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Subject: Minimalist (mostly printer friendly) proxies in time for Christmas rss

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Kevin Eagles
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A couple of years back all of my ME cards were stolen. I had complete sets of ME:TW, ME:TD, ME:DM, ME:TWH, and the pre-con decks. This Christmas I'm going to see my brother and his family, and he wanted to play ME, not knowing everything was stolen.

We both are getting older, so that tiny text was gonna be killer for this old man. Also, it would have been way too much work to hunt down all the cards we'd want to use, so I decided to make some proxies instead.

I was thinking that maybe I could upload the proxies here without any of the art, if anyone would be interested. Here is a sample of the cards; any and all suggestions you guys may have would be appreciated.

Eagles

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José San Miguel
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Very nice work! I like the design
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Eagles wrote:
so that tiny text was gonna be killer for this old man.

What did you do to mitigate this? The text on your proxies doesnt't look any bigger. Or did you print out these proxies in an all-over larger size?
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Kevin Eagles
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Good question, and I'm still adjusting things. I've been talking with my brother on this and we've gone back and forth on it. On the one hand we'd like a uniform font size, while on the other we want the text to be easily read for cards such as Anduril.

So in the case of Anduril, what I've done is push the text box up, at the cost of reducing the size of the art. Now with a 'uniform' text size as one of my goals this has pushed down the font to 6! Which is rugged on these old eyes. I am thinking about moving it up to 8 and then removing the art altogether on Anduril.

I will post up a few options and lemme know what you think,

Eagles

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El-ad David Amir
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Eagles wrote:
...On the one hand we'd like a uniform font size...

May I ask why? I think you can increase the font size in many of the cards, making it more readable.
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Kevin Eagles
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IirionClaus wrote:
Eagles wrote:
...On the one hand we'd like a uniform font size...

May I ask why? I think you can increase the font size in many of the cards, making it more readable.


Absolutely! In a word, nogoodreasonwhatsoever. *I* do (admittedly) find it irksome when a ccg uses 12p font on one card and then 6p on another. But as I said...I don't have a good or even reasonable answer

That being said, I will try it with different font sizes and post some pictures.

Eagles
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El-ad David Amir
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Eagles wrote:
*I* do (admittedly) find it irksome when a ccg uses 12p font on one card and then 6p on another. But as I said...I don't have a good or even reasonable answer

Personally, I would stick to two font sizes- "big" for most cards, and "small" for the crazy uberdetailed cards.

This thread returns me to an old concept of rebuilding the game with modern design technology. Keeping the same mechanics, just rewriting the rules and the cards to make them clearer and more accessible. This is how I imagine Anduril:

[1] Anduril, Flame of the West *
Item - Information - Sage
Bearer makes a Corruption Check(-3) when Anduril is played. Bearer cannot untap.
If you have Narsil, discard a stored Reforging: Attach Anduril to Narsil. Narsil gives +4 {Prowess} (maximum of 11), +1 {Direct Influence}, +1 {Corruption}. Anduril gains +3 {Marshalling Points} and {Tap}: {Untap} a Dunadan Character in the same Company. Bearer makes a Corruption Check(-1).

[1] is one point. The asterisk at the title denotes Unique. Items will be minor, major, greater, ring and information; when you think about it, playing Anduril is identical to playing an item (tap the character and the site; there is a difference as far as classification of cards for scoring goes, which is a minor rules change). The type line will also include the relevant class (for example Short Event - Wizard). {Prowess}, {Direct Influence}, etc. will use icons instead of text.
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Kevin Eagles
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IirionClaus wrote:


[1] Anduril, Flame of the West *
Item - Information - Sage
Bearer makes a Corruption Check(-3) when Anduril is played. Bearer cannot untap.
If you have Narsil, discard a stored Reforging: Attach Anduril to Narsil. Narsil gives +4 {Prowess} (maximum of 11), +1 {Direct Influence}, +1 {Corruption}. Anduril gains +3 {Marshalling Points} and {Tap}: {Untap} a Dunadan Character in the same Company. Bearer makes a Corruption Check(-1).


I really like that.

I think (at the very least) making icons for some of the games longer words would really benefit the wall of text as well. Having an icon for 'corruption check', 'direct influence', etc. would look great and free up text to make the font larger as a whole.

Eagles
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El-ad David Amir
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Eagles wrote:
I think (at the very least) making icons for some of the games longer words would really benefit the wall of text as well. Having an icon for 'corruption check', 'direct influence', etc. would look great and free up text to make the font larger as a whole.

Exactly! And some of the icons exist (such as DI). Magic embedded icons in the card's text, I have no idea why ICE did not do the same with MEccg.
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Kevin Eagles
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Here are the icons I have so far. The hand and the mind are public domain from nounproject.com



Man, the numbers are way too small on the screen...back to editing them to make them larger.
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Kevin Eagles
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I'm toying with the idea of using 'easier to see/read' icons for DI and mind.



Dunno why it came out blurry.
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El-ad David Amir
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This is quite cool I wonder if there's a market for a reboot of the game (with a different theme, of course, getting rights to Middle Earth costs a fortune nowadays).
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IirionClaus wrote:
Eagles wrote:
*I* do (admittedly) find it irksome when a ccg uses 12p font on one card and then 6p on another. But as I said...I don't have a good or even reasonable answer

Personally, I would stick to two font sizes- "big" for most cards, and "small" for the crazy uberdetailed cards.

This thread returns me to an old concept of rebuilding the game with modern design technology. Keeping the same mechanics, just rewriting the rules and the cards to make them clearer and more accessible. This is how I imagine Anduril:

[1] Anduril, Flame of the West *
Item - Information - Sage
Bearer makes a Corruption Check(-3) when Anduril is played. Bearer cannot untap.
If you have Narsil, discard a stored Reforging: Attach Anduril to Narsil. Narsil gives +4 {Prowess} (maximum of 11), +1 {Direct Influence}, +1 {Corruption}. Anduril gains +3 {Marshalling Points} and {Tap}: {Untap} a Dunadan Character in the same Company. Bearer makes a Corruption Check(-1).

[1] is one point. The asterisk at the title denotes Unique. Items will be minor, major, greater, ring and information; when you think about it, playing Anduril is identical to playing an item (tap the character and the site; there is a difference as far as classification of cards for scoring goes, which is a minor rules change). The type line will also include the relevant class (for example Short Event - Wizard). {Prowess}, {Direct Influence}, etc. will use icons instead of text.


Right before ICE lost the license, they were working on a streamlined 2nd edition of the game (called LoRE: Lord of the Rings Expandable card game). I have the complete spoiler text and rules from an old mailing list and made proxies for most of the cards (I think the art files I made is lost, but I still have the printouts.) I planned on further streamlining the game to get an ARDA-like experience. I should dig up those files and see what can be salvaged.
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Kevin Eagles
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Buckled down and made a Direct Influence icon from scratch. I almost lost my mind I swear. Enlarged to see detail on the left. Right is 'actual' size...or thereabouts.

Eagles



EDIT: Oh and I decided I was being lazy earlier, and decided to remake the icons.
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Kevin Eagles
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sdiberar wrote:
Right before ICE lost the license, they were working on a streamlined 2nd edition of the game (called LoRE: Lord of the Rings Expandable card game). I have the complete spoiler text and rules from an old mailing list and made proxies for most of the cards (I think the art files I made is lost, but I still have the printouts.) I planned on further streamlining the game to get an ARDA-like experience. I should dig up those files and see what can be salvaged.


I for one would love to see what you find and/or come up with.

Eagles
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Kevin Eagles
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Revised proxy examples.

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sdiberar wrote:
Right before ICE lost the license, they were working on a streamlined 2nd edition of the game (called LoRE: Lord of the Rings Expandable card game). I have the complete spoiler text and rules from an old mailing list and made proxies for most of the cards (I think the art files I made is lost, but I still have the printouts.) I planned on further streamlining the game to get an ARDA-like experience. I should dig up those files and see what can be salvaged.

I remember reading about it back in the day but did not know the rules and the spoiler were ever released! Any chance you could dig these files and email them to me? I would love to witness that little piece of gaming history.
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Eagles wrote:
Revised proxy examples.

Pretty cool! Which program do you use to draw these?
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Kevin Eagles
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I use Microsoft Visio 2007. It really helps a ton as I have zero artistic ability. Visio makes it seem like I know what I'm doing...
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Eagles wrote:
I use Microsoft Visio 2007. It really helps a ton as I have zero artistic ability. Visio makes it seem like I know what I'm doing...

*laughing* I agree, it really does look like you know what you're doing. These are pretty cool. It's amazing how much time I spend thinking about this game despite the fact that I did not play it in years.
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Ronny Adriaens
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Why don't you replace much printed lines with a keyword? Like 'Sage makes a Corruption check modified by -3' to 'CC -3' so that the lines are shorter? That way you could still use good font size/art.
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Lord Dragon wrote:
Why don't you replace much printed lines with a keyword? Like 'Sage makes a Corruption check modified by -3' to 'CC -3' so that the lines are shorter? That way you could still use good font size/art.


On a related topic:

http://www.councilofelrond.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=19...
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José San Miguel
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sdiberar wrote:
IirionClaus wrote:
Eagles wrote:
*I* do (admittedly) find it irksome when a ccg uses 12p font on one card and then 6p on another. But as I said...I don't have a good or even reasonable answer

Personally, I would stick to two font sizes- "big" for most cards, and "small" for the crazy uberdetailed cards.

This thread returns me to an old concept of rebuilding the game with modern design technology. Keeping the same mechanics, just rewriting the rules and the cards to make them clearer and more accessible. This is how I imagine Anduril:

[1] Anduril, Flame of the West *
Item - Information - Sage
Bearer makes a Corruption Check(-3) when Anduril is played. Bearer cannot untap.
If you have Narsil, discard a stored Reforging: Attach Anduril to Narsil. Narsil gives +4 {Prowess} (maximum of 11), +1 {Direct Influence}, +1 {Corruption}. Anduril gains +3 {Marshalling Points} and {Tap}: {Untap} a Dunadan Character in the same Company. Bearer makes a Corruption Check(-1).

[1] is one point. The asterisk at the title denotes Unique. Items will be minor, major, greater, ring and information; when you think about it, playing Anduril is identical to playing an item (tap the character and the site; there is a difference as far as classification of cards for scoring goes, which is a minor rules change). The type line will also include the relevant class (for example Short Event - Wizard). {Prowess}, {Direct Influence}, etc. will use icons instead of text.


Right before ICE lost the license, they were working on a streamlined 2nd edition of the game (called LoRE: Lord of the Rings Expandable card game). I have the complete spoiler text and rules from an old mailing list and made proxies for most of the cards (I think the art files I made is lost, but I still have the printouts.) I planned on further streamlining the game to get an ARDA-like experience. I should dig up those files and see what can be salvaged.


This might be interesting to you as well:

http://www.councilofelrond.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=16...
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Kevin Eagles
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Jose-san wrote:
Lord Dragon wrote:
Why don't you replace much printed lines with a keyword? Like 'Sage makes a Corruption check modified by -3' to 'CC -3' so that the lines are shorter? That way you could still use good font size/art.


On a related topic:

http://www.councilofelrond.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=19...


Thanks! I really like the idea of using icons, and will be adding them today. I'm building the pre-con decks first and will be doing 'A' today.

What do you guys think about posting the proxies? What would be acceptable? Pics, or no pics? Ready to be sent to Printer Studio or Artscow? Just the text?

Lemme know, and thanks for all the help and input so far.

Eagles
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El-ad David Amir
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Jose-san wrote:
This might be interesting to you as well:

http://www.councilofelrond.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=16...

My friend, you are a walking archive of the Council of Elrond Do you happen to recall any threads about the potential of rebooting the game with a different them?
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