BrentS
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This came up in a recent Epic game. I'm very confident I know the answer but can't find hard evidence to support it.

My opponent played Order Mounted as a section card in a section where he didn't have any mounted units to order one infantry unit.....he did, however, have a a Medium Cav in another section. I felt that the caveat that you must have no mounted units to order a single infantry unit applied to the whole battlefield, but my opponent felt it applied only to the section where it was being played as a Field order.

This is only relevant for Epic and there's a general principle here that applies to many cards which can be played as Field orders (Troop cards, Mounted Charge, Line Command), so it is important and I'm certain that the whole battlefield is checked for relevant units before being able to order a single unit of choice in a section.....but I can't find a hard reference. If anyone else can, or has an alternative interpretation, I'd be grateful.

Brent.
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Kevin Duke
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It would never occur to me that having no units in a section would trigger that effect.
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Phill Webb
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I would have thought that when it's played as a field command it is evaluated by that Field General for his section only.

i.e. if that section has no mounted then use the alternate order.

Are you perhaps forgetting the multi-player setup of Epic and thinking in a 2 player overall commander only way?


I would put it up to the flexibility of the system.
It may also be a precedent of sorts that the leadership cards allow this alternative even if there is a leader in the section.

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StevenE Smooth Sailing...
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Just so I understand the question

We have 6 sections in Epic play

1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6

The Commanding General passes the Order Mounted card to the left Field General (sections 1 & 2).

The Left Field General has a mounted unit in section 1 and an infantry in section 2.

The field general decides to play the card in section 2 thus ordering the infantry.

Correct?
 
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BrentS
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StevenE wrote:
Just so I understand the question

We have 6 sections in Epic play

1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6

The Commanding General passes the Order Mounted card to the left Field General (sections 1 & 2).

The Left Field General has a mounted unit in section 1 and an infantry in section 2.

The field general decides to play the card in section 2 thus ordering the infantry.

Correct?


I'm not sure I understand your field designations, Steve.

The situation is one of the overall commander issuing a Troop card to one of his field generals as a field order. All of the Troop cards (and several of the Tactics cards) have the option to order a single unit of choice if the player does not have any of the relevant units. In all cases in the Epic deck, this is worded as "If you do not have any xxxx units...". It is not clear whether the "you" in this case applies to the army and overall commander, or the field general. The question here is, does that caveat apply to the section where the field order is played, or the entire army? By extension from this, when the overall commander plays a Troop card as an army card and assigns one of the resulting orders to a field general who has no such troops in his section, if "you " is interpreted as applying to the field general is that field general free to use that order to order any one unit he pleases? In both cases, my personal view is that the caveat should be checked against the whole army......it's simpler and has logical precedent in the single board game, where these Troop and Tactics cards are all functionally army cards, so the question never arises.

In the example from which my question came, the overall commander issued an Order Mounted to his right field general. The right section of that army had no mounted units but there was one in the left section. Could the right field general order an infantry unit in the right section, or did the presence of a mounted unit in the army's left section prohibit him from ordering any units (although in the case of Order Mounted, at least, he could order/detach a leader)?



Brent.
 
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my eye
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StevenE wrote:
Just so I understand the question

We have 6 sections in Epic play

1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6

The Commanding General passes the Order Mounted card to the left Field General (sections 1 & 2).

The Left Field General has a mounted unit in section 1 and an infantry in section 2.

The field general decides to play the card in section 2 thus ordering the infantry.

Correct?
Steven,
There are only three sections in Ancients Epic. You may be thinking of Memoir Overlord (which has two sections per flank and center.)

As to the original question, I always had the same interpretation as the OP and not his opponent. However, I have also had an opponent try to play it as if the caveat only applied to a section when the card was being used as Field card.

The card states If you do not have any mounted units, you may order one unit of your choice, NOT If you don't have any mounted units in a section...

So we took the card at its face value.

My opponent groused that it was his only option for that section. My response was that's what Field General Initiative rule is for.
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Read the rulebook, plan for all contingencies, and…read the rulebook again.
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goshublue wrote:
This is only relevant for Epic and there's a general principle here that applies to many cards which can be played as Field orders (Troop cards, Mounted Charge, Line Command), so it is important and I'm certain that the whole battlefield is checked for relevant units before being able to order a single unit of choice in a section.....but I can't find a hard reference. If anyone else can, or has an alternative interpretation, I'd be grateful.

Brent.


Doing a quick scan of the Epic II rules, I think you are right, Brent.

All cards, including Field Command cards, are "played" by the overall commander:

p.3: "Field Command Cards: The Overall Commander may play up to three Field Command cards on a turn, provided each of the three cards only orders units in a single section."

So I'd say that means that the conditions on the card apply when the Overall Commander plays the card. If there are any mounted units on the board, the Order Mounted card could only be issued to those subordinates with Mounted units in their section.

The rules covering the Order Mounted card in Epic play seem to reinforce this idea:

p.6: "Order Mounted: When declared as a Field Command card, the card is given to one Field General and counts as one Field Command card played. The Field General may issue orders to 3 mounted units and/or leaders in his section of the battlefield."

So I'd say the exception on the card wouldn't apply. A clarification would also be nice, but I do think the supporting rules are in place.

...But like the recent discussion on the play of the Leadership in Any Section cards in Epic games, I can understand how a differing interpretation can come about. If players at a game I were hosting were to suggest and agree with one another beforehand that you could give Order Mounted to a Field General with no mounted units so that he may order one unit of his choice instead, I'd be okay with that.


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