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Subject: Obliged to play higher? rss

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Jonathan C
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The Pagat entry for Pinochle indicates that it is mandatory to not only follow suit, but beat the highest card on the table if at all possible, even if your partner is winning the trick. Coming from a Euchre background, this rule seems strange, odd, and because it reduces the available decisions one can make, less interesting. I tend to find games that allow for more planning and decision-making are better games, and steer away from the "automatic".

Quote:
The rule obliging you to beat the card currently winning the trick applies even if the card you are obliged to beat is your partner's.


Quote:
The obligation to play higher only applies if you are able to beat the card that is currently winning the trick. If you are unable to do this you may play any card, subject always to the necessity to follow suit and to play a trump if you have no card of the suit led.


Are these the "normal" or "traditional" Pinochle rules?

Another variant we discovered, I think that it is described in Hoyle's official cardgame book, suggested a variant in which nobody had to follow suit at any time ever. We tried that once and it was confusing as anything--this didn't even feel like a game. The link below references this variation as "two-handed Pinochle".

Our house-ruled variant is the only way we will play Pinochle from now on. It is like the oft-described Partnership-Auction-Racehorse rules (with bidding and passing between players on the team which wins bid for Trump), but card-play is like that of Euchre -- you must follow suit if able, but if not, you can play or slough whatever you want.

http://www.pagat.com/marriage/pinmain.html

http://entertainment.howstuffworks.com/how-to-play-two-hande...
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Billy McBoatface
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Yup, those are the rules.

But why does it talk about "You must take even if it is your partner's"? Pinochle is not a partnership game.
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Jonathan C
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wmshub wrote:
Yup, those are the rules.

But why does it talk about "You must take even if it is your partner's"? Pinochle is not a partnership game.


Perhaps not the original Pinochle, whatever that may be. Several quite common partnership Pinochle variants exist today.

The Pagat link I posted above describes it in detail.
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Ron K
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The way I learned is that when trump is led, you must go higher if you can. I didn't see anything about non-trump led tricks beyond following suit and, if can't, must trump. No other over trump requirement.

-Ron
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fishhaid
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wmshub wrote:
Yup, those are the rules.

But why does it talk about "You must take even if it is your partner's"? Pinochle is not a partnership game.


Only way I've ever played pinochle is 4 handed partnership.
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Ron K
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cfisher wrote:
wmshub wrote:
Yup, those are the rules.

But why does it talk about "You must take even if it is your partner's"? Pinochle is not a partnership game.


Only way I've ever played pinochle is 4 handed partnership.


One interpretation for 3 player is that once one player has bid the contract, the other two are now in partnership to defeat it.

For 4 player, everyone has a partner all the time

For 2 player, there are no partners (but 2 player is a very strange game - good for teaching elements of the game)

-Ron
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Blake Morris
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All my old "Hoyles" say that you are required to "play over" only if a trump is led to the trick (3- or 4-hand play). I once fell into a "house ruled" situation where you had to try to win every trick; I pulled the inevitable renege and never returned to that game.

In two-handed Pinochle you may play any card on the lead until the deck is exhausted, when the usual rules about following suit and playing over trumps come into play. This allows maximum flexibility for melding in the first part of the game.
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Robert Stuart
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This rule doesn't make the game less strategic. It gives play of the cards a different strategy than one might use in, say, Whist, Klobberjass or Bridge.
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Robert Stuart
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morrigambist wrote:
All my old "Hoyles" say that you are required to "play over" only if a trump is led to the trick (3- or 4-hand play). I once fell into a "house ruled" situation where you had to try to win every trick; I pulled the inevitable renege and never returned to that game.

In two-handed Pinochle you may play any card on the lead until the deck is exhausted, when the usual rules about following suit and playing over trumps come into play. This allows maximum flexibility for melding in the first part of the game.


And there's one very practical component to the rule: before the card deck is exhausted, it would be very difficult to catch a player in a renege.
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morrigambist wrote:
All my old "Hoyles" say that you are required to "play over" only if a trump is led to the trick (3- or 4-hand play). I once fell into a "house ruled" situation where you had to try to win every trick; I pulled the inevitable renege and never returned to that game.

"Hoyles" are not necessarily definitive. Pinochle has many different variations, especially depending on what region of the country you are in. The older rule requires a player to head every trick if able. The newer rule only requires you to head a trick if trump is led. In the midwest, the older rule is still the norm as far as I know.
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