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Subject: Victory by forfeit: Is it satisfying? rss

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Before I get into the details, my question is basically this:

If you are losing a game, but through some underhanded behaviour cause another player to forfeit and thus steal a 'win', is that satisfying for you? Do you encode that memory in your brain as a regular victory?


Ok, here's the situation:

I was playing an online game of Ascension. It was my third game in a row with a certain player. I had won each of the previous games, and after each game my opponent had requested a rematch, so I obliged.

3 minutes into our 10 minute game, I pulled off a nasty combo that pretty much guaranteed a win for me. My opponent immediately disconnected, presumably in frustration.

Now, for those who haven't tried the online version of this game, the gist of the system is that if an opponent quits, you have to wait until the opponents timer runs out before being able to claim victory. This means that I would have to sit around for 7 minutes doing nothing, so I decided to do some internet browsing in the interim. I checked back occasionally to see if my opponent had reconnected, but no luck.

With about 1 minute left on the timer, I switched back to web browsing and gave up on the game. Later in the day I fired up Ascension to play another game and noticed that I had an extra forfeit.

Which means that after disconnecting from a game he was sure to lose, my opponent deliberately waited until the last second of the timer (knowing I would most likely log out before that), logged back in, took a turn and then waited for me to timeout, thus claiming a victory by way of my "forfeit".

Now, I'm not disputing that I lost, within the framework of the game (or maybe meta-game in this case). I can accept that, as if I really cared about the win I could have seen it through to ensure victory.

My question is: If you were the other player, would you find that a satisfying victory? Keep in mind there are no globally listed stats in this game, if there were then of course everything counts to increase your visible ranking. But in this case your stats are private to yourself.

So is this person, whoever they are, sitting back enjoying their 'win'? Will they look at that extra victory in their tally and be satisfied with their 'skill' at the game? I ask because to me this kind of victory would be meaningless, and I find it amusing that this would be at all satisfying to anyone else.

Thoughts?
 
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Chris Miller
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I can't imagine anyone finding that satisfying, but then I can't imagine anyone taking their win/loss record that serious that they need to do this.

I'm more interested in knowing about the killer combo you used.. I haven't seen anything like that in Ascension ninja
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Old Gamer
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It seems possible that they - at the last moment - decided not to be a sore loser, and returned to the game.

But to answer your question: No, that would not be at all satisfying to me.
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David B
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There are jerks like that on chess websites, too. Absolute scum...all of them.
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Alex Bourne
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It's possible (though not probable) that he got disconnected and it took a few minutes to log back in. I've had this happen often on my laptop. My wi-fi button gets bumped and it takes me a few minutes to figure out why I've lost my internet connection. It's also likely that he was frustrated and after taking a couple minute break decided to come back and finish the game.
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Agent J
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He's looking real sharp in his 1940's fedora. He's got nerves of steel, an iron will, and several other metal-themed attributes. His fur is water tight and he's always up for a fight.
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He's a semi-aquatic egg-laying mammal of action. He's a furry little flat-foot who'll never flinch from a fray. He's got more than just mad skills, he's got a beaver tail and a bill.
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The question I ask myself is, "If I was sitting across from this person, playing the game, and did something similar, would I have won?"

In this case, no, I wouldn't have won. So it is not satisfying.
 
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G Schulteis
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For some, it is very satisfying.
 
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Benjamin Lindvall
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This is why I don't care if the iOS board game I get has asynch play or not. I'm not going to play with random players for these exact reasons. I'm the only one in my group that has an iPad so its not replacing physical gaming for me. I'm happy to just beat up (or get beat up) by the AI just to keep familiar and to learn games I'd likely never otherwise get to play just due to time constraints.

Just as unsatisfying to me is a proper win or loss where you can't even talk to your opponent to say good game, or to learn about how you lost.

In physical space games - a forfeit can be a proper part of the game. In Magic, getting your opponent to concede in a tournament setting is the best way to win, as it saves time during the round (though he might be hiding information about his deck for sideboarding purposes). It is very satisfying to put the idea in his head that he has no way to win and to just give up in a dueling case like that. In most casually played games though (i.e., there's no money at stake, playing for fun), they should be seen to their conclusion.
 
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Tony C
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Not at all. A forfeit's not a win, and a 'quit' is even worse (versus, say, technical difficulties or emergency game stoppage), and 'I quit, whoops, no I don't, ha-ha' is even worser.

Conceding is something different, if the concession is based on the fact that there is no chance at all the other player/s can win. Usually it's still nice to play the game out, but I can see situations where conceding would be the right way to go.
 
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MillertimeRC wrote:
I'm more interested in knowing about the killer combo you used.. I haven't seen anything like that in Ascension ninja


I wish I remembered the exact details but it involved acquiring P.R.I.M.E., Hedron Cannon and Samael the Fallen...
 
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dtcarson wrote:
Not at all. A forfeit's not a win, and a 'quit' is even worse (versus, say, technical difficulties or emergency game stoppage), and 'I quit, whoops, no I don't, ha-ha' is even worser.

Conceding is something different, if the concession is based on the fact that there is no chance at all the other player/s can win. Usually it's still nice to play the game out, but I can see situations where conceding would be the right way to go.


I agree, I think conceding is fine if all parties are amicable about it.

On the other hand, if someone just up and quits, then that should be game over for them.

Sneaking back later to cause a forfeit is pretty much the real world equivalent of telling your guest "Ok you win, let's pack it in for the night" and when they leave moving your victory point marker ahead of theirs for the 'win'. To me it seems kind of meaningless...
 
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