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Android: Netrunner» Forums » Variants

Subject: Brain Damage instead of Flatline rss

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Ingólfur Valsson
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I've heard some mention that they find the end game condition of runners harsh. I'm not saying I agree with that but you could see that's how the world championship was lost.

Perhaps it's only a case of Runners not having enough cards that can protect them and it will change.

But I had one idea that I wanted to put out there for those that wan't a house rule to change this a little.

When you get damage and can't discard a card, instead of flatlining you get 1 brain damage ( 1 for each damage you get ). Enough braindamage to make your hand size 0 ( usually 5 ) and you are flatlined.

EDIT:

Notice that this hasn't been playtested and this isn't the way I intend to play it. I set it out there as a response to some guys on another site complaining about the harshness of flatlining and thought of this. I put it here as I didn't wan't to register on another site.

I guess it's just best to keep your hand size at 4 or 5 at all time and those where just cases of too aggressive play by the runners.
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Patrick Jamet
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This is a very bad idea. Some decks are build specificaly to kill the Runner and, believe me, it's hard enough like that.
Excuse-me, have you ever played this game?
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Paul Grogan
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+1 to "this is a very bad idea"

This fundamentally changes the balance of the game in massive favour of the runner and completely shuts down a number of decks.

Yes, being killed by flatline is harsh, but there are many ways to prevent it happening. You just need to be more careful or put more protection in your deck.
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Ingólfur Valsson
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Pyjam wrote:
This is a very bad idea. Some decks are build specificaly to kill the Runner and, believe me, it's hard enough like that.
Excuse-me, have you ever played this game?


No actually I haven't, and I doubt I will use this rule when I do. I saw a discussion about it in another place I wasn't registered at but they where complaining about it. So I got this idea to solve it for them and wanted to put it out there for anyone to use if they want. As I said this is just an idea.

I should of course mention in my original post that this has not been playtested and as such should perhaps not be posted as a variant.

But you did notice in the World Championship that more then once a runner lost because they made a small mistake and got destroyed by net damage.
 
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Martin Presley
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Speaking as someone who runs Weyland Tag & Bag, I get most of my wins off of scoring agendas. My damage is mainly there to make tagging effects extremely scary, and to combo off of Posted Bounty. But again, this is not my main way of winning against good runners.

You're right that those World Championship games were lost due to mistakes leading to damage. But they are MISTAKES, and when you play at a high level, you can expect any mistake to be punished harshly. And it's also worth mentioning that the Corp can sometimes force a player's hand, to make a risky run because the runner thinks NOT running may lose him the game. It's only a mistake in hindsight to run in that case.
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Patrick Jamet
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KronikAlkoholik wrote:
No actually I haven't, and I doubt I will use this rule when I do. I saw a discussion about it in another place I wasn't registered at but they where complaining about it. So I got this idea to solve it for them and wanted to put it out there for anyone to use if they want. As I said this is just an idea.

If you haven't played, you can't realize how terrible your idea is. It completely destroys the game. If you insist, prepare yourself to receive a lot of negative comments.

Edit: I did not understand the part of your answer I quoted.
I understood that you will not play the original rule about flatline, but your variant instead. Sorry.
 
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Ingólfur Valsson
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Pyjam wrote:
I did not understand the part of your answer I quoted.
I understood that you will not play the original rule about flatline, but your variant instead. Sorry.


No problem, I can see you are from France so language barriers aren't helping.

I'm gonna try to find what that site was that this discussion was on because they made is sound like Flatlining would be too easy. I rarely use house rules in games like this but just wanted to share this idea if anybody wanted.
 
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Patrick Jamet
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KronikAlkoholik wrote:
I guess it's just best to keep your hand size at 4 or 5 at all time and those where just cases of too aggressive play by the runners.

Yes. But one very important and very exciting thing about this game is that you must take risks if you want to win. So, very often, you are not in the better condition to perform a run, but you must do it. Or you will lose too often. Also, it's part of the Corp's skill to set up these kind of situations. If you remove the rule about flatlining, you remove the risk, and you destroy the game.

This makes this game so incredibly exciting and enjoyable.
 
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Ingólfur Valsson
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Pyjam wrote:
KronikAlkoholik wrote:
I guess it's just best to keep your hand size at 4 or 5 at all time and those where just cases of too aggressive play by the runners.

Yes. But one very important and very exciting thing about this game is that you must take risks if you want to win. So, very often, you are not in the better condition to perform a run, but you must do it. Or you will lose too often. Also, it's part of the Corp's skill to set up these kind of situations. If you remove the rule about flatlining, you remove the risk, and you destroy the game.

This makes this game so incredibly exciting and enjoyable.


I guess it's also very thematic that the runner is fragile and in danger.
 
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Kaiwen Zhang
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the runner knows the risks of running. I can see the rule being harsh for a reckless newcomer, but you're talking about dumbing down the game for the world championship finals? that is not needed.

and if the game ends quickly, start again, it's not a big deal, this is not a long game anyway.
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Dan Cepeda
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Just wanted to throw it out there: I don't think this is "zomg worstest possible thing anybody has ever said on the Internetz!!!1!! Zomg!!one!!!"

Maybe it's not a perfect solution, but I could see people using this with their children, or in a purely "for-fun" game. He wasn't suggesting it be used at the wc level, he was just saying "see, it even happened as a result of small mistakes at wc level, I can imagine some people find it slightly bothersome at the home-play level." Then he proposed a possible solution.

I could see some couples adopting this play style. I don't see why it's such a big deal, assuming you build your deck to this play style. Granted it takes away one of the risks, and some decks, but clearly some people don't like that risk. I'm not saying it's for everyone, but I, for one, thought it was a pretty fascinating idea...
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Ingólfur Valsson
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iidhaegn wrote:
Just wanted to throw it out there: I don't think this is "zomg worstest possible thing anybody has ever said on the Internetz!!!1!! Zomg!!one!!!"

Maybe it's not a perfect solution, but I could see people using this with their children, or in a purely "for-fun" game. He wasn't suggesting it be used at the wc level, he was just saying "see, it even happened as a result of small mistakes at wc level, I can imagine some people find it slightly bothersome at the home-play level." Then he proposed a possible solution.

I could see some couples adopting this play style. I don't see why it's such a big deal, assuming you build your deck to this play style. Granted it takes away one of the risks, and some decks, but clearly some people don't like that risk. I'm not saying it's for everyone, but I, for one, thought it was a pretty fascinating idea...


Thanks dude, that was totally what I was going for. I just think that many people misunderstood this as me saying the original game was broken.

While I doubt I will use it myself, except perhaps with beginner Runners while they are learning, some playgroups might like it. Also I never play in any tournaments ( there aren't that many in Iceland, especially in a small town like mine ) and only play with people I actually know. It was never my intention someone made a deck for dealing net damage and suddenly found out that the rules have changed.

I find my solution to be very simple and still in the nature of the game, using mechanics that are already there. Each brain damage received would then increase the chance of getting more because of smaller hand size. It also can make thematic sense as feedback overload could damage a runners brain.
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I could see a card that does something like this in the future, but it needs something extra negative to add balance.
 
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Samuel Beliveau
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Azgard12 wrote:
I could see a card that does something like this in the future, but it needs something extra negative to add balance.


Something like:

Escape Route, Resource
----------------
Trash this, forfeit an agenda: Prevents flatline

One time use, can't do much if runner is really behind in the score.
 
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Noah D

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Perhaps relevant:


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Steven Tu
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argus88 wrote:
Perhaps relevant:




Those smell like power-creeping. And I see could force draws in our environment. Can't comment on the original environment.
 
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