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Subject: The 209th Edition of the TGIF Poll rss

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Ben Lott
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If you want updates on when new TGIF polls are posted, or want to look at the results of past polls go to The TGIF Poll Subscription Thread.

Poll: The 209th TGIF Poll
Do you enjoy playing/watching sports?
  Your Answer   Vote Percent Vote Count
Like watching but not playing
16.2% 44
Like playing but not watching
14.4% 39
Like watching and playing
47.6% 129
Don't like watching or playing
21.8% 59
Voters 271
Which of the following sports do you think has been or could be translated into a good board game?

(Check all that apply)
  Your Answer   Vote Percent Vote Count
Soccer
49.5% 105
Cricket
14.2% 30
Hockey (Field or Ice)
27.4% 58
Tennis
12.3% 26
Volleyball
10.8% 23
Baseball
41.0% 87
Golf
33.0% 70
Basketball
17.9% 38
American Football
64.2% 136
Bowling
12.3% 26
Boxing
27.4% 58
Wrestling
15.1% 32
Track & Field
24.1% 51
Skiing
20.3% 43
Skating
10.8% 23
Swimming
9.9% 21
Diving
6.6% 14
Gymnastics
7.1% 15
Rowing
15.6% 33
Cycling
53.3% 113
Others
27.8% 59
Voters 212
Which would you like better in a board game about a team sport?
  Your Answer   Vote Percent Vote Count
Controlling a player on the team
6.4% 17
Controlling the entire team
44.7% 118
Managing the team
34.1% 90
None of the above
14.8% 39
Voters 264
This poll is now closed.   275 answers
Poll created by Blott
Closes: Thu Sep 27, 2012 6:00 am


4. For what sport (if any) would you like to see a good game made? (Regardless if there already is one.)

Any discussion is encouraged.
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Jesse Hickle
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I want to see a Capture the Flag board game.
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Ernest S
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I like K2 a mountain climbing game. Most other sports games have fallen flat for me.
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Paul DeStefano
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I do not understand watching sports.

Watching someone else play, if you are not a player yourself, seems pointless.
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Darrell Hanning
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Odd, that you would list cycling, but leave out other forms of racing, such as auto racing.

I don't think the best, overall game for any sport has been done, yet. I think there are a lot of sports games that are the best at what they do, though.
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Geosphere wrote:
I do not understand watching sports.

Watching someone else play, if you are not a player yourself, seems pointless.


Is watching someone else play music, if you are not a musician yourself, pointless?

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1) Playing but not watching. I might go to a game in person for the social aspect. On the rare occasions I'm somewhere people are watching on TV, I'm almost always watching the people, not the game, which I find more interesting.

2) Didn't someone once say that all sports reduce down to racing or fighting? I think all of the racing-type sports could work well as board games (albeit it there are only so many ways to interestingly abstract it). The fighting-type, less so. American football seems like it would do well because of how compartmentalized it is (regular stoppage in play and whatnot) - I think it'd be difficult to have a game about a sport like basketball or hockey that was both faithful to the source material (i.e., not a pasted on theme) and fun to play. Not impossible, but difficult.

3) I didn't answer this one. All three could be appealing in the right game.

4) Curling would make an excellent dexterity game, though I'd imagine it'd probably look a lot like themed Sorry! Sliders.
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1 Depends on the sport. Tennis, Golf, and Soccer I'd much rather play than watch, but (American)Football and Hockey I'd rather leave up to the professionals. Lots of others in between would be fun to try, but not in a highly-competitive environment.

2 Soccer, Baseball, Football, Auto Racing, and Cycling already have a bunch of games out there, and some are very good.

I have no idea how a game about Wrestling, Diving, or Gymnastics could be made to work in board game form without being heavily abstracted, like all of those Golf games that consist entirely of rolling dice.

3 Team sports, at least in boardgame form, should give you at least some level of control over the entire team. Controlling an individual player (only) works if you have enough players to cover every person on the team, but if a large portion of the team is automated by the game system I'd much rather have control over the whole thing. I can see how managing a team (as opposed to controlling it) could appeal to some people, but it's not a type of game that I'd seek out.

4 A good skiing game (downhill or cross-country) would be cool to see - maybe something along the lines of Snow Tails?
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Joe J. Rushanan
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What, no fencing?

I'd like to see something a little bit more involved than En Garde that allowed for things like right-of-way, counter-attacks vs parries, disengages, fleche, etc.
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Darrell Hanning
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NateStraight wrote:
Geosphere wrote:
I do not understand watching sports.

Watching someone else play, if you are not a player yourself, seems pointless.


Is watching someone else play music, if you are not a musician yourself, pointless?



One can admire, without having done so before. I will never, ever find myself on the uneven bars, but is that really necessary to admire and enjoy the sight of someone who is good at it? Of course not.

Having done it before, yourself, can certainly enhance your appreciation of the effort involved, but only enhances the appreciation, not create it.
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Matt Connellan
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DarrellKH wrote:
Odd, that you would list cycling, but leave out other forms of racing, such as auto racing.

I don't think the best, overall game for any sport has been done, yet. I think there are a lot of sports games that are the best at what they do, though.


I don't want to start a huge debate (translation: don't make me look stupid!), but car racing doesn't really require a level of physical performance to be called a sport, IMO. But then again, neither does bowling, and that's on this list, so perhaps I'm just screaming into the dark. I would call car racing a PASTIME and bowling a GAME.

On topic, Jab Realtime Boxing, Blood Bowl: Team Manager, and Street Soccer are good games.
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Paul DeStefano
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NateStraight wrote:
Geosphere wrote:
I do not understand watching sports.

Watching someone else play, if you are not a player yourself, seems pointless.


Is watching someone else play music, if you are not a musician yourself, pointless?



You find watching competition an expressive artform?
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Jason Carlough
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Pintsizepete wrote:
DarrellKH wrote:
Odd, that you would list cycling, but leave out other forms of racing, such as auto racing.

I don't think the best, overall game for any sport has been done, yet. I think there are a lot of sports games that are the best at what they do, though.


I don't want to start a huge debate (translation: don't make me look stupid!), but car racing doesn't really require a level of physical performance to be called a sport, IMO. But then again, neither does bowling, and that's on this list, so perhaps I'm just screaming into the dark. I would call car racing a PASTIME and bowling a GAME.

On topic, Jab Realtime Boxing, Blood Bowl: Team Manager, and Street Soccer are good games.


I think you are vastly underestimating the level of physical and mental performance and endurance required to be a world class race car driver (see Formula 1 racing specifically).
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Stoic Bird
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Geosphere wrote:
NateStraight wrote:
Geosphere wrote:
I do not understand watching sports.

Watching someone else play, if you are not a player yourself, seems pointless.


Is watching someone else play music, if you are not a musician yourself, pointless?



You find watching competition an expressive artform?


I think it can be, but in practice (at least in the U.S.) it generally isn't. Most "major" sports here, both amateur and professional, have regulating bodies that are mostly concerned about ratings and merchandising. It's fairly easy to find music performed in a way that appeals to you, but if you want, say, good defensive basketball, I wouldn't even know where to begin to look.
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Allen Ashley
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Just for clarification, i voted for skating, but specifically Short Track Speed skating would make an awesome game.
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1 I love playing and watching sports. In fact, I'll be going to see some Texas High School Football tonight even though my kids aren't involved.

2 I'm not a big fan of sport themed board games. They tend to be 2 player games that aren't that interesting. I've seen some good racing games, though. Also, the sports games in the BGG store look like interesting fillers. Especially the Golf game.

3 I'd rather manage a team a-la BasketBoss, but any of those could potentially make a good game if done right.

4 I think I might like a good game about an obscure sport that I know nothing about. That way I could learn something, and maybe become a fan. (Maybe Australian Rules Football, or SnowboardCross)

Scratch that. I want a World's Strongest Man game.

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Darrell Hanning
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Pintsizepete wrote:
DarrellKH wrote:
Odd, that you would list cycling, but leave out other forms of racing, such as auto racing.

I don't think the best, overall game for any sport has been done, yet. I think there are a lot of sports games that are the best at what they do, though.


I don't want to start a huge debate (translation: don't make me look stupid!), but car racing doesn't really require a level of physical performance to be called a sport, IMO. But then again, neither does bowling, and that's on this list, so perhaps I'm just screaming into the dark. I would call car racing a PASTIME and bowling a GAME.

On topic, Jab Realtime Boxing, Blood Bowl: Team Manager, and Street Soccer are good games.


I think your perspective is somewhat common. But it doesn't explain why there are only a tiny handful of people on the planet who, for example, can successfully race competitively in Formula One cars, where the average, annual salary is about 10 million dollars a year, and only one driver since 1970 has had any degree of success, after the age of 40. Reflexes, stamina, body strength, and hand-eye coordination are all absolutely critical in cars that can go from zero to one hundred and back to zero in less than 5 seconds, on tracks where 4.5+ Gees under braking and turning is commonplace.

If it didn't require a "level of physical performance", anybody could do it, right? I guess you should be the one to break that to all the thousands of drivers who tried and couldn't make it in F1, over the years.

Now, if you want to call NASCAR a "pastime", I don't care one way or the other, but I imagine someone might take exception to that.
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Christopher Yaure
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Although I marked many sports as one's for which good games could be crafted, I am not interested in one. Sports games are frequently repetitive, in much the same way sports are. Your team bats 27-45 times, repeating pitcher throws ball towards batter, batter swings. Your team takes the ball downcourt, passes and someone shoots, 50-80 times a game.Your team gains possession, moves the ball upfield, and (maybe) takes a shot.

Sports like gymnastics and diving got low scores, but where the athlete gets to select the degree of difficulty, that would add a more strategic element than most sports.
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Joe Huber

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Blott wrote:
4. For what sport (if any) would you like to see a good game made? (Regardless if there already is one.)


There aren't a lot of really enjoyable games about sports that I've run across, at least that have held up for the long run.

I believe the only sport for which I own two games is curling - Sweep! and Curling Table Game. No, wait - I do own two American football games (Scoozie and Ironman Football). Well, and cycling (Um Reifenbreite and 6-Tage Rennen). If you count horse racing as a sport, that too (Win, Place & Show and Royal Turf).

Hmmm... many more duplicates than I'd realized. But there's no sport for which I own three games.

The one sport I've _looked_ for a good game for, without success, is lacrosse. (I've picked up one lacrosse game, but it's just a replay-game, moreso than a game with, you know, choices.) And while I enjoy Armchair Cricket, I suspect there's a very different cricket game I'd really enjoy to be made (or perhaps already in existence, yet for me to find). And I would really love to see a good college hockey game too, come to think of it...
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Geosphere wrote:
NateStraight wrote:
Geosphere wrote:
I do not understand watching sports.

Watching someone else play, if you are not a player yourself, seems pointless.


Is watching someone else play music, if you are not a musician yourself, pointless?



You find watching competition an expressive artform?


No, but I find them equally valuable as a form of entertainment and an exhibition of honed human capacity.
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4. None, I don't really like that kind of game (Blood Bowl: Team Manager – The Card Game may be an exception, does that count as a sports game?). I've played soccer and bike/car racing games and didn't like those at all.
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Paul DeStefano
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NateStraight wrote:
Geosphere wrote:
NateStraight wrote:
Geosphere wrote:
I do not understand watching sports.

Watching someone else play, if you are not a player yourself, seems pointless.


Is watching someone else play music, if you are not a musician yourself, pointless?



You find watching competition an expressive artform?


No, but I find them equally valuable as a form of entertainment and an exhibition of honed human capacity.


As do many.

I do not.
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Steve Wagner
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I would love to see Tennis and Volleyball games. I actually thought of a design for Volleyball, but I've forgotten it with the millions of other ideas I have each day.
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asutbone wrote:
I want to see a Capture the Flag board game.
Is this a joke? I would like that if it could be done
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jjrbedford wrote:
What, no fencing?

I'd like to see something a little bit more involved than En Garde that allowed for things like right-of-way, counter-attacks vs parries, disengages, fleche, etc.


Heh. I designed a card game like that, several years ago. But it wasn't very good; I found it difficult to mimic the elements of reaction speed, guile, etc. within the mechanics of a card game. I'm still thinking about that one; maybe I'll get it worked out someday!
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