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Subject: Soon: SW:tCG LCG plugin for OCTGN rss

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Konstantinos Thoukydidis
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Hey all, some of you may know me already. I'm the creator of the OCTGN plugin for Android:Netrunner (http://octgn.gamersjudgement.com/viewtopic.php?f=52&t=494). Recently I've found out about the SW:TCG and I liked it enough to start working for a plugin for it on OCTGN.

Progress is quite good and with any luck, I'll have the first playable version within the next few days. Here's a teaser of the current progress: http://i.imgur.com/5cbnU.png (Ignore the mismatch of affiliation, this is just a quick test deck)

The game will have (for starters) my usual rules enforcement, as well as substantial automation during phase change and engagements. For example it will automatically increase your dial accordingly, calculate the balance of the force etc. The first version will lack specialized card automation (i.e. each card won't use its effect with a double click) but that will come once I have a working baseline of the core rule enforcement/automation.

So, I just wanted to inform people about it and also to perhaps add for an idea. At the moment I'm working on the automation of the engagement phase. I've already got the edge battle done, but I'm a bit stumped on how to deal with the strikes in a way that's not a complete PITA for the user (i.e. requiring extensive clicks and drag&drops). I thought maybe you lot might have some good ideas.

At the moment, the most user-friendly concept I can think of is to:

1. Double-click on the unit you need to strike with.
2. A pop-up window comes up, giving you the options for Unit Damage, Blast Damage or Tactics, depending on which icons your unit has available and/or edge-enabled. If you only have one type of icon, it is autoselected.
3. Another pop-up comes up, asking you for the target (and giving you a list of buttons of all available valid units/objectives.) You click on one and the game automatically assigns the relevant amount of damage/focus token to the target(s). Your unit gets a focus token (or two if you're committed to the force)
4. Your opponent has a chance now to play reactions (i.e. use shield tokens to cancel damage/tactics)
5. Once reactions are over, if your unit had more than one type of combat icon, you have to double click on it again (or use a special shortcut) to action the rest of the strike. Go to step 2 (or step 3, if only 1 combat icon type remains) and repeat.

Once all strike effects from the unit has been resolved, the next player can strike with their own unit.

At the moment I'm not particularly happy with this scenario. It requires 2/5/8 actions/clicks on behalf of the player for each strike, given 1/2/3 types of combat icon types. This seems to be too much but I can't think of a more elegant way to do it.


Nevermind, that, I've already come up with a slightly better way imho

What do you think?

PS: For the moment you can follow some of the development here: https://github.com/db0/Star-Wars-LCG-OCTGN
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Carlos Saldanha
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Re: Soon: SW:TCG plugin for OCTGN
This is SW:LCG and not SW:TCG.

Good work.
 
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Andrew Holder
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Re: Soon: SW:TCG plugin for OCTGN
oDESGOSTO wrote:
This is SW:LCG and not SW:TCG.

Good work.


Star Wars: The Card Game (TCG). It is also an LCG
 
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Flying Arrow
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Re: Soon: SW:TCG plugin for OCTGN
oDESGOSTO wrote:
This is SW:LCG and not SW:TCG.

Good work.


Actually, it is an LCG, but its name is SW:TCG (Star Wars: The Card Game). Easily confused with SW:TCG (Star Wars: Trading Card Game). Personally, I think the name "The Card Game" is pretty bad, but oh well.
 
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Nick Jordan
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Re: Soon: SW:TCG plugin for OCTGN
How about SW:TLCG (Star Wars: The Living Card Game)?
 
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Konstantinos Thoukydidis
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Re: Soon: SW:TCG plugin for OCTGN
oDESGOSTO wrote:
This is SW:LCG and not SW:TCG.

Good work.


Heh, I actually debated with myself weather I should write SW:LCG or SW:TCG. I figured that people were going to comment it out anyway
 
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Dustin Crenshaw
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Re: Soon: SW:TCG plugin for OCTGN
definitely not a TCG. It's not a trading card game. fixed packs mean most people won't be trading cards.
 
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Andrew Holder
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Re: Soon: SW:TCG plugin for OCTGN
SeerMagic wrote:
definitely not a TCG. It's not a trading card game. fixed packs mean most people won't be trading cards.


Right but in this case TCG means "The Card Game"
 
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Alexander Duprey
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Re: Soon: SW:TCG plugin for OCTGN
Yessssssssssssss
 
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Bernd Caspers
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Re: Soon: SW:TCG plugin for OCTGN
I thought this was going to be a fun little racing game, were you can race Luke, Han , Leia , Obi-Wan and Vader and the whole crew, known as "Star Wars: The Cart Game". shake
 
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Alex Eding
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Re: Soon: SW:TCG plugin for OCTGN
The Jakster wrote:
I thought this was going to be a fun little racing game, were you can race Luke, Han , Leia , Obi-Wan and Vader and the whole crew, known as "Star Wars: The Cart Game". shake


Sounds awful. But as I'm a drooling fanboy, I'll buy it.

Wait till the Mickey, Donald and Goofy expansions!!!
 
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Johan Larsson
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Re: Soon: SW:TCG plugin for OCTGN
DbZer0 wrote:
Hey all, some of you may know me already. I'm the creator of the OCTGN plugin for Android:Netrunner (http://octgn.gamersjudgement.com/viewtopic.php?f=52&t=494). Recently I've found out about the SW:TCG and I liked it enough to start working for a plugin for it on OCTGN.

Progress is quite good and with any luck, I'll have the first playable version within the next few days. Here's a teaser of the current progress: http://i.imgur.com/5cbnU.png (Ignore the mismatch of affiliation, this is just a quick test deck)

The game will have (for starters) my usual rules enforcement, as well as substantial automation during phase change and engagements. For example it will automatically increase your dial accordingly, calculate the balance of the force etc. The first version will lack specialized card automation (i.e. each card won't use its effect with a double click) but that will come once I have a working baseline of the core rule enforcement/automation.

So, I just wanted to inform people about it and also to perhaps add for an idea. At the moment I'm working on the automation of the engagement phase. I've already got the edge battle done, but I'm a bit stumped on how to deal with the strikes in a way that's not a complete PITA for the user (i.e. requiring extensive clicks and drag&drops). I thought maybe you lot might have some good ideas.

At the moment, the most user-friendly concept I can think of is to:

1. Double-click on the unit you need to strike with.
2. A pop-up window comes up, giving you the options for Unit Damage, Blast Damage or Tactics, depending on which icons your unit has available and/or edge-enabled. If you only have one type of icon, it is autoselected.
3. Another pop-up comes up, asking you for the target (and giving you a list of buttons of all available valid units/objectives.) You click on one and the game automatically assigns the relevant amount of damage/focus token to the target(s). Your unit gets a focus token (or two if you're committed to the force)
4. Your opponent has a chance now to play reactions (i.e. use shield tokens to cancel damage/tactics)
5. Once reactions are over, if your unit had more than one type of combat icon, you have to double click on it again (or use a special shortcut) to action the rest of the strike. Go to step 2 (or step 3, if only 1 combat icon type remains) and repeat.

Once all strike effects from the unit has been resolved, the next player can strike with their own unit.

At the moment I'm not particularly happy with this scenario. It requires 2/5/8 actions/clicks on behalf of the player for each strike, given 1/2/3 types of combat icon types. This seems to be too much but I can't think of a more elegant way to do it.

What do you think?

PS: For the moment you can follow some of the development here: https://github.com/db0/Star-Wars-LCG-OCTGN


Just some cautionary advice, don't make this available until after the game itself has actually been released. FFG is usually pretty relaxed regarding this sort of thing, supporting the fact that the community does cool stuff with their games, but releasing an online playable version before they release the game itself is dangerous. We all want to be able to enjoy your efforts, so it wouldn't be good if they had to shut you down :-)
 
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Konstantinos Thoukydidis
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Re: Soon: SW:TCG plugin for OCTGN
I don't worry about it. I released Α:NR a full month before the game was in the stores. No problems.
 
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Chouffot Rémy
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Re: Soon: SW:TCG plugin for OCTGN
Quote:
At the moment, the most user-friendly concept I can think of is to:

1. Double-click on the unit you need to strike with.
2. A pop-up window comes up, giving you the options for Unit Damage, Blast Damage or Tactics, depending on which icons your unit has available and/or edge-enabled. If you only have one type of icon, it is autoselected.
3. Another pop-up comes up, asking you for the target (and giving you a list of buttons of all available valid units/objectives.) You click on one and the game automatically assigns the relevant amount of damage/focus token to the target(s). Your unit gets a focus token (or two if you're committed to the force)
4. Your opponent has a chance now to play reactions (i.e. use shield tokens to cancel damage/tactics)
5. Once reactions are over, if your unit had more than one type of combat icon, you have to double click on it again (or use a special shortcut) to action the rest of the strike. Go to step 2 (or step 3, if only 1 combat icon type remains) and repeat.

Once all strike effects from the unit has been resolved, the next player can strike with their own unit.

At the moment I'm not particularly happy with this scenario. It requires 2/5/8 actions/clicks on behalf of the player for each strike, given 1/2/3 types of combat icon types. This seems to be too much but I can't think of a more elegant way to do it.


My tought :
A. you can change the double click of the step 1 by a right click on the unit and by selecting in the RIGHT Click's menu the type of damage (in order to skip step 2)?
B. Before selecting the type of damage by the "A." way, the player need to select the target with SHIFT-clicking the cards like infiltration. The problem is when you have a unit with multiple-target possibility (Luke for example).

The advantages of that mechanic are :
- The player target before applying damage, your opponnent has a visual knowledge of the damage/focus' target
- No pop-up windows, you see the battlefield all the time

my 2 cents

Good job on ANR by the way, I really hope that you can make as good for SW : LCG/TCG
 
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Konstantinos Thoukydidis
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Re: Soon: SW:TCG plugin for OCTGN
Skychapon wrote:

My tought :
A. you can change the double click of the step 1 by a right click on the unit and by selecting in the RIGHT Click's menu the type of damage (in order to skip step 2)?
B. Before selecting the type of damage by the "A." way, the player need to select the target with SHIFT-clicking the cards like infiltration. The problem is when you have a unit with multiple-target possibility (Luke for example).

The advantages of that mechanic are :
- The player target before applying damage, your opponnent has a visual knowledge of the damage/focus' target
- No pop-up windows, you see the battlefield all the time

my 2 cents


Yeah, I've worked it out yesterday in a similar way after all. The way it works is:

* The controller of the unit, double clicks the unit, which automatically calculates and assigns counters.
** Blast Damage is automatically assigned to the objective. No need to target anything.
** If the striking unit has only Unit Damage or only 1 Tactics, then, if an enemy unit is already targeted with shift-click, the counter will be assigned there directly.
** If the striking unit has Unit Damage AND Tactics, or 2 or more Tactics, then nothing is done automated except blast damage. The controller need to target what he needs and use the special shortcuts Alt+D and Alt+F to add Damage and Focus counter on the targets respectively.

I think that works fast in most cases.

Quote:

Good job on ANR by the way, I really hope that you can make as good for SW : LCG/TCG


I surely aim to
 
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Andrew Brannan
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Re: Soon: SW:TCG plugin for OCTGN
DbZer0 wrote:
I don't worry about it. I released Α:NR a full month before the game was in the stores. No problems.


Yet.


Look, if a company is going to be as kind regarding online versions as FFG is (the standard line they give is not to release an online version until the physical copy has been out for six months), why spit in their faces and defy that? They've made the effort to meet the online community halfway, with the alternate being lawsuits and Cease and Desist letters, why not be a stand up person and honor that agreement?



SW:TCG (Star Wars: Trading Card Game)
SW:tCG (Star Ware: the Card Game)
 
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Chouffot Rémy
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Re: Soon: SW:TCG plugin for OCTGN
DbZer0 wrote:

Yeah, I've worked it out yesterday in a similar way after all. The way it works is:

* The controller of the unit, double clicks the unit, which automatically calculates and assigns counters.
** Blast Damage is automatically assigned to the objective. No need to target anything.
** If the striking unit has only Unit Damage or only 1 Tactics, then, if an enemy unit is already targeted with shift-click, the counter will be assigned there directly.
** If the striking unit has Unit Damage AND Tactics, or 2 or more Tactics, then nothing is done automated except blast damage. The controller need to target what he needs and use the special shortcuts Alt+D and Alt+F to add Damage and Focus counter on the targets respectively.

I think that works fast in most cases.


I have made a list of units whose this way is not automated, there are not a lot of units (8) and for half the units need to gain the edge to acquire the Tactic AND Unit Damage (OR MultiTactics) (I didn't represent Blast Damage here because they are automated) :

Always when striking :
1. ObiWan: BUD - BT - WT
2. Han Solo: BUD - BUD - BT
3. Twileck Smuggler: BUD - BT
4. Emperor Palpatine: BT - BT - WT

Only if the player has the edge :
5. Yoda: WUD - WT
6. Leia: BUD - WT
7. Twileck loyalist: WUD - WT
8. Boba fett: BUD - WUD - WT

UD = Unit Damage
T = Tactics
W=White
B=Black

So the majority of units will just need to target a card before apply damage/focus when they strike. I think you're new way will work fine!
 
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Konstantinos Thoukydidis
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Re: Soon: SW:TCG plugin for OCTGN
abrannan wrote:
DbZer0 wrote:
I don't worry about it. I released Α:NR a full month before the game was in the stores. No problems.


Yet.


Look, if a company is going to be as kind regarding online versions as FFG is (the standard line they give is not to release an online version until the physical copy has been out for six months), why spit in their faces and defy that? They've made the effort to meet the online community halfway, with the alternate being lawsuits and Cease and Desist letters, why not be a stand up person and honor that agreement?



Because I am not going to limit myself out of fear.

I actually haven't seen any official line like what you say but I have heard similar rumors. Which is why I release a censored version of the cards for the first months.

I am not spitting in their face, quite the opposite in fact. Online versions and their communities are like free advertising (I've had A LOT of people who were kind enough to inform me that they bought A:NR because they had a chance to try it out online first) and I'm fairly confident that FFG recognises that already, given their fairly gracious attitude until now.

If they decide to lawyer up and C&D me, well, it's just going to shoot their own foot. The plugin isn't going to go offline anyway (someone will upload the sets via torrents and the game definition is out of reach since it's just code) and they're going to piss off some of their greatest fans.

Sorry but I disagree strongly with permission culture. I prefer that people get to enjoy these great games asap because I know it will only boost their eventual sales AND allow those of us without easy access to other local players to enjoy them.
 
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Konstantinos Thoukydidis
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Re: Soon: SW:TCG plugin for OCTGN
Skychapon wrote:
DbZer0 wrote:

Yeah, I've worked it out yesterday in a similar way after all. The way it works is:

* The controller of the unit, double clicks the unit, which automatically calculates and assigns counters.
** Blast Damage is automatically assigned to the objective. No need to target anything.
** If the striking unit has only Unit Damage or only 1 Tactics, then, if an enemy unit is already targeted with shift-click, the counter will be assigned there directly.
** If the striking unit has Unit Damage AND Tactics, or 2 or more Tactics, then nothing is done automated except blast damage. The controller need to target what he needs and use the special shortcuts Alt+D and Alt+F to add Damage and Focus counter on the targets respectively.

I think that works fast in most cases.


I have made a list of units whose this way is not automated, there are not a lot of units (8) and for half the units need to gain the edge to acquire the Tactic AND Unit Damage (OR MultiTactics) (I didn't represent Blast Damage here because they are automated) :

Always when striking :
1. ObiWan: BUD - BT - WT
2. Han Solo: BUD - BUD - BT
3. Twileck Smuggler: BUD - BT
4. Emperor Palpatine: BT - BT - WT

Only if the player has the edge :
5. Yoda: WUD - WT
6. Leia: BUD - WT
7. Twileck loyalist: WUD - WT
8. Boba fett: BUD - WUD - WT

UD = Unit Damage
T = Tactics
W=White
B=Black

So the majority of units will just need to target a card before apply damage/focus when they strike. I think you're new way will work fine!


Excellent. Thanks for the info mate
 
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Piotr Jekel
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Re: Soon: SW:TCG plugin for OCTGN
Your Netrunner plugin is GREAT. Let the force be with you for SW as well.

As for releasing an online version before the boxes hit the shelves, I am with Db0 on this one. I know about 10 people who bought or want to buy ANR after playing a few games online. In fact, FFG should sponsor Db0 for creating such a great tool. It certainly helps them with their sales.

Thanks for all your effort.

Waiting (im)patiently for the release of your plugin...

 
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David C.
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Re: Soon: SW:TCG plugin for OCTGN
Looking forward to your implementation. For deckbuilding and first-play-experience I did the plugin for myself and a friend directly after the spoilers came up.

But since I have only little experience (I mostly copied some of the functions out of other plugins - did this before with Summoner Wars) its not that good-looking and smooth to play (commiting to the force and readying all units doesnt work that well in my home-made-version). But hey, it worked

Didnt play Netrunner but watched some videos about your plugin. Hope SW:TCG will be as good as well
 
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Konstantinos Thoukydidis
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Re: Soon: SW:TCG plugin for OCTGN
Torala wrote:
Looking forward to your implementation. For deckbuilding and first-play-experience I did the plugin for myself and a friend directly after the spoilers came up.

But since I have only little experience (I mostly copied some of the functions out of other plugins - did this before with Summoner Wars) its not that good-looking and smooth to play (commiting to the force and readying all units doesnt work that well in my home-made-version). But hey, it worked

Didnt play Netrunner but watched some videos about your plugin. Hope SW:TCG will be as good as well


Yeah, no worries. I've got some sweet automations to take care of the tedium, so that players can focus on the actual decisions, rather than fighting the engine

For the record: Committing to the force is just one shortcut. The game will then keep track of committed units and automatically calculate who wins the balance. Refreshing cards happens automatically during second phase. You don't even have to think about it
 
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Hey why are all the card censored?

Where can I get a "normal" set?
 
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Konstantinos Thoukydidis
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It's a safety measure to avoid getting sued by FFG.

Look here if you want a way to uncensor your set: http://octgn.gamersjudgement.com/viewtopic.php?f=52&t=496

 
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