Recommend
3 
 Thumb up
 Hide
15 Posts

Cosmic Encounter» Forums » Variants

Subject: Ninja - power of Versatility rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
Homer Simpson
Israel
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
(you can read the first version bellow this one)

Ninja
Uses Anything as Weapon

You have the power of Versatility. As a main player, after encounter cards are selected but before they are revealed, you may use this power to discard up to three cards from your hand. If both players reveal attack cards, you may adjust your total: For each card you discarded, if it's an Attack card add half its value to your total (rounded down), if it's a Negotiate subtract 5 from your total, if it's any other card add 5 to your total.

Wild: After encounter card are selected but before they are revealed, you may discard an Artifact or a Flare from your hand to add 5 to your total. You may discard this Flare instead to add 20 to your total.

Super: When you use your power you are not restricted to three cards.

------------------------

(here's my first version)

I had an idea for a power that helps you get rid of cards and rewards you (or harms you) for that in some way, and I want to know if you think it would be a fun power to play. I don't have a name for the power or its history yet. Suggestions are welcome as well.

Power: TBD

You have the power to _____. As a main player, after encounter cards are selected but before they are revealed, you may use this power to discard up to three cards from your hand. For each card you discarded, if it's an Attack card add half its value to your total (rounded down), if it's a Negotiate subtract 5 from your total, if it's an Artifact, a Flare or a Morph add 5 to your total.

History: ...

Wild: After encounter card are selected but before they are revealed, you may discard an Artifact or a Flare from your hand (even this one) to add 5 to your total.

Super: When you use your power you are not restricted to three cards.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
David Montgomery
United States
Modesto
California
flag msg tools
badge
The Shipyard - Star Trek Attack Wing spoilers and reviews
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Re: A new idea for a power
It intrigues me. You have to balance power use to not leave yourself with only negotiates, so that's a good aspect. What I see it becoming is the non power, where you play an attack card and a Negotiate to try to get it back to 0.

Still, I'd give it a play. Would odd cards round up or down?
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Homer Simpson
Israel
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Re: A new idea for a power
mathguy6189 wrote:
Would odd cards round up or down?
Down, I forgot to change it (this idea had some versions, one of those added its value instead of its half value, so I forgot to change it back).

Thanks for your input. I don't think that it will become a non-power. You can always choose not to discard any cards that might hurt your chances of winning the encounter and it's basically a matter of good balancing.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Xagyg
Australia
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Re: A new idea for a power
homertve wrote:
if it's a Negotiate subtract 5 from your total

I'd probably let them add 2.

homertve wrote:

Wild: After encounter card are selected but before they are revealed, you may discard an Artifact or a Flare from your hand (even this one) to add 5 to your total.

If it is "this one" and thus you have to discard it, I'd give it a big number to add, like 50.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Just a Bill
United States
Norfolk
Virginia
flag msg tools
designer
badge
No, I said "oh, brother," not "go hover."
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Re: A new idea for a power
A few thoughts:

• For some reason I like the idea that the Negotiate subtracts, and half the attack value seems about right, at least in the lower band. In the upper band, though, this may outshine Fodder and Deuce; not sure.

• It seems like it would be very hard to throw away a Flare for a mere +5 before I even know if I need it.

• Instead of itemizing Artifact-Flare-Morph, you could say "any other card." This would be simpler and also include Kickers, Rifts, and whatever new low-frequency cards come along in the future.

• You could do the same thing on the wild flare: "a morph or any non-encounter card" or perhaps "any card except an attack or negotiate."

• This is a bit awkward if you reveal a Negotiate as your encounter card. I guess FFG already decided we can modify our "total" when we don't reveal an attack card, but that always seems clunky to me and I squirm a little when something else expands the footprint of counterintuitivity. I'd suggest trying to work in "if you reveal an attack card" (Industrialist, Tripler, Virus, Warpish, Warrior) or, perhaps better, "if both players reveal attack cards" (Calculator, Crystal, Fodder, Mirror, Sapient, Xenophile).

• Theme brainstorming:
Tinker — Improvises Weapons — power to Improvise
Mechaniker — Adapts Anything for Battle — power to Jury-Rig
Ninja — Uses Anything as Weapon — power of Versatility
Illusionist* — Distracts with Other Cards — power of Diversion
______* — Undermines Opponent's Attack — power to Dilute

* With those last two, you'd probably subtract the discarded cards from the opponent's total instead of adding them to your own. If FFG had left Terrorist as Terrorist, then Saboteur could have worked quite well for this, but I couldn't find a good synonym for saboteur.

xagyg wrote:
If it is "this one" and thus you have to discard it, I'd give it a big number to add, like 50.

I like that, too. But maybe 15 or 20; 50 might as well say "you win the encounter."

Or maybe add a big number, but then you have to give the flare to your opponent (cf. Wild Changeling, Wild Reincarnator).
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Ken H.
United States
Amherst
Ohio
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Re: A new idea for a power

I agree with subtracting on a Negotiate. The idea is to keep the standard gameplay concept that the N is hard to get rid of. Allowing you to increase your total by getting rid of a card that you don't want to play anyway would be a power unto itself.

1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Homer Simpson
Israel
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Re: A new idea for a power
Bill Martinson wrote:
• For some reason I like the idea that the Negotiate subtracts, and half the attack value seems about right, at least in the lower band. In the upper band, though, this may outshine Fodder and Deuce; not sure.
I thought about it too, but I think that if you do have a 30 or 40 in your hand, you will probably want to save it to a later encounter rather than "waste" it on an encounter you may win with discarding two Attack 06's and an Attack 08.

Bill Martinson wrote:
• It seems like it would be very hard to throw away a Flare for a mere +5 before I even know if I need it.
That's true, but if you just played your last encounter card you will most likely lose that Flare very soon anyway.

Bill Martinson wrote:
• Instead of itemizing Artifact-Flare-Morph, you could say "any other card." This would be simpler and also include Kickers, Rifts, and whatever new low-frequency cards come along in the future.
Well, I thought about it, but I didn't want him to be able to discard a Kicker X0 to get a benefit of +5. But maybe your suggestion is better, for simplicity sake.

Bill Martinson wrote:
• This is a bit awkward if you reveal a Negotiate as your encounter card. I guess FFG already decided we can modify our "total" when we don't reveal an attack card, but that always seems clunky to me and I squirm a little when something else expands the footprint of counterintuitivity. I'd suggest trying to work in "if you reveal an attack card" (Industrialist, Tripler, Virus, Warpish, Warrior) or, perhaps better, "if both players reveal attack cards" (Calculator, Crystal, Fodder, Mirror, Sapient, Xenophile).
I Agree. I'll change that.

Bill Martinson wrote:
• Theme brainstorming:
Tinker — Improvises Weapons — power to Improvise
Mechaniker — Adapts Anything for Battle — power to Jury-Rig
Ninja — Uses Anything as Weapon — power of Versatility
I think that Ninja is my favorite suggestion yet. But The Amazing Power Thingy says that we already have two different kinds of Ninjas, and I think I'll go with your second best idea (IMO) - Mechaniker. At least till I'll hear a better idea...

Bill Martinson wrote:
xagyg wrote:
If it is "this one" and thus you have to discard it, I'd give it a big number to add, like 50.

I like that, too. But maybe 15 or 20; 50 might as well say "you win the encounter."
Do you mean that the 15/20 should only be added in the case it's "this one"? If so, I think I agree with you.

Bill Martinson wrote:
Or maybe add a big number, but then you have to give the flare to your opponent (cf. Wild Changeling, Wild Reincarnator).
That's a good idea, too.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Chris O
msg tools
Pixeling ain't easy, but someone's gotta do it...
badge
LION OF JUDAH
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Re: A new idea for a power
Dunno how I feel about this one, seems extremely "Fodder"ish to me.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Homer Simpson
Israel
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Re: A new idea for a power
I think there's a big difference between those two - Fodder can add (specific) Attacks after cards are revealed whereas this one has to do it before cards are revealed.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Mi Myma
United States
Fountain Valley
California
flag msg tools
Why is there no Word Games Forum or Subdomain?
badge
There should be a Word Games Subdomain, or at least a Word Games Forum!
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Re: A new idea for a power
It's also worth comparing this power to Reserve.

Reserve works as a main player or ally, as opposed to just as a main player.

Reserve plays his extra cards after the reveal, rather than before.

Reserve only uses attack cards 06 or less, rather than any card.

Reserve adds the full value of the card, rather than half.

Reserve can play the cards on either side of the encounter.

Reserve can cancel other players' reinforcements by discarding N's.

Over all, this power seems too strong to me. Play your N's and get compensation, or play an attack, and pile on three more attacks. And occasionally get an extra +5 for a flare that isn't useful to you. And you can dump N's whenever you know you're going to lose anyway, or against Anti-Matter and Loser.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Just a Bill
United States
Norfolk
Virginia
flag msg tools
designer
badge
No, I said "oh, brother," not "go hover."
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Re: A new idea for a power
homertve wrote:
I didn't want him to be able to discard a Kicker X0 to get a benefit of +5.

The x0 is, generally, so useless (other than as a bluff) that I love it when something new creates another way to use it.

homertve wrote:
Ninja is my favorite suggestion yet. But The Amazing Power Thingy says that we already have two different kinds of Ninjas

Ninja seemed like the best fit to me as well, at least compared to my other feeble suggestions. I don't think you need to feel constrained by the fact that there's already a Ninja or two; just because somebody else used the name before doesn't mean they own it. I actually think a little competition on the names/themes is a good thing, so that the more evocative names can get used for the best designs.

Phil Fleischmann wrote:
Over all, this power seems too strong to me.

That conclusion surprises me, considering that you itemized one way in which it's better than Reserve and five ways in which it's weaker than Reserve.

I think the fact that you have to commit before cards are revealed keeps it from being overpowered.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Homer Simpson
Israel
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Re: A new idea for a power
Bill Martinson wrote:
Ninja seemed like the best fit to me as well, at least compared to my other feeble suggestions. I don't think you need to feel constrained by the fact that there's already a Ninja or two; just because somebody else used the name before doesn't mean they own it. I actually think a little competition on the names/themes is a good thing, so that the more evocative names can get used for the best designs.
So I think I'll go with Ninja after all. Thanks!
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Pete Henninger
United States
Katy
Texas
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Looks good.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Mi Myma
United States
Fountain Valley
California
flag msg tools
Why is there no Word Games Forum or Subdomain?
badge
There should be a Word Games Subdomain, or at least a Word Games Forum!
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I don't care for "Ninja" as a name for this power. When I think of ninjas, I don't think of "versatility". I think of stealth, sneakiness. And in general, I find "ninja" to be an overused concept. If it's going to be used in CE, it should match more closely, IMO. There are/were a number of homebrew powers called "Kamikaze" that matched better than FFG's Kamikaze.

I prefer the Tinker or Tinkerer concept. Not that these are necessarily the best names, but something that implies jury-rigging or adaptation. "MacGyver" No. "Kludge" Not quite. I kind of like "Tinkerer" - one of my favorite old Spiderman villains, but there's probably a better name. Engineer? Hotwirer? Adapter? Craftsman? Handyman? Tool? Kludgemaker? Kludgemeister?
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Mi Myma
United States
Fountain Valley
California
flag msg tools
Why is there no Word Games Forum or Subdomain?
badge
There should be a Word Games Subdomain, or at least a Word Games Forum!
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Bill Martinson wrote:
Phil Fleischmann wrote:
Over all, this power seems too strong to me.

That conclusion surprises me, considering that you itemized one way in which it's better than Reserve and five ways in which it's weaker than Reserve.

I think the fact that you have to commit before cards are revealed keeps it from being overpowered.

Well, the number of ways isn't as important as what those ways actually are. This power can use its cards four at a time, so it gets a new hand every other time it's a main player. It never has to play a card lower than its second-highest attack. An average hand consists of 4 attacks, 1 artifact, 1 flare, 0-1 reinforcement, 1-2 negotiates. So the first time you're a main player, you play your highest attack (likely 13 or higher), toss a Negotiate and an artifact or flare to cancel it, and add on half of another attack card. The second time, play your highest attack remaining (likely 9 or higher), dump the other N if you have one, and cancel it out with the other artifact/flare, add on half of your last attack card. And use the reinforcement when needed. Now you're out of cards and ready to draw a new hand.

You likely will never have to play an attack lower than 10 for the whole game. And if you get a lousy hand, you can negotiate for compensation.

Reserve has 13 extra reinforcements in the deck, ranging from +1 to +6 (and a 00 which he can dump for no effect), but he still has to play Attack 07's and up. An average hand will have maybe 2 cards that Reserve can use as reinforcements (including the actual reinforcements).

This power has effectively about 42 extra reinforcements in the deck (ranging from +2 to +5), some of which can be used for artifact/flare effects instead if needed, and he pretty much never has to play an attack lower than 10 or so. An average hand will include 6-7 cards that this power can use to increase his attack total - everything except N's. and even the N's are useful if the Anti-Matter or Loser is in the game.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.