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Crude: The Oil Game» Forums » Rules

Subject: Sell refinery and avoid pollution controls fee? rss

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Travis Sonsalla
United States
Rollingstone
MN
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Can a refinery be sold that has not paid the $25M pollution control upgrades and has been sitting turned on its side idle? The rules did not reference this situation.

We decided to play that the player would not be able to find a buyer to purchase the refinery without the pollution controls in place.

EDIT: Also, if the player does sell would he need to pay the $25M fee prior to selling? Or would he reduce the liquidation value by the $25M?
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Kevin Whitmore
United States
Albuquerque
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I have no idea what the official ruling will be, but we noticed this same situation in our recent game, and I made the opposite assumption. Since the rules don't invoke any restrictions about sales, I assume selling the refineries to avoid the fee would be allowed.

That's not to argue with your opinion, just to offer how I would have dealt with the situation in our game. (As it happened, everyone decided to promptly pay the fine.)
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Travis Sonsalla
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Rollingstone
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In our situation the player did not have sufficient funds at the time the event occurred and so the refineries were shut down. In a later turn he looked at selling them to improve his cash position.

No worries on differing conclusions. Our group was essentially split on the way to go, and we ended up accepting the "theme-ier" position.
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Darrell Hanning
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Jacksonville
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travbot wrote:
Can a refinery be sold that has not paid the $25M pollution control upgrades and has been sitting turned on its side idle? The rules did not reference this situation.

We decided to play that the player would not be able to find a buyer to purchase the refinery without the pollution controls in place.

EDIT: Also, if the player does sell would he need to pay the $25M fee prior to selling? Or would he reduce the liquidation value by the $25M?


The way I see it is that the fine has been enacted prior to the sale, so that it is still due. And, as you point out, finding a buyer for a refinery that is not in compliance would be problematic. So, I would reason that yes, you can sell the refinery, but only if you pay the fine in conjunction with the sale.
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Bruce Linsey
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Hudson
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A related question: if that card is in effect, do new refineries have to be upgraded, or are they assumed to be compliant when built?
 
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Travis Sonsalla
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Rollingstone
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Bruce Linsey wrote:
A related question: if that card is in effect, do new refineries have to be upgraded, or are they assumed to be compliant when built?


I would go with them being compliant when built. The government wouldn't allow a refinery to be built without the new pollution control standards in place, and this would be included in the purchase price of the prevailing economy card.
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Brian McCarty
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La Crescent
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I'm bumping this thread in the hopes that it generates more attention and an official answer.

Brian
Dirty refinery seller
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Jonathan Bishop
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I would also like to know what the official ruling on this is. I played my first game tonight, and this came up. The news event was triggered on the next player's turn after a player had declared the end of the game. The other players didn't have any refining to do, so it would have been more advantageous not to pay the fine so long as the refineries could still be sold either on a hit or at the end of the game. It wouldn't have made a difference in the outcome, but it still would be nice to know.
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