide is all public info anyhow).

Heroes choose their skills

I like that heroes got to choose their skills instead of drawing them randomly. This at least implied that the skills were balanced (though they don’t always seem to be), and I liked the flexibility and choice that this gave the heroes.

New Art

I used to play WoW and am a fan of the obviously inspired art style from there. I also appreciate the lack of chainmail bikinis.

Heroes take two half-actions rather than “declare” beforehand.

I didn’t know that I would like this change, but I did. It felt easier and I think helped reduce hero AP.

Things I thought were rather “meh” snore


Conditions as cards instead of tokens

I don’t know who thought that having a card in front of you was less “fiddly” than having a token a tenth its size, but I would tend to disagree. Also having the rules in front of you wasn’t really as helpful as I thought it’d be, we still got into a lengthy discussion over Stunned which apparently we aren’t alone on judging by the forums. Plus, we’d all memorized what each condition did after the 1st time we saw it in play, so no one was ever referencing a condition card anyhow. Overall I felt like they added more clutter than they helped and would rather have had more treasure cards in their place and just use tokens instead.

Classes

Though I liked heroes choosing their skills, having to choose a “class” to play seemed a little odd, especially as this wasn’t ever in any Terrinoth game before. It struck me as very MMOish which wasn’t really what I was looking for from Descent. I didn’t mind it too bad, but I do hate the fact that your class determines your starting equipment. This seems silly and limiting (for instance it prevents One Fist from ever being a beserker). I wish they at least gave you a choice in your starting equipment, based on your Archtype or something.


Things I disliked

Searching

Searching was.....well a bit boring. It rarely seemed to be worth the action it took to do it (and in fact if you weren’t playing the campaign in which you need the gold I can’t imagine it would be), and never felt very exciting to spend an entire action and draw a potion. Instead of the “Oh kewl, phat lewts!” feeling of seeing a chest as in 1E, it was like a “Well I guess we should go get that at some point because we’ll need the gold after this quest."

Saving cards to play in the 2nd Encounter and delaying in the 1st was the best OL strategy

This is sad but true in my experience. Playing cards in the first encounter was just a waste, but saving them and just trying to stall and drag out the 1st encounter seemed the way to go. With no hand limit you could build up a pretty impressive number of them to go into the 2nd Encounter with, and even if the heroes did well you could really smack down on them in the 2nd Encounter of the quest.

Tomble

Seriously? I mean seriously? No mention of gnomes, halflings, hobbits, or any other irritating short people in any Terrinoth game and now they randomly decide to throw them in? This is a minor quibble I know, but it did really irk me.

Quests objectives are largely luck based

I was amazed at how many of the quests had objectives which were so hugely luck dependant. A bad die roll or two and things could very rapidly get out of hand for one side or the other.

Objectives instead of Conquest

I was excited when I first heard how each quest was going to have its own story related objectives for each side. I never minded the conquest system, but this sounded like an interesting change. Sadly though after a few quests it all felt very “samey”. They all boiled down to a simple race of “do X before the overlord does Y”, and despite whatever narrative spin they gave it, I was amazed at how incredibly similar each quest seemed.

Setup time is too long for how short encounters are

Setup time is a funny thing. I generally justify it based on how long the game is. Twilight Imperium takes a long time to setup. But the game takes so long that the setup feels “worth it”. Dominion is a game I like, but sometimes the setup in it takes so long compared to how quick the game is it feels like I spend more time setting up than I do playing. Descent 2E had that feel too it. I felt like I spent nearly as much time tearing down and building maps as I did playing on them. Thus even though the setup time in Descent 2E is shorter than 1E (due mainly to smaller maps), the encounters are over so quickly it seemed like by the time they were finished I had a feeling of “Hey I was just starting to play with that!”.

Those not interested in a campaign game need not apply

I cannot imagine ever wanting to play a one-off quest of Descent 2E. The game is obviously built for campaign mode, which though I’m glad they included it and I am a fan of, seems to be the exclusive focus of the game. Playing a one-off quest is just entirely unsatisfying, Epic variant or no. There is no growth, exploration, or development. You just grab your stuff and go. And remember not to waste time searching since it isn’t worth it if you aren’t in a campaign.

No exploration

All of my heroes said they missed this. The feeling of “Ooo, what’s behind this door?”. Even the Advanced campaign of 1E had this since the levels were randomly drawn. Since the quest guide is all public knowledge, the heroes all know what they are in for before they get there, and once the map is setup everything is revealed at the start anyhow.

Pre-Printed Terrain on the Map Tiles

I get that they did this to save on setup time, and it did help a little. However since I had all of 1E organized into Plano boxes anyway, it didn’t really help setup time all that much and because all the terrain was pre-printed on the map tiles it sometimes gave the various maps a repetitive feel. Like “Oh yeah this room......again..”

Not that fast

I was expecting from all the reports and previews for the game to be much faster than it was. It was taking us an average of almost 3 hours per quest, this from a group that could play 1E quests in about 4-5 hours, depending on the size of the quest. It didn’t seem like gameplay itself was any faster, just that the quest were smaller and therefore shorter. In other words a game round took the same amount of time, there were just fewer of them.

Die-standup-die cycle

This has been mentioned elsewhere, but I will repeat it again here. It is annoying in that if your hero is knocked out, when they revive they get very little health. This makes them incredibly prone to being smacked down again. And since each time you die the OL draws a card it creates a vicious cycle of dying, standing up only to die again. This cycle is very, very hard to break.

Things I hated yuk

New LoS

Okay I will try to put this nicely. Adding these new LoS rules to Descent was without question the stupidest decision ever made in the history of game design....... They are NOT intuitive, nor simpler, are far less tactical, and create way more confusing situations than they help fix. These rules make LoS utterly irrelevant. Everyone can see everyone else. Tactical positioning is of no importance what so ever. You just stand around and throw dice at one another. If they wanted to “streamline” the LoS rules, what they should have done was gone to a very simple tile based LoS system, ala Gears of War, Castle Ravenloft, Claustraphobia, etc. It would’ve accomplished very much the same thing in a far simpler manner without presenting the illusion that Line of Sight or positioning were at all important. This one change alone gutted the game of a huge amount of tactical depth. A terrible, terrible, change.

No Threat

Stepping backwards into the Doom system of playing every card that comes into your hand was a step in the wrong direction. Threat needed fixed, not removed. This completely removed the choice of “which” card to play, which was one of my favorite parts of being the Overlord. I still don’t see how some people thought that threat was too “fiddly” or that the two seconds it took to grab the tokens bogged the game down somehow. This change really dumbed down the role of the Overlord.

Fewer options and tactical choices

I like board games that present me with decisions. Specifically decisions that are meaningful (meaning that they have a significant impact on my chances of winning), interesting (meaning that each option is compelling and equally valid), and varied. Descent 1E, for all its many flaws was chalk full of them. Descent 2E in its effort to rid itself of those flaws, has unfortunately gutted much of the decision making at the same time. There simply aren’t as many decisions to be in made in Second Edition, and the ones that are there have a tendency to be fairly obvious (the opposite of Interesting) or irrelevant (the opposite of meaningful) and often time repetitive (the opposite of varied).


Conclusion: I disliked it

In the end Descent 2nd Edition was a huge flop for me and my group. Two members of my group have basically said they never want to play it again and will only play 1st Edition from now on. Myself and one other are willing to give it another chance, hoping to either house-rule it or figure out what it is we are missing. However all of us had a hugely disappointing experience with it. It seems as though the game was designed with a different audience in mind, specifically those people that did not like 1st Edition.

One of my friends I was playing with said “It feels like it’s ‘Descent For Dummies’, like a dumbed down version of itself.” Sadly his words echo my own thoughts. The level of tactical decision making in the game has been lowered incredibly, yet the game still takes up a fairly lengthy chunk of time. It has also lost the “feel” of Descent, in fact it has lost any feel of a “dungeon crawl” whatsoever. Instead it feels like a not-so-tactical tactical minis game. If I want a tactical mini’s game I’ll go play Earth Reborn. If I want a light-hearted and much faster dungeon crawl (a “beer and pretzels game” if you will) I’ll go play Dungeon Run or Dungeonquest. Descent Second Edition seems too long to be a “light” game and too simple to be a “heavy” game. Like it falls in an odd no-man’s land where I’m not sure when I’d want to play it.

Overall Descent Second Edition is easily the most disappointing FFG game I have ever purchased (or any game for that matter). Not necessarily because I hated it (I only disliked it), but just because I had such huge hopes for the game and was expecting to love it the way I did the first time I played Descent First Edition. I am sure Tom Vassel is quite right in that it will replace 1st Edition and become the new "thing". However I think this is just the nature of an in-print game vs. an out of print game, not because it is superior.

Recommendations

I either hated, did not like, or did not play because it took too long 1E Descent

Go buy this game right now. It is a game that has been designed with your specific audience in mind and no other. I have no doubt this will be everything Descent 1E wasn’t to you, and that you will love it. FFG has made this game expressly for you .

I did like 1st Edition Descent, is this one worth it?

For goodness sake no. Whatever you do don’t buy this, or at least try it first. This is not Descent at all, it is in fact not even a dungeon crawl. It is a dice rolling mini’s game that is designed to be played over a 20 hour campaign. It has not kept the “feel” of Descent at all and is a different game entirely.

I like the D&D Boardgames (Castle Ravenloft, etc.), but am looking for something slightly heavier.

This may be just the ticket and I would encourage you to check it out. It is very simple like the Castle Ravenloft games, and may be a new dungeon crawl you’d be interested in if you like those game.

I’ve never played any of the game previously mentioned, but am looking for a tactical minis game or a good dungeon crawl.

I cannot honestly recommend this game for either of those. If you want a tactical minis game, get Earth Reborn. It is an amazing game with a great theme and loads of great tactical decision making. If you want a dungeon crawl, well this isn’t one. I’d recommend Descent 1E, though it is out of print and therefore expensive. Dungeon Run is a fun dungeon crawl if you’re just looking for a light “beer-n-pretzels” game, as is Dungeonquest. Though both of those are light-hearted slapstick dungeon exploration. Claustrophobia is an exceptional dungeon-crawl game as well, with a lot more thought in it.



Sorry this all got so long, thanks if you read (or skimmed) any or all of it. I am not quite willing to give up on the game yet. One of my friends is at least willing to play again and I think we will try it and see if there is something we are missing. I just can't kick a game out that I was so sure I'd love so quickly. Happy gaming .

*Edit* I forgot to add an important point about player scaling. Basically 1E Descent did not scale with different numbers of heroes, it became much harder for the heroes if you played with less than 4. Frankly, I don't think that has changed with 2nd Edition (though I don't think it is as bad as in 1E). The game is still designed to be played with 4 heroes, and if you play with less you are gimping the hero's side (especially if you play with only 2). This isn't really a problem for me, as I'd always play with 4 heroes anyway, even if I'm the only one on the hero team. I just find it more interesting. But if you are one who does not like to always play with 4 heroes even if it means someone has to control multiples, then it is an issue worth pointing out.

*Additional Edit*

Upon further playing (thanks entirely to the excellent VASSAL module made by
Bryan Livingston
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big thank you for that Bryan),

I have decided that I do not like the Defense Dice after all. Perhaps it isn't just their fault though, but the combat dice in general are incredibly swingy and they contribute to that problem. One attack I can fail to even scratch a hero\monster, and the next I can one-shot them from full health, all without changing what I am attacking with and neither attack having missed. That wild unpredictability in combat only adds to the already luck-based nature of most of the quests, and once again contribute to the feeling of "Well we make a few decisions (most of which are incredibly obvious or repetitive), but it all just comes down to the dice anyway (either in combat, or the dice related to the quest objective)."
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Mr G
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Outstanding review.

Well balanced arguments and a killer conclusion.

I won't say I agree or disagree but your piece allows readers to get a valuable insight.
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David McCallum
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I own everything 1E, I may just keep it that way. Still kinda on the fence.shake
 
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Michael Hancock-Parmer
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Absolutely the best review of Descent 2e on the forum. You will be saving people a lot of money. I think you nailed it right here:
Quote:
This is not Descent at all, it is in fact not even a dungeon crawl. It is a dice rolling mini’s game that is designed to be played over a 20 hour campaign. It has not kept the “feel” of Descent at all and is a different game entirely.
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Michael Hancock-Parmer
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And I say this as a fellow lover of Descent 1e and the Advanced Campaigns (Road to Legend, Sea of Blood). One could easily houserule the best parts of Descent 2e into 1e - something I'm interested in doing for those friends not excited about committing to a serious game of Descent 1e.
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Bryce K. Nielsen
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I've had very similar reactions, though still giving the game the benefit of the doubt and trying more quests. I do think it's ironic that one of the main "improvements" of Descent over Doom was Threat, and that was one of the things they got rid of when they made Descent "better" with Second Edition.

Have you played with the Conversion Kit? Not to sound like an apologist, but adding a bunch of additional options in heroes/monsters seems to have breathed some life into the game.

-shnar
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Josiah Leis
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I spent 100 GG and all I got was this stupid overtext.....
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Thanks for all of the positive comments, they are appreciated. I am glad to hear people enjoyed the review.

For the record, yes were playing with the conversion kit the entire time and I agree it feels almost like a "must have". There aren't very many monsters in the base game if I hadn't had the conversion kit I would've felt very limited in my monster options as the Overlord. Ah well, that's inflation for you I guess. If someone does decide to get the game, I'd say the conversion kit is an absolute must, even if you don't own anything of 1E. Just use proxies and have fun with the loads more options.
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Lothar Neu
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I own Descent 1 (no expansions) and I never liked the game, it was just too long and monotone in my opinion. (I was always the Overlord....)

But there is something about the second Edition that doesn't feel right, too.

Could it be the quests are not quest enough to be played alone?
And the campaign is not campaign enough to be called so?

Could that be the main disappointment about the new edition?
The quests are just too much do X before Y happens and not enough good "get to the boss"?

The usual length of each encounter should be around 8 turns, I guess.
So I can really see the point that there is not enough depth in your decision making.

Maybe time to wait for Road to Legends 2.0.
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Frank Franco
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Cool review. Almost inspires me to write my own.
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Great review!

I was actually hoping you would review this game because, a few years back, your World of Warcraft: The Boardgame reviews convinced me of purchasing the SoW and BC expansions; thanks to those, WoW has become one of my favorite games of all time.

But, I think I'm gonna pass on Descent for now.
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Andrew Bird
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Bullet points, huh? More like bullet paragraphs!

Seriously: many thanks for writing up your thoughts on the game. As mentioned, it was indeed rather a long read, but well worth the effort of doing so. Much like Descent 1E...
whistle
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Ryan M
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I have to say, an excellent review.

We played this today for the first time, and I read this tonight - but you basically read my mind. A couple of the things on your like list I hadn't thought about but definitely liked. My only disagreement would be defense dice. I feel like they were a bit too swingy. I would have preferred more people having access to the bad one to distinguish tanks more. Or removed the 3 shield from the grey die.


Overall though, very disappointed. Coming from a similar, AT, FFG, Descent loving perspective and at a similar point in our campaign. But no, this is definitely a miss.
 
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Josiah Leis
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I spent 100 GG and all I got was this stupid overtext.....
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killjoy00 wrote:

We played this today for the first time, and I read this tonight - but you basically read my mind. A couple of the things on your like list I hadn't thought about but definitely liked. My only disagreement would be defense dice. I feel like they were a bit too swingy. I would have preferred more people having access to the bad one to distinguish tanks more. Or removed the 3 shield from the grey die.


Yeah like I said in my review, not everyone in my group was a fan of the defense dice. Basically 2 of us liked them, 2 of us hated them (for the same reasons you listed) and 1 was "meh". I do wish there had been more variation in the heroes defense dice. I think out of the 50+ heroes there is like 2 who have black dice and 2 or 3 who have brown. All the rest are Grey and that seems way to "samey" to me (like you say no difference between tanks and mages).
 
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Josiah Leis
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I spent 100 GG and all I got was this stupid overtext.....
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Mr Skeletor wrote:
Cool review. Almost inspires me to write my own.


Do it!

Also note that if you do, please inform us ahead of time as I'd like to establish a betting pool on the amount of profanity it will contain beforehand .
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Tommi Karjalainen
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Amazing review and perfectly summarises my thoughts! I already sold away my Descent 2E after playing it about ten times. It's just too basic and simple for our game group, but still too complex for playing with childrens.
 
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Nick Dekoulis
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i respectfully disagree!

No i haven't played 1Ed. and my last Dungeon Crawling game was Heroquest when i was a kid.

But i am a regular RPG player and because of that i like very much this game!

sure it not an rpg, but it has the feeling..
it is a Must! for a nice and relaxing Evening with your friends (and for ppl who have no idea about RPG and complex BG, example: Girlfriends)

and it gives you the change to create some stories for your own.

i think you judge the game very hard because you had played and liked the 1ed.

its like edition in RPG's... old gamers hate the new edition cause its something new and change the game the loved and have used to it.
and new players love it cause its a new experience for them!

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CanCon, BunnyCon...BorderCon!!!
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Great Review - deserves a lot more thumbs than the current 18 (suspect it is due to timing as this is the 6th review in 18 days).

Thanks for sharing your opinions and experiences.
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Carlos R
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Great review! I like how you can accept that there are people who definitely like the game. Me? I really wanted to like it, but I just can't for many of the reasons you've stated. Compared to its predecessor, this version feels like "Risk: Descent edition". Not a good thing in my book, but Risk is also loved by many many people I know, so...
 
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Adam
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Great review!

About Tomble, don't forget that Descent: Tomb of Ice had Okaluk and Rakash, so it's not as though halflings are unprecidented.
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Daniel Geuss
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This review makes me glad I never played Descent First Edition. Ignorance is bliss.
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Bob Holmstrom
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Great review.

Points you made that i agree with:

1. LOS. The corner to corner LOS works great in "Mansions of Madness." It sucks for Descent. I'm thinking of house ruling "Earth Reborn's" LOS rules in.

2. Campaign only. Playing "one off" quests seems pointless.

3. Lack of tactical choices. Definately fewer choices in 2nd Ed.

4. No exploration. They should've went the "Mansions" route and had seperate Hero and OL Quest guides.

Points i disagree with:

1. Setup time. Super fast expecially compared to 1st ed.

2. Play time. First game with 5 players all playing for the first time, it took us under 2 hours to play "A Fat Goblin."

3. Tomble. Every fantasy game should have halfling or gnome thiefs.



 
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Zach Tedford
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Aganazer wrote:
This review makes me glad I never played Descent First Edition. Ignorance is bliss.


Implying that buying it would have been a bad decision? Love that game, I still recommend buying, even at the ungodly prices it is going for.
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Zach Tedford
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Kartigan wrote:



Conclusion: I disliked it



Sad but true cry, I'm glad you wrote this review(very nicely done). It explains most if not all of the issues that we griped about.

I can't really consider this game anything but a flop. How can is an unbalanced, luck(more than the original) based game, that often(if not always) finds the heros losing, not a complete failure?

I'm a Descent fanboy for life, so now I'll go play 1e and look forward to 3e!
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Dustin Whitmire
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Pilot Point
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Never played 1E. wanted to, but it was out of print by the time I had an interest.

I like this game; though I agree with you on most of what you listed. Personally, I don't think the set-up is long and I don't have a problem with the LOS other than to say that it does feel almost entirely irrelevant from a tactical perspective.

I can understand how searching is dissatisfying for a 1E player, but I don't mind the different take on it in 2E.

You want to know one of my big qualms? It's kind of silly, but it's a peeve of mine; whoever wrote the quest dialogue did the corniest job. I hate reading it as an OL. I feel like I might as well have a clown horn that I honk after each paragraph.
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Dustin Whitmire
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"I win this round, heros. So sorry. Still, I couldn't have done it without you - I'll need loyal subjects like you when I become king, you know. So... I think I'll let you live. For now."

(honk clown horn twice)

REWARDS
Win or lose .......
If the heros......
If the overlord.....
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