C Schref
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We've played 4-5 games now and every single one the person playing Lannister got smashed by Greayjoy, Tyrell, Baratheon, a combination of them three, or all three of them. I know some of you are going to say, "just make an alliance with...", but why would anyone do it? There is no real incentive for a majority of the houses to side with Lannister as far as I can tell.

Like I said, we've only played about 5 games, but almost all of them ended the same for Lannister which is: 1-2 castles and almost no units left.

The first game we played I was Lannister and I missed winning on the final turn just barely, but it was our first game and we had no real strategy.

Oh well, still a very fun game. Just not for Lannister, lol.
 
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Sean D.
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Lannister-Greyjoy Alliance is quite powerful. I was Lannister, just missed victory by a thread, my ally won as Greyjoy.
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Kevin Corbett
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I've won as Lanister quite a few times and we all play to win!!!
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Chris K.
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Schref wrote:
We've played 4-5 games now and every single one the person playing Lannister got smashed by Greayjoy, Tyrell, Baratheon, a combination of them three, or all three of them. I know some of you are going to say, "just make an alliance with...", but why would anyone do it? There is no real incentive for a majority of the houses to side with Lannister as far as I can tell.

Like I said, we've only played about 5 games, but almost all of them ended the same for Lannister which is: 1-2 castles and almost no units left.

The first game we played I was Lannister and I missed winning on the final turn just barely, but it was our first game and we had no real strategy.

Oh well, still a very fun game. Just not for Lannister, lol.


So, in those games where that happened ... did the ones smashing Lannister win?

In our games they rarely do.
If they do in your games, I wonder how the remaining players didn't use the advantage that people being busy with the Lannisters gives them. Smashing the Lannisters is always something that the players on the other side of the Smashers allow, and quite frankly I wonder why they would do that, if it benefits the Smasher more than themselves.

And if they didn't win, why do they still think smashing the Lannisters is a good and sound plan?
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Martin Presley
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chrisdk wrote:
So, in those games where that happened ... did the ones smashing Lannister win?

In our games they rarely do.
If they do in your games, I wonder how the remaining players didn't use the advantage that people being busy with the Lannisters gives them. Smashing the Lannisters is always something that the players on the other side of the Smashers allow, and quite frankly I wonder why they would do that, if it benefits the Smasher more than themselves.

And if they didn't win, why do they still think smashing the Lannisters is a good and sound plan?


This is very true; I think there's some groupthink going on that is stopping people from thinking of not attacking Lannister. Just because Lannister is vulnerable doesn't mean it's always good to go after him.

I will agree that Lannister is probably the most vulnerable, and therefore most difficult house to play. But that doesn't mean they're bad, just that they take more effort.
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C Schref
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Yea, maybe the strategies will change the more games we play, but right now it seems to be "kill Lannister!"

To answer your questions who won, the first game Tyrell won and she didn't really attack Lannister until the final turn (actually she may not have attacked me at all). One game went to Baratheon who attacked Lannister the entire game (along with Greyjoy). Another game went to Stark. Everyone ignored him and killed Lannister while he expanded, built a huge army, and marched South on the final few turns. I believe the other game went to Greyjoy who basically took over all of Lannister's land.

Lannister did actually win one game, but that was a 3 player game so I didn't count it, lol.

You are definitely right though. People seem to ignore taking advantage of other people being so aggressive against Lannisters now that I think about it (Really that seems to be the case all over the map. Only 2 of the 5-6 people that usually play seem to have a strategy. Everyone else just does minor things and waits for something to happen where they can sneak in for the victory soblue). Somehow I'm going to have to change the minds of my friends who like to focus on one player, lol. cry

Also, how did you convince Greyjoy to ally with you?
 
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Zachary Bardou
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Lannister won one of the PBFs I modded. Number 22 I believe (or 26).
 
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Sean D.
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Schref wrote:
Also, how did you convince Greyjoy to ally with you?


As Lannister I told Greyjoy "Look, we can spend the whole game fighting each other and I can Guarantee that you won't win - even if I die, but if we join forces then for sure one of us will win" It worked out well, I had 6 Castles and screwed up on my attack that would have won me the game in turn 8, then Greyjoy ended up winning in turn 10 after completely annihilating Stark.
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Rayne Smith
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Schref wrote:
Also, how did you convince Greyjoy to ally with you?


I think this is one of the easiest alliances to set up and convince players of accepting. If Greyjoy doesn't have to worry about Lannister, it can set him up to focus on taking on the Starks. Each player knowns that the other isn't a threat.... until that player is 1 castle away from victory. That is when the backstabbing begins... devil
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Cheza Moonmaiden
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First a question: How many players fight for the Throne in your group?

Then a hint: The Stony Sept is the most important territory for house Lannister. Similar to Blackwater, The Reach and the Dornish Marshes, it's adjacent to at least 6 other territories. One support order in this territory can quite easily secure Lannisport, Riverruin and Harrenhal.

The real problem is that you can't expand from that position without an alliance of any kind. You can't attack Crackclaw Point, as it can be supported from three sea areas and King's Landing. You can't attack Seaguard as Greyjoy will defend this spot at any cost. You would need an alliance with house Stark. Blackwater would be a really nice territory to threaten the other houses, but there is no way to hold it against 3 adjacent enemy strongholds/fortresses. So you need another alliance or war to get it.

If you play them well AND aren't suffering too much from Westeros events, you can keep your position quite well. The most important track will either be the King's Court track, followed by a good position in the Fiefdom track or vice versa. The Iron Throne track is less significant as your main enemies - Greyjoy and Tyrell would benefit quite well if you act before them.

But still, the Lannisters are in a bad position. It's quite a nice idea to ally with house Martell and flank the Tyrells from the Searoad Marshes and The Boneway. But the Martells will most likely concentrate on Storm's End and Starfall. To go north, you would have to ally with house stark and the would have to control Moat Cailin and the Bay of Ice, but they will rather concentrate on The Narrow Sea.

They also suffer from the fact that Baratheon is in control of whether or not every player is allowed to recruit. Both: House Martell and House Greyjoy wouldn't be able to recruit otherwise. But Baratheon will usually choose the recruit option as they won't have early access to territories with supply marker and benefit from a large amount of sea areas (good places for one-point armies).
 
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William Dearborn
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Kaic wrote:
Schref wrote:
Also, how did you convince Greyjoy to ally with you?


I think this is one of the easiest alliances to set up and convince players of accepting. If Greyjoy doesn't have to worry about Lannister, it can set him up to focus on taking on the Starks. Each player knowns that the other isn't a threat.... until that player is 1 castle away from victory. That is when the backstabbing begins... devil


The backstabbing for Greyjoy should come as soon as Stark is "in check". You should never wait until somebody is one castle from victory, because by then it is often too late. Backstabbing for Lannister should come the very instant that Greyjoy is vulnerable. There is usually only one or two opportunities for Lannister to betray Greyjoy successfully (unless Greyjoy isn't very good). Again: DON'T WAIT UNTIL THEY ONLY NEED 1 CASTLE (or even 2 castles) TO WIN - It's a sure-fire way to lose.
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Rayne Smith
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Feral_Knight wrote:

The backstabbing for Greyjoy should come as soon as Stark is "in check". You should never wait until somebody is one castle from victory, because by then it is often too late. Backstabbing for Lannister should come the very instant that Greyjoy is vulnerable. There is usually only one or two opportunities for Lannister to betray Greyjoy successfully (unless Greyjoy isn't very good). Again: DON'T WAIT UNTIL THEY ONLY NEED 1 CASTLE (or even 2 castles) TO WIN - It's a sure-fire way to lose.


I was actually stating it the other way around, when you are 1 castle away from winning you backstab. If they are getting close then obviously you need to attack them early, but if they are getting close to victory you should be too.
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Vaclav Sinclair
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Top Ten Tips for Lannister Victory

d10-0 Use the Raven
d10-1 Abuse the Raven devil
d10-2 Make your enemies fear Gregor Clegane and his absurd 3 swords.
d10-3 Always be mustering
d10-4 Don't make too many ships
d10-5 Take Blackwater
d10-6 Make footmen. Lots of footmen
d10-7 Beware Loras
d10-8 If Greyjoy is breathing down your neck--enlist Stark aid. Remember, he hates the Greyjoys as much as you do, and doesn't want the Kraken to have 4 strongholds.
d10-9 Always plan for the worst and leave a retreat route open. There aren't as many house cards with swords as you might think.
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Alex Rockwell
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Hector131 wrote:
Lannister-Greyjoy Alliance is quite powerful. I was Lannister, just missed victory by a thread, my ally won as Greyjoy.


Greyjoy demolishing lannister instead is even more powerful for them, and sucks for lannister.
 
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Chris K.
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Alexfrog wrote:
Hector131 wrote:
Lannister-Greyjoy Alliance is quite powerful. I was Lannister, just missed victory by a thread, my ally won as Greyjoy.


Greyjoy demolishing lannister instead is even more powerful for them, and sucks for lannister.


As usual: I disagree. I have yet to see a game where Greyjoy wins after demolishing Lannister in any but the most newby filled games. I have however seen plenty of games where Greyjoy or Lannister won after keeping a peace for most of the game or at least having only limited fights over specific resources.
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Luke O'Hearn
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Schref wrote:
We've played 4-5 games now and every single one the person playing Lannister got smashed by Greayjoy, Tyrell, Baratheon, a combination of them three, or all three of them. I know some of you are going to say, "just make an alliance with...", but why would anyone do it? There is no real incentive for a majority of the houses to side with Lannister as far as I can tell.


They can't all three of them win. You should be able to convince one or two of them that they need you alive and healthy enough to maintain a front with the third and keep them from running away with the game.

If your opponents are too green or short sighted to understand this, maybe you can't win. But good players will not give the game to the leader - they would sooner help out the leaders enemies (in this case Lannister).
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Tony
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The way I like to sell it to Greyjoy is this:

"This is a room full of people looking to kill each other. We're in the middle. We can roll around on the floor punching each other while everyone else sharpens their knives, or we can stand back to back and be a force in both directions."

Seems to usually get the point across.
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Shezmaine
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Or you can play the 5 player variant without Greyjoy, Pyke Impassable and Seagard downgraded to a castle. (After all, the Greyjoys are more like Wildlings, they never had a real shot at the Iron throne, they're just irritating piratical raiders like the Brotherhood)

Then, with the Starks far to the North and plenty of castles nearby, you'll be THE force to be feared, and everyone will struggle to stop you in spite of your haphazard character deck.
 
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Ruck Ness
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shezmaine wrote:
Or you can play the 5 player variant without Greyjoy, Pyke Impassable and Seagard downgraded to a castle. (After all, the Greyjoys are more like Wildlings, they never had a real shot at the Iron throne, they're just irritating piratical raiders like the Brotherhood)

Then, with the Starks far to the North and plenty of castles nearby, you'll be THE force to be feared, and everyone will struggle to stop you in spite of your haphazard character deck.


I actually believe Lannister House cards are pretty good.

An aggressive Greyjoy with no second round muster becomes a dead Greyjoy.


Tywin - 2 PT's are awesome valuable
Gregor - Great card to counter an aggressive move
Jaime - Meh, my second Lannister burn card
Hound - Very important especially early
Kevan - Best counter to Balon
Tyrion - Smooth if you can save it for when opponent only has 1 card
Cersei - Very meh, my first burn card


1 more Tower and Lannister cards would be awesome.
 
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Nathan Chaney
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I'm unimpressed by Lannister's cards. Kevan in particular seems good until you realize how hard he can be to use effectively.

In my experience, when Greyjoy smashes Lannister (which they usually can do without too much difficulty, especially with an early muster) they tend to get bogged down because everyone realizes the threat they pose. As Lannister, I once convinced Greyjoy to form an alliance with me, and it worked really well. Actually, the other players got so scared of us that all four of them formed their own alliance...

Greyjoy can do a lot against Stark, and taking Winterfell seems to be popular with them.
 
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Ryan Wafflestein
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Lannister can win but playing Lannister is tricky and requires good knowledge of all the openings. If Tyrell, Baratheon and Greyjoy all go after you, you will definitely die. But if ANY House has 2 or more players actively gang up on them they will have a lot of trouble.

If T, B and G are always after Lannister in games then its not really a matter of Lannister not being able to win without pitying friends, but Lannister not being able to win with irrational friends. Lannister only has Lannisport and Riverrun that would have to be shared by T&B&G. In the meantime, as 4/6 houses fight over two castles, Stark and Martell would have free rein. If T&B&G can't be convinced to back off you, since there is no real benefit for them, then they've got a bad case of target fixation.

Against Greyjoy alone Lannister still has it tough but can fend him off with the Raven and good use of House Cards. Just have to remember to keep mustering, abuse the Raven, set up a support area in Stoney Sept and use House Cards at the right time (Gregor or Cersei at the right time can cripple Greyjoy).
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Jeremiah Richard
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You have to use your strengths and weaknesses to your advantage with any house, but particularly with Lannister.

As far as your strengths, you start with the raven, use it. Your two closest neighbors (Greyjoy and Tyrell) start with no stars. Use your * Consolidate Power! The Golden Sound completely seals off Lannisport, protect it and you protect Lannisport. It also allows you to support Riverrun, which is a must for Lannister to obtain and hold. Use Stoney Sept, one of the best places for support on the board.

Your weaknesses are pretty obvious to any players who have a few games under their belts. First, your proximity to Greyjoy is a problem. Try to convince Stark that a powerful Greyjoy will be the Stark's demise. Unless of course, you can convince Greyjoy that fighting with you will spell doom for him. Either way, you would rather have Greyjoy fighting Stark than you. Use your weakness in diplomacy. Smart players will know that a demolished Lannister brings a stronger opponent closer to their doorstep. Your troops can be a buffer between Greyjoy and Tyrell or Baratheon. You are unthreatening, use this fact to lay low and spring at the right time. Do your best to convince other houses that you are not a threat and have them focus on others. Attempt to convince Martell to use Doran in a way that will favor you, or Baratheon to use Patchface to take out Loras or something. You will have difficulty expanding very far with Lannister, so focus on strengthening your home turf, especially The Golden Sound, Lannisport, Riverrun, and Stoney Sept.

It will still be difficult for you, but playing Lannister can be quite fun if you know how to take advantage of their unique circumstances and cards, etc.
 
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CD Harris
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Schref wrote:
We've played 4-5 games now and every single one the person playing Lannister got smashed by Greayjoy, Tyrell, Baratheon, a combination of them three, or all three of them. I know some of you are going to say, "just make an alliance with...", but why would anyone do it? There is no real incentive for a majority of the houses to side with Lannister as far as I can tell.

Like I said, we've only played about 5 games, but almost all of them ended the same for Lannister which is: 1-2 castles and almost no units left.

The first game we played I was Lannister and I missed winning on the final turn just barely, but it was our first game and we had no real strategy.

Oh well, still a very fun game. Just not for Lannister, lol.


In my most recent game but one, I crushed five others as Lannister on turn 6. But for a timing error, I'd have won a early as Turn 4. In short, I was in such a dominating position, none of the five other players could do anything about it for three straight turns. Everyone was trying to take me down and win themselves, but it was to no avail.

Lanni is hard, since they have so many fronts to deal with right from the start. But between your 'free' mustering with a star order, the Raven token, and some diplomacy to keep Tyrell (easily done; it's in their interests, too) and Greyjoy (somewhat more difficult; get them signed on before Stark does) off you for a few turns while you deal with getting your power base consolidated, it's entirely possible to win with them. Easier, I'd say, than with Martel.
 
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Mark Cylon
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I've only just gotten the game and look forward to trying some of the suggested strategies in this thread for Lannister.
 
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Dr. Thisson
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Lannister is like a skunk. Whoever attacks him will suffer. If you are playing Lannister, your best move is to make sure your neighbors understand this.

Greyjoy accomplishes nothing by grinding things out with Lannister. He does better making his way inland. Lannister's southern neighbor has other pressing concerns in the beginning of the game. For these reasons, I think Lannister has excellent chances of winning so long as you are in a game with experienced players who understand that there can be great drawbacks to early entanglements with Lannister.
 
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