Recommend
3 
 Thumb up
 Hide
18 Posts

Star Wars: X-Wing Miniatures Game» Forums » Variants

Subject: Switch All Power To Front Deflector Shields rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
Charlie Theel
United States
St. Louis
Missouri
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Angling Deflector Shields

As an action, a pilot in the cockpit of a ship possessing shields may angle them to boost his chance of survival.

Place a shield token (from the bank) on the ship's base on one of the four sides of its facing (front, rear, left, right). Any attacks traced through this side of the base allows the defending ship to roll a bonus Defense die for each shield token remaining on his ship.

So say my X-Wing still has full shields (2 tokens). I decide to angle my shields to my front facing. Any attacks coming through the front of my base are now subject to 4 defense dice (2 Agility + 2 additional because I have 2 shields on my ship). It would be 5 defense dice if at long range.

I know shields are represented as health in this game and not defense dice, but I don't believe there's an easier way to represent angling in this system unless you completely re-work shields. This is simple and achieves the desired effect. It gives the Rebels a weaker, more situational Evade that does benefit from working against multiple attacks (assuming the first attacks don't lower your shields).

I like the nice boost this gives to the Y-Wings defense, which is balanced out with the fact that you easily outmaneuver a Y-Wing. The fact that angling your shields is an action means it relies on your Pilot skill for proper timing - which is how it should be.

For shots taken to facings where the shields are not angled, those hits all go straight to hull and can be criticals.
6 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Michael Ptak
United States
Livermore
California
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I was thinking of something similar for shield reinforcement, though just by using a ship's existing shield tokens instead of adding any to the pool.

A ship has two shield arcs: Front and back. The divider is down the middle of the template using the center peg. A ship's shield count is divided evenly between both arcs... remainders from odd number divisions are assigned to the front.

As an action a player can choose to allocate their shields across either arc of their choice. This is represented by placing them near the top or near the bottom of thier ship cards.

When a ship takes a hit in that arc, if there are more than 2 shields there, it ignores the first hit. Hits after the first are applied to the shields as normal. If a hit must be assigned and there are no additional shields in that arc (for example 3 hits against a 2-shielded arc) the last 'invulnerable' point from that arc is removed. Further damage is applied against the hull.

Obviously arcs without shields do not use the bonus or the benefit of shields when being fired at.

Ships using shield reinforement should consider themselves to have +3 squadron points.

...While this isn't perfect, I thought it was good enough to simulate the shield reinforcement used in TIE fighter and X-Wing. I feel the invulnerable shield point is balanced against how naked an arc can become (1-shield ships have to choose between fore or aft), and it is countered by multiple fighters targeting the same ship in the same arc (since, when resoling the next fighter attack, if a ship has only one shield it does not get the reinforced benefit).

Realistically I see being used on 2-shield fighters like the X-Wing and TIE/Ad. I feel it could prolong a scenario and should be treated as an advanced rule accordingly.

1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
O B
United States
Mountainview
California
flag msg tools
designer
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Interesting. I like the concept, but...

Based on this chart of probabilities:



If you have two tokens, angling the shields for a Y-Wing is better than focusing, but on an X-Wing focusing and angling are pretty similar (for the typical Tie attack values).

If you have one token, angling the shields for a Y-Wing is slightly better than focusing, but on an X-Wing focusing is always better.

So I'm not sure you're really adding a lot of meaningful tactical choices for the complexity of the rules.

I'm perfectly happy to believe that deflector angling is baked into the mechanics of focusing and reflected in the Rebel ship's greater survivability.
4 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Bernd Caspers
Germany
Mönchengladbach
Unspecified
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Just for the record, Star Wars: Star Warriors has all this built into the game, the X-Wing has two shields which can either be projected double front, double back or equal front and back.
Changing the angle during the game is an action, as are all maneuvers and firing.
You can do as many actions as you like, but the more you do, the more likely is an action to fail and you might get yourself in trouble by having to execute forced maneuvers or even damage the ship.
It´s crazy for a standard TIE to charge head on, he has to evade for a pass and then can play out his greater maneuverability, for the X-Wing projecting shield double front and charging head-on is a standard tactic.

Great game, unfortunately too complex and slow for these times,but still a great game, like X-Wing.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Charlie Theel
United States
St. Louis
Missouri
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Norsehound wrote:
I was thinking of something similar for shield reinforcement, though just by using a ship's existing shield tokens instead of adding any to the pool.

A ship has two shield arcs: Front and back. The divider is down the middle of the template using the center peg. A ship's shield count is divided evenly between both arcs... remainders from odd number divisions are assigned to the front.

As an action a player can choose to allocate their shields across either arc of their choice. This is represented by placing them near the top or near the bottom of thier ship cards.

When a ship takes a hit in that arc, if there are more than 2 shields there, it ignores the first hit. Hits after the first are applied to the shields as normal. If a hit must be assigned and there are no additional shields in that arc (for example 3 hits against a 2-shielded arc) the last 'invulnerable' point from that arc is removed. Further damage is applied against the hull.

Obviously arcs without shields do not use the bonus or the benefit of shields when being fired at.

Ships using shield reinforement should consider themselves to have +3 squadron points.

...While this isn't perfect, I thought it was good enough to simulate the shield reinforcement used in TIE fighter and X-Wing. I feel the invulnerable shield point is balanced against how naked an arc can become (1-shield ships have to choose between fore or aft), and it is countered by multiple fighters targeting the same ship in the same arc (since, when resoling the next fighter attack, if a ship has only one shield it does not get the reinforced benefit).

Realistically I see being used on 2-shield fighters like the X-Wing and TIE/Ad. I feel it could prolong a scenario and should be treated as an advanced rule accordingly.



That's a cool way to do it but I don't think having all those shield tokens scattered about the table is a good idea. I think it would become too fidly moving all of your shield tokens every time you move. I believe Angling will be more situational, hence why I suggested only putting a single token down when you angle in my original post.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Ethan McKinney
United States
El Segundo
California
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
The Jakster wrote:
Just for the record, Star Wars: Star Warriors has all this built into the game, the X-Wing has two shields which can either be projected double front, double back or equal front and back.


What about the Y-Wing?
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Charlie Theel
United States
St. Louis
Missouri
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
adorablerocket wrote:
Interesting. I like the concept, but...

Based on this chart of probabilities:



If you have two tokens, angling the shields for a Y-Wing is better than focusing, but on an X-Wing focusing and angling are pretty similar (for the typical Tie attack values).

If you have one token, angling the shields for a Y-Wing is slightly better than focusing, but on an X-Wing focusing is always better.

So I'm not sure you're really adding a lot of meaningful tactical choices for the complexity of the rules.

I'm perfectly happy to believe that deflector angling is baked into the mechanics of focusing and reflected in the Rebel ship's greater survivability.


Yes, but those statistics do not take into account that angling works against ALL attacks (unless of course your shields are lowered), whereas focus is a one time use.

Also, you can benefit from both if using one of the pilots that grants a Focus token to an ally or if you angle your shields one round and focus the next. Angling shields stay that way until re-angled.

I think these rules would add a nice punch to a Death Star Trench Run scenario.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
James Motz
United States
Minneapolis
Minnesota
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
elbmc1969 wrote:

What about the Y-Wing?


I love Star Warriors! I don't have the stats memorized, but all the Rebel ships had shields and could angle them around. I believe (and will no doubt be corrected) that the Y-Wing and B-Wings both had more shields than the X-Wing. Maybe 3-4? The A-Wing also had two shields I believe.

The damage system in that game had it so not all hits took down a shield. You rolled two dice and checked a table (ah, the 80's), adding your gun's power and subtracting shields in the quarter you got hit. Lower on the table = less overall damage. Some results lost you a shield, some lost your R2 or guns, some made it harder to fly...

Great game. WAAAAYYYY too complicated to play regularly, but God did I try.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Bernd Caspers
Germany
Mönchengladbach
Unspecified
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
elbmc1969 wrote:
The Jakster wrote:
Just for the record, Star Wars: Star Warriors has all this built into the game, the X-Wing has two shields which can either be projected double front, double back or equal front and back.


What about the Y-Wing?


The Y-Wing also has 2 shields, but a better hull rating of 6 compared to the 5 of the X-Wing.
Since these ships come fully equipped, the Ion Cannon and the cheaper point cost of the Y-Wing compensate for the slighter difference in durability compared to "X-Wing".
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Michael Ptak
United States
Livermore
California
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
charlest wrote:


That's a cool way to do it but I don't think having all those shield tokens scattered about the table is a good idea. I think it would become too fidly moving all of your shield tokens every time you move. I believe Angling will be more situational, hence why I suggested only putting a single token down when you angle in my original post.


Er... you misunderstand. They would be on the ship card, not the ship tile moved around on the board.

When I play the only tokens that follow ships around are the target locks, action tokens, and movement dials. Shield remain with the ship stat cards near the owning player. Moving to the top would be front arc, and moving to the bottom would be rear arc. Sorry if that wasnt' clear.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Charlie Theel
United States
St. Louis
Missouri
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Oh, that makes sense! Sorry about the confusion.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Kai Clements
United States
Unspecified
Virginia
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
I like this idea, but what if...

The angling of shields didn't revert each turn. In other words, if you angled them to the front, they stayed that way until you took another action to angle them or equalize them.

Also, should there not be some penalty for ships firing through a different side of the ship? If you angle them forward, a ship behind you should bypass shields.

While I like the concept, I agree that is can easily be thought of as already wrapped into the numbers. And it might complicate/slow down what is a relatively quick and simple game.
1 
 Thumb up
0.05
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Charlie Theel
United States
St. Louis
Missouri
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Kaizot wrote:
I like this idea, but what if...

The angling of shields didn't revert each turn. In other words, if you angled them to the front, they stayed that way until you took another action to angle them or equalize them.

Also, should there not be some penalty for ships firing through a different side of the ship? If you angle them forward, a ship behind you should bypass shields.

While I like the concept, I agree that is can easily be thought of as already wrapped into the numbers. And it might complicate/slow down what is a relatively quick and simple game.


Yes, I intend for the shields not to revert automatically. Also, shots through facings which do not have shields angled go straight to hull.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Stephen Foulk
Canada
Toronto
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I like the idea of focusing shields (just been reading 'Rogue Squadron') but was struggling to come up with a solution that didn't buff the shileded vessel to much... I think Charles might have come up with the answer.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Michael Ptak
United States
Livermore
California
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I didn't like charles' suggestion of adding tokens from the bank. When I was thinking about my approach I wanted to use what the ship already had to work with and didn't add more tokens to be possibly confused with. Moreover I wanted to replicate X-wing/TIE fighter/s twin shield arc, which seemed to work pretty well and was easy to simulate in the miniatures game. I felt my solution was simple enough to give a slight advantage and flexibility to shield users.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Eric B.
United States
East Lansing
Michigan
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
This draws from the X-Wing/TIE computer games more than anything, but what about something simple like this that let you channel all of your energy from weapons to shields:



Recharge (Action): Regain one lost Shield token. This ship may not attack this turn.

You lose your attack so it doesn't make R2-D2 redundant. Might be the help the Rebels need to keep up with the Imperials. Could also make TIE/ads more interesting/compelling.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Charlie Theel
United States
St. Louis
Missouri
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
RogueThirteen wrote:
This draws from the X-Wing/TIE computer games more than anything, but what about something simple like this that let you channel all of your energy from weapons to shields:



Recharge (Action): Regain one lost Shield token. This ship may not attack this turn.

You lose your attack so it doesn't make R2-D2 redundant. Might be the help the Rebels need to keep up with the Imperials. Could also make TIE/ads more interesting/compelling.


Angling is a risk, this is not risky. If I got into trouble as Rebels, all you have to do is fly away in different directions and stall to recharge your shields. I don't think promoting that behavior is good.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Alvin Simon
Philippines
flag msg tools
Make America Great Again
badge
Proud member of the Basket of Deplorables
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
RogueThirteen wrote:
This draws from the X-Wing/TIE computer games more than anything, but what about something simple like this that let you channel all of your energy from weapons to shields:



Recharge (Action): Regain one lost Shield token. This ship may not attack this turn.

You lose your attack so it doesn't make R2-D2 redundant. Might be the help the Rebels need to keep up with the Imperials. Could also make TIE/ads more interesting/compelling.


I like this suggestion

charlest wrote:
Angling is a risk, this is not risky. If I got into trouble as Rebels, all you have to do is fly away in different directions and stall to recharge your shields. I don't think promoting that behavior is good.


That's exactly what you did in the old X-Wing/TIE fighter game.

How about boosting lasers from shields?
Action: Discard two shield tokens. Add one to your attack.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.