Recommend
6 
 Thumb up
 Hide
29 Posts
1 , 2  Next »   | 

Carcassonne» Forums » General

Subject: what am I missing? rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
ben axe
msg tools
I picked up this game after reading reviews on BGG,
i enjoy euro games but i find carcassone completely boring, uneventful, with very few strategic decisions.
It's the first miss i have since picking popular games (top 100) on BGG.
so what am i missing?

I played the game 2-3 time with my girlfriend. I was expecting a cutthroat type of experience (as mentioned in many reviews for the 2p game), but found that the blocking opportunities are really limited (due to the rule that similar features must connect to similar features).
and as a result she was building a massive city on one side of the map,
while i was putting up a farmer, a few small cities, a few roads, and some churches on the other side.
Closing her city early before it grows to a massive stage seems like a bad strategy (why give her 4 points, when i can get other points on the other side of the map?)

We somewhat understand the farmer placement, but we both tend to place one farmer each fairly early in the game, and most often our farms merge, canceling the affect of the farmer.

after the few games we played, she described this game as game for five year old where you match shapes and collect points.
so what are we missing? it must have won game of the year for some reason...
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Runcible Spoon
United States
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Here are a couple of suggestions:

1. Play with a hand of 3 tiles. The strategic options open up a lot when you have some choices about what to keep vs. what to play from turn to turn. The draw and place basic mechanic is puny and it reduces both tactical (short term) and strategic (long term) planning possibilities.

2. Block, block, block. As you play more you will start to realize certain configurations of tiles will be harder to find at different stages of the game. Therefore clever blocking can really tank an opponent.

3. Try playing against a really experienced player and watch what they do, it won't be very much like what a new player to carcassonne will do.

4. Go for the steal (or at least split the points). A player should never be building a large city unchecked. Keep in mind it is a 2 step process to start competing for a partially completed and claimed resources. So lay a tile near the city with a meeple on the city portion of the tile. Then connect it to the opponents city with another tile on the next turn. Having a hand of 3 tiles will really help with this process because it enables you to plan ahead more effectively both in terms of pursuing your own strategy and defeating your opponents' strategy.

5. Farms are often times contested to the end among experienced players. It takes practice to see the opportunities, and sometimes it takes 2 or even 3 steps, but you should know that really valuable farms are often contested to the end with multiple meeples by multiple players.

6. Buy Inns and Cathedrals and Traders and Builders (they are both pretty cheap expansions) and they really ramp up the replay value and they add a lot to the tactical and strategic options available in the game.

7. Closing thought. I have taught this game to around 120 people (I started playing carc long before I ever logged a play on BGG).

New players often times 1) miss the tactical opportunities 2) don't have viable long term plans 3) miss the complexity open to those who do see the tactical opportunities and have long term plans 4) get mopped up on by really experienced players because they do not contest enough features on the board and they let veteran players get away with a lot of things that other veteran players would not allow 5) new players tend to play almost multi-player solitaire for their first few games. I have seen this in extreme forms where you can see people physically only placing meeples on "their" end of the map.

Carc 2p should be very confrontational, if not then you are probably letting your opponent get away with a lot of stuff.

Kind of a long post, sorry, but I have lots of face to face games of carc under my belt over the years so I thought I would share some experiences with you.
28 
 Thumb up
0.05
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Fotrich Trucks
msg tools
mbmbmb
For a more cutthroat game try to

steal large cities: place a city tile with meeple at an open end of the city and try to connect. For one time the city is neutral, second time you get the points.

block large cities: place a tile at the open end of the city, so there is no tile to close the city (not all combinations are in the game)

take the merged farms: like city-stealing, place a tile with farmer near the large farm and try to connect the farms, so you have the majority.
7 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Steve Kennedy

New Hampshire
msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
It sounds like you are not using river tiles. We found your impressions to be ours as well and the game went into the closet.

However, a great FLGS salesperson explained the use of the River tiles that came with our game edition. We picked up the Inns and Cathedrals expansion and Traders and Builders and we were hooked.

I think the River adds some dispersion to the game and spreads it out more. The other two expansions allow for some additinal interesting ways to add to the game/ Since we have all but the Catapult expansion now, we can mix and match the game to fit our time needs as well. It has become my wife's favorite game next to Stone Age (of all things).

Don't give up on it yet, however, if you are not interested in the tile-laying mechanism no expansion to this will change your mind.cool

We've played this with up to 5 people and that seems like too many depending on if one player is heavy into analyzing possibilities. 3-4 is a good number, but we love playing it as a good 2-player.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Michael Poplawski
Canada
Victoria
British Columbia
flag msg tools
Meetup.com Victoria German Language Meetup Group
badge
Wer lesen kann ist klar im Vorteil.
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
The competitive essence of the game lies in two concepts that may have been overlooked when reading the rules and otherwise thinking about the game.

First, two features with a follower (be they cities, farms, or roads) can be combined to form one combined feature with several followers on it. If a feature has more than one follower on it, those players score points for the feature equally. If a feature has one player with more followers on it than from any other player, that player alone scores for the feature, while the other players score no points.

Secondly, the game has 72 tiles with a specific distribution. To complete any feature, the correct tiles must be drawn and there must be a legal play for the tile. A player's attempts to complete a feature can be thwarted through the placement of tiles by another player.

The game can be played quite peacefully. However, especially with 2-players, it takes a fair bit of planning to prevent an opponent from ruining your plans to gain an edge. The longer a feature remains unfinished, the more likely a good opponent will try to sneak in and try to share points with them, or even claim the feature for themselves.

I think it's worth giving the game a chance. Even if the basic game at some point becomes an exercise in executing the same tactics repeatedly (although I'm personally happy to play it with anyone after hundreds of plays), there are expansions for the game which deepen the game considerably through more tiles and a few more rules. Give the game another try!
5 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Ian Sharma-Cook
United Kingdom
Pinner
London
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Carcassonne in its basic box, is almost a game a five year old can play, indeed I play it with my 3 years old and her cousin who is seven and they loe the tile matching. The three year old dioesnt ahve a clue about sciring but the 7 years old is fgripped by buiklding the longst road or largest city.

Saying this dont take it as a child's game, it can be as confrontational as you want it to be . Closing cities off early if you want to, or claim city sections that are not yet joined to larger cities winning all or a share the points earned when they are built.

Also farmers benfit from lots of small cities rather than large cities in the end game scoring, so keeping them small means you get a bigger bonus with your connected farmers.

I enjoy Carcassonne immensley as its simple but the potential for some whopping scores lurk around every tile placement. Keep trying it, maybe add a 3rd player to have some alternative challengers in the midst.

The expansions alos add to the cut and thust of what is a simple but deceptively enthralling game.

3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Purple Murple
Canada
flag msg tools
I play with my GF all the time, and when we want to play competative we add a few key expansions.

The Tower- People seem to say this ones terrible, but when combined with a few other expansions it works awesome, might wanna only use half the tower pieces for just two people however, else it can become alittle too cutthroat and make it scary to place meeples/build.

The Fliers mini- I love this one, its alotta luck involved but its a blast to parachute meeples into bases and steal cities that way.

The Cathars- its a nice addition, but might want to buy (make) two sets because 4 isnt quite enought. Not as much cutthroat as the first two, but can definatly put a damper on larger cities if your having a hard time cashing in on them.

The phantom- Not really cutthroat but helps greatly with certain strategies, We always use the house rule that he can only be played in addition to regular follower, if all reg. followers on board, phantom is rendered useless and must remain out of play, helps steal some of the smaller points if you use him properly and dont get him stuck on the board.

The ferries mini- Not really cut throat but when combined with I&C can really make those roads pointy. plus you can fight over the ferry to steal part some of the others hard work

There are others that work well but these are the best I've found with 2 players, this is a very house rule friendly game, we often play with hands of 2-3 cards, also helps with the strategies and removes a portion of the luck
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Josh Lacey
United States
Portage
Michigan
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Runcible Spoon wrote:
Here are a couple of suggestions:

1. Play with a hand of 3 tiles. The strategic options open up a lot when you have some choices about what to keep vs. what to play from turn to turn. The draw and place basic mechanic is puny and it reduces both tactical (short term) and strategic (long term) planning possibilities.

2. Block, block, block. As you play more you will start to realize certain configurations of tiles will be harder to find at different stages of the game. Therefore clever blocking can really tank an opponent.

3. Try playing against a really experienced player and watch what they do, it won't be very much like what a new player to carcassonne will do.

4. Go for the steal (or at least split the points). A player should never be building a large city unchecked. Keep in mind it is a 2 step process to start competing for a partially completed and claimed resources. So lay a tile near the city with a meeple on the city portion of the tile. Then connect it to the opponents city with another tile on the next turn. Having a hand of 3 tiles will really help with this process because it enables you to plan ahead more effectively both in terms of pursuing your own strategy and defeating your opponents' strategy.

5. Farms are often times contested to the end among experienced players. It takes practice to see the opportunities, and sometimes it takes 2 or even 3 steps, but you should know that really valuable farms are often contested to the end with multiple meeples by multiple players.

6. Buy Inns and Cathedrals and Traders and Builders (they are both pretty cheap expansions) and they really ramp up the replay value and they add a lot to the tactical and strategic options available in the game.

7. Closing thought. I have taught this game to around 120 people (I started playing carc long before I ever logged a play on BGG).

New players often times 1) miss the tactical opportunities 2) don't have viable long term plans 3) miss the complexity open to those who do see the tactical opportunities and have long term plans 4) get mopped up on by really experienced players because they do not contest enough features on the board and they let veteran players get away with a lot of things that other veteran players would not allow 5) new players tend to play almost multi-player solitaire for their first few games. I have seen this in extreme forms where you can see people physically only placing meeples on "their" end of the map.

Carc 2p should be very confrontational, if not then you are probably letting your opponent get away with a lot of stuff.

Kind of a long post, sorry, but I have lots of face to face games of carc under my belt over the years so I thought I would share some experiences with you.


Everything he says...except playing with a hand of 3 tiles. I especially agree on point #6. Playing with 3 tiles is not a bad way to play. However while you're learning, focus on one tile at a time so that you learn the strategic use of each tile before you try to start weighing multiple tiles vs each other at once.

To help teach yourself try to build your own up with one tile and try and penalize the other player with your next tile...just while you learn.

Common ways to hurt your opponent below.
-Place a road tile so that it will be difficult to complete a city. Closed cities are worth 1/2 as many points...especially if it can make it difficult for an opponent to finish a cloister. Keeping their meeples on the board with uncompleted structures gives you more reign on the board.
-Mostly let the opponent have their roads...but if they build them big steal jump in and share the points. Roads are the lowest value points, and to spend a lot of tiles on one only to gain no benefit over the opponent is demoralizing.
-With Farming and Cities always, always, always be focusing on where you can build into existing structures to share the wealth, and if possible steal the wealth. Let them spend the effort building their big point structures, and then sneak in and grab the spoils. This is probably the biggest one. Roam the board with your eyes all game long...especially your opponents "side" as some players tend to play geographically.
7 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jacek Wieszaczewski
Poland
Wrocław
Poland
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
bentzi wrote:
we both tend to place one farmer each fairly early in the game, and most often our farms merge, canceling the affect of the farmer

First step to cutthroat playing: try to place a second farmer somewhere and merge all farms, so that you take the points and her farmer is worthless.

Then you will have "farmer wars" stage - where a game is two games in one - each player closes his own roads/cities/cloisters and in the meantime both fight for the big farm (which appears in most games).

After some games like this you will start noticing that not only the big farm is worth fighting and stealing cities or roads will start. Then you have a true cutthroat Carcassonne game. It just requires a bit of skill and this comes with experience, first games are almost always more peaceful than they should be.

And get Inns & Cathedrals ASAP - they will encourage road or city stealing, as this expansion makes those features matter more. And The Phantom, which is small expansion but really a brilliant idea. If after some playing you like the game and want more, I think Traders & Builders and The Tower (if you want even more competitive games) are the way to go.
6 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Yee Keat Phuah
Malaysia
flag msg tools
My wife loves the Princess and Dragon expansion, it adds a bit of fun and havocness, and make sure you don't "camp" in one area.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Scott Dye
United States
Murfreesboro
Tennessee
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
I agree with most of the advice here, except for the suggestion to play with a hand of three tiles. For the love of Pete, please do not do this. Every other suggestion here stays within the actual rules of the game as it was designed - the game did get the accolades it got without needing a hand of three. Part of the design of this game is learning what to do with each tile as it is given to you. Over time you learn clever ways to use "inferior" tile draws. For instance, I only learned how effective road tiles were for blocking by being forced to play them as my only draw - something I don't feel I would have ever learned if I could have pawned that tile for later use in a hand of three.

The other thing I would say that is different perspective than what is already been said - be ready to buy Inns & Cathedrals and Phantom (both are excellent additions IMO), but don't do it yet, until you have played several more games to find out if you actually like Carc enough. Pretty much every post here agrees that you just need a little more playtime for the more subtle strategies to show through (joining and/or stealing your opponents city or farm, farm battles, etc), and I agree with that as well. Adding more overt strategies via expansion will just hide those subtle (yet very important) strategies even further. The base game has a charm of it's own, especially due to the limited nature of the possible tile combinations. It's pretty hard to stop your opponent in the base game due to the limited number of tile configurations. It can definitely be done, it's just not always obvious, and relies somewhat on taking risks to do so.

Playing with only the base game will also allow for much shorter games as opposed to even adding Inns & Cathedrals, which means you two can play more games in an play session, and in turn learn more.

If you are currently thinking that the game is not cutthroat enough already, I would not play with the river expansion yet either. The river will spread out the field of play, and lead to less confrontation in general, not more.

If you do try expansions at this point, though, I&C is the way to go.

Hopefully this game will reveal itself to you a little more, but it can be very different depending on the opponent. It may just be that this game isn't suited to the combined playstyles of you and your girlfriend.

Good luck!
5 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Runcible Spoon
United States
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
porkozone wrote:
I agree with most of the advice here, except for the suggestion to play with a hand of three tiles. For the love of Pete, please do not do this.


I disagree and will offer some justification for that disagreement.

Quote:
Part of the design of this game is learning what to do with each tile as it is given to you. Over time you learn clever ways to use "inferior" tile draws.


1. You're framing for this point is poor. All of the tiles in the game must be used even if you have a hand of 3 therefore one must still find ways to use all the tiles. Therefore I do not find this argument compelling.

Quote:
For instance, I only learned how effective road tiles were for blocking by being forced to play them as my only draw


2. You could have learned blocking as a strategy in other game environments with a hand of tiles of number X. Learning blocking is not reducible to the hand size of a given number. Would it stand to reason that had carc debuted with hand rule of 2, or 4 or whatever number of tiles that no one would have discovered blocking? This seems doubtful so I also do not find your argument compelling.

3. Being "forced" is problematic. On the one hand we all enjoy games in part because games are a system of rules that place some limitations on players. However, a reduction of a player's choices and restrictions on autonomy, when it goes to far, leads to a poor game experience.

Research on autonomy and its role in motivation has shown that a small amount of choice leads to an enhanced affective experience in many ways. Interestingly too much choice, or too little, reduces the positive experience and can lead to a negative one.

I would argue that 'draw and place' has the least amount of autonomy and reduces game enjoyment. I would also think that having a hand size of 15 would be way to much and also reduce enjoyment for many players. The most beneficial hand size might be some number other than 3, but I doubt it is zero as in the case of 'place and draw.' Therefore I do not find arguments that less choice makes for a more enjoyable game experience to be compelling.

I would characterize a possible hand size of X in carc the following way.

Less strategy - higher luck environment
1. Smaller hand sizes reduce opportunities for skillful long term planning and increases the role of luck. This is a good game state for new players because it minimizes the role of experience. You seem to prefer this game state. Now of course experienced players could share this preference also for a variety of reasons but simply having this preference does not refute the other benefits of having a hand size of 3 (or some other number) it merely is a reflection of preference for that given player.

More strategy - lower luck environment
2. Larger hand sizes increases the opportunities for long term planning and decreases the role of luck. Notice I did not say 'no luck' just 'less.' This is a good game state for experienced players. I prefer this one.

I conclude that hand size manipulates (increasing/decreasing) the role of strategy and luck in the game environment and that one's game preferences should dictate how one plays the game.

I like more strategy and less luck, you like the opposite. It is a matter of preference.

I would recommend a hand of some size X (and other players can determine the correct X for their preferences) as a better way to play for others who have my preference for more strategy and less luck.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
United States
Providence
Rhode Island
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Runcible Spoon wrote:
porkozone wrote:
I agree with most of the advice here, except for the suggestion to play with a hand of three tiles. For the love of Pete, please do not do this.


I disagree and will offer some justification for that disagreement.

Quote:
Part of the design of this game is learning what to do with each tile as it is given to you. Over time you learn clever ways to use "inferior" tile draws.


1. You're framing for this point is poor. All of the tiles in the game must be used even if you have a hand of 3 therefore one must still find ways to use all the tiles. Therefore I do not find this argument compelling.

Quote:
For instance, I only learned how effective road tiles were for blocking by being forced to play them as my only draw


2. You could have learned blocking as a strategy in other game environments with a hand of tiles of number X. Learning blocking is not reducible to the hand size of a given number. Would it stand to reason that had carc debuted with hand rule of 2, or 4 or whatever number of tiles that no one would have discovered blocking? This seems doubtful so I also do not find your argument compelling.

3. Being "forced" is problematic. On the one hand we all enjoy games in part because games are a system of rules that place some limitations on players. However, a reduction of a player's choices and restrictions on autonomy, when it goes to far, leads to a poor game experience.

Research on autonomy and its role in motivation has shown that a small amount of choice leads to an enhanced affective experience in many ways. Interestingly too much choice, or too little, reduces the positive experience and can lead to a negative one.

I would argue that 'draw and place' has the least amount of autonomy and reduces game enjoyment. I would also think that having a hand size of 15 would be way to much and also reduce enjoyment for many players. The most beneficial hand size might be some number other than 3, but I doubt it is zero as in the case of 'place and draw.' Therefore I do not find arguments that less choice makes for a more enjoyable game experience to be compelling.

I would characterize a possible hand size of X in carc the following way.

Less strategy - higher luck environment
1. Smaller hand sizes reduce opportunities for skillful long term planning and increases the role of luck. This is a good game state for new players because it minimizes the role of experience. You seem to prefer this game state. Now of course experienced players could share this preference also for a variety of reasons but simply having this preference does not refute the other benefits of having a hand size of 3 (or some other number) it merely is a reflection of preference for that given player.

More strategy - lower luck environment
2. Larger hand sizes increases the opportunities for long term planning and decreases the role of luck. Notice I did not say 'no luck' just 'less.' This is a good game state for experienced players. I prefer this one.

I conclude that hand size manipulates (increasing/decreasing) the role of strategy and luck in the game environment and that one's game preferences should dictate how one plays the game.

I like more strategy and less luck, you like the opposite. It is a matter of preference.

I would recommend a hand of some size X (and other players can determine the correct X for their preferences) as a better way to play for others who have my preference for more strategy and less luck.


Ok, I pick "x" where "x" = the entire tile pool. That is, play with all tiles face up and select any tile you want to play.

That increases/maximizes your long-term planning, maxes out strategy, and removes all luck from the game, and by your definition, might be the best way to play?

I know, sounds absurd. Probably because it is...shake



2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Runcible Spoon
United States
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
markgravitygood wrote:


Ok, I pick "x" where "x" = the entire tile pool. That is, play with all tiles face up and select any tile you want to play.

That increases/maximizes your long-term planning, maxes out strategy, and removes all luck from the game, and by your definition, might be the best way to play?

I know, sounds absurd. Probably because it is...



That is a poor attempt at a straw man argument. Or perhaps it is good at being a straw man which is why it is a fallacious argument.

More to the point you should actually read the entire post instead of quote the entire post.

Here is a useful quote from my post with a little emphasis added.

Runcible Spoon wrote:
"I would argue that 'draw and place' has the least amount of autonomy and reduces game enjoyment. I would also think that having a hand size of 15 would be way to much and also reduce enjoyment for many players. The most beneficial hand size might be some number other than 3, but I doubt it is zero...


So no, that silly straw man proposal does not fit the characteristics I set forth.

3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Scott Dye
United States
Murfreesboro
Tennessee
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Ok so lets not hijack this thread anymore bantering on our strategic philosophy.

Yes, changing the core rules could lead to a different strategic experience. My point is, I think it's bad advice to tell a new player who is struggling to change a core rule to make it better. That's not giving the game a fair chance. It's like telling a new, struggling chess player that they can let the pawns move like other pieces so they'll have more options.
9 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
I'm strongly against having any hand size. It reduces the strategy aspect a lot.

You can't build anything large if your opponent always has a good chance of stealing your stuff. If he has a range of tiles to choose from his chance is much bigger. So it reduces the game to grabbing points as fast as you can.

Imagine for a moment what happens if you give each player a few 'joker'-tiles. Because that's what a hand is approximating. I can already see the strategy increasing...shake

Just learn to get the maximum out of your current tile. Your opponent has the same problems/challenges. It's the base of the game. If you can't do that, don't try to compensate it by made up rules that dumb down the essence... Just learn it

If you add for example Inns and Cathedrals you have enough tiles that any luck evens out more. (That being said, I don't like adding too much expansions because after a while you have tiles for any situation, thus removing the blocking aspect of the game. And that makes you play more careless)

Keep in mind that I'm talking about 2 player games. And of course you play however you like it, I'm not trying to push my view, but it's not an advice I would give starting players.
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
United States
Providence
Rhode Island
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Runcible Spoon wrote:
markgravitygood wrote:


Ok, I pick "x" where "x" = the entire tile pool. That is, play with all tiles face up and select any tile you want to play.

That increases/maximizes your long-term planning, maxes out strategy, and removes all luck from the game, and by your definition, might be the best way to play?

I know, sounds absurd. Probably because it is...



That is a poor attempt at a straw man argument. Or perhaps it is good at being a straw man which is why it is a fallacious argument.

Sure, if I was actually making an argument. But of course, I wasn't.

Sarcasm lost? Apparently so.

Runcible Spoon wrote:

More to the point you should actually read the entire post instead of quote the entire post.

Here is a useful quote from my post with a little emphasis added.

Runcible Spoon wrote:
"I would argue that 'draw and place' has the least amount of autonomy and reduces game enjoyment. I would also think that having a hand size of 15 would be way to much and also reduce enjoyment for many players. The most beneficial hand size might be some number other than 3, but I doubt it is zero...


So no, that silly straw man proposal does not fit the characteristics I set forth.



[SarcasmTagsForYourBenefit]
Thanks for the very useful quote "with a little emphasis added" for my benefit. not sure I could have made it through that post without it.
[/SarcasmTagsForYourBenefit]
shake
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Sara Bear
United States
Centerville
Utah
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I ppreciate reading all the answers to the OP. (my keyboard is messing up, forgive me).

Now, my spouse and I aren't like highly cutthroat, but we assertvely play Ttr Nordic Countries, use attack cards in Dominion and otherwise try to undermine the other (not necessarily our prime strategy though) and such.

It looks like the game has room for people who aren't maximizing every cutthroat option to the "T", and yet who aren't just letting things pass or often choosing the "kinder" option either. In otherwords we're competitive, just not as cutthroat-oriented as some.

Still, all this cutthroat stuff does make me wonder a little if the game is for us? Or is it more as I said in the previous paragraph, there's room for a variety of styles of play?

Maybe that's a bit OT but it's based off the OP and the answers thereto, anyway. I've gained alot from the answers even with our more casual but still competitve approach. (I'm thinking one reason the game may be so highly popular is that there IS great room for a variety of approaches, even if you never know if your opponent is going to go for the throat constantly).
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Scott Dye
United States
Murfreesboro
Tennessee
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
sarebear62 wrote:
I'm thinking one reason the game may be so highly popular is that there IS great room for a variety of approaches, even if you never know if your opponent is going to go for the throat constantly.


You got it. The game is how you play it. It works on many different levels, which is nice. I play with my 8 year olds (who have been playing for a couple of years now) in a much more casual style than with my wife, who can be quite cutthroat. I ultimately still have fun playing with my daughters even though it is not as "serious" as when I play my wife.

3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Stef McCarter

Poughkeepsie
New York
msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
I would personally suggest getting Orincess and the Dragon set. It is my favorite and I have found even experienced players when introduced to this set, seem to get a little giddy about eating meeples with the Dragon.

Also I do agree about the other two expansions needed. Even if we dont play with those expansions we always use the meeple/barn/mayor/builder pieces no matter what expansions we use.

I personally always use the Barn, Mayor, Large, Pig, Builder, Phantom meeples and just because it's easy to fit in with any set we also always use the Robbers.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jacek Wieszaczewski
Poland
Wrocław
Poland
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
From my experience the dragon doesn't work well in two player games - it's hard to have it eat any meeple, as half of dragon's movement is made by this meeple's owner. With 4 players it worked way better, I never use dragon in 2 player games.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Michael B. Hansen
Denmark
Odense N
flag msg tools
badge
"duck duck duck duck duck duck duck duck duck duck duck duck duck duck duck duck" Ralph Wiggum .....
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Sendell wrote:
You can't build anything large if your opponent always has a good chance of stealing your stuff. If he has a range of tiles to choose from his chance is much bigger. So it reduces the game to grabbing points as fast as you can.



OP expected a more cutthroat game, and my impression was that he was disappointed he didnt get it. The 3 tile hand, usually, results in a much more cutthroat game.. as you also seems to point out.

I think it is a terrific suggestion.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Architeuthis wrote:
...
OP expected a more cutthroat game, and my impression was that he was disappointed he didnt get it. The 3 tile hand, usually, results in a much more cutthroat game.. as you also seems to point out. ...


If your idea of cutthroat is just 'finishing something as fast as you can' (which was the main point i was making), then well... what can I say... experiences differ.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Chad Lutzke
United States
Battle Creek
Michigan
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Great suggestions here...I think the more you'll play the more you'll figure out ways to block and "sneak in" to farms, cities, roads, etc. Also, after playing Princess and the Dragon I very rarely play without it (same goes for King and the Scout mini expansion).
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Steven James
Australia
Adelaide
South Australia
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I've played the base game of Carc half a dozen times now. I think the game lends itself to both cutthroat and kinder play equally. I can be ruthless in other types of games, but in Carc, I often find myself with a tile that neither blocks my opponent nor assists me in any short term meaningful way. This seems to lead to quite a number of times in the game where nothing much is happening.
Despite the rules reading very clearly, we've discovered situations in the game which are not clearly covered. For example, it is still not clear to me now by what method I can place a meeple on a city that is occupied by an opposing meeple...is a tile placed at the corner of another city tile considered touching the rest of the city? The instructions make it clear that no other meeple, no matter how far away, may be placed in the same city, and yet it clearly occurs in other games.

 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
1 , 2  Next »   | 
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.