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Subject: Moving in Water with a Current rss

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Dave Phillips
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Ok so this has been puzzling me... if you can move 'upstream' against a current and scurry so that you don't keep ending up on the same space how can a mouse end up being pushed off the board and being captured? Surely you just scurry all the time to avoid it til u can get out?

I kinda like the idea that you can't move against the current as makes it more challenging. Thoughts anyone?

Cheers
 
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Cameron Chien
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If there are more minions than mice in the same space as the active mouse, he or she can't move out of the space.

Cameron
 
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Ray Greenley
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Also, you could be blocked from moving upstream if the space you want to move to is full. I don't think it's really meant to be a significant danger, but it does restrict your options. You might back yourself into a position where you have to choose between fighting a minion and moving up-stream. Also, depending on how you deal with it, it could slow you down, meaning you could end up with more cheese on the wheel than otherwise.
 
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Mark Collins
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Also, has anyone been in a situation where you need to move a mouse downstream at the end of their turn but the target space is full? I played it that it just didn't move, not sure what everyone else thinks.
 
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Cameron Chien
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That is correct, Mark.

Cameron
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Greg
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RMGreen wrote:
Also, you could be blocked from moving upstream if the space you want to move to is full. I don't think it's really meant to be a significant danger, but it does restrict your options. You might back yourself into a position where you have to choose between fighting a minion and moving up-stream. Also, depending on how you deal with it, it could slow you down, meaning you could end up with more cheese on the wheel than otherwise.


Good answer Ray.

It's not crazy difficult to keep from getting pushed off the board, but there are situations that can make it more difficult, with situations you mentioned. The other thing you mentioned that was key is that while a mouse can keep scurrying to keep from being swept away, the cheese wheel can keep getting filled up and surges can happen, which will cause more issues.
 
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Jerry Hawthorne
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daveyleedsUK wrote:

Ok so this has been puzzling me... if you can move 'upstream' against a current and scurry so that you don't keep ending up on the same space how can a mouse end up being pushed off the board and being captured? Surely you just scurry all the time to avoid it til u can get out?

I kinda like the idea that you can't move against the current as makes it more challenging. Thoughts anyone?

Cheers
you cannot move against the stream. You can only move in the direction of the current.

(Crud, I just looked back at the rulebook, and it is not mentioned that a mouse cannot move against the current, this is an oversight. Mice cannot move against the direction of he current.)
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Ian Kelly
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Oh, wow. So in Chapter 1, after the mice drop through the grate into the Sewer, they basically have three turns to swim to the other side and get out of the water (assuming nothing blocks the current from pushing them)?
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Jerry Hawthorne
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Peristarkawan wrote:
Oh, wow. So in Chapter 1, after the mice drop through the grate into the Sewer, they basically have three turns to swim to the other side and get out of the water (assuming nothing blocks the current from pushing them)?
Yes.
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Bear Klaw
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Yow, so you have to choose between fending off the attacking minions or searching for the thread and needle. I think I like it better that way; I promised the kids we would do scenario 1 again this weekend so I'll try playing with the corrected rule.
 
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Dave Phillips
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nobeerblues wrote:
daveyleedsUK wrote:

Ok so this has been puzzling me... if you can move 'upstream' against a current and scurry so that you don't keep ending up on the same space how can a mouse end up being pushed off the board and being captured? Surely you just scurry all the time to avoid it til u can get out?

I kinda like the idea that you can't move against the current as makes it more challenging. Thoughts anyone?

Cheers
you cannot move against the stream. You can only move in the direction of the current.

(Crud, I just looked back at the rulebook, and it is not mentioned that a mouse cannot move against the current, this is an oversight. Mice cannot move against the direction of he current.)


Kewl. I thought so otherwise seems too easy. I like this idea and that is how I've bin playing it as makes it more exciting.
 
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Todd France
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nobeerblues wrote:
Peristarkawan wrote:
Oh, wow. So in Chapter 1, after the mice drop through the grate into the Sewer, they basically have three turns to swim to the other side and get out of the water (assuming nothing blocks the current from pushing them)?
Yes.

So, in the King's Tunnels, going from the ladder to the large platform, or the large platform to the small platform, you literally have one opportunity to Scurry up the other side of the stream, before being swept away?
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Chris
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Cheers[/q]you cannot move against the stream. You can only move in the direction of the current.

(Crud, I just looked back at the rulebook, and it is not mentioned that a mouse cannot move against the current, this is an oversight. Mice cannot move against the direction of he current.)[/q]


Where did you read this?
 
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Ian Kelly
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adjacentbeastman wrote:
Where did you read this?


In his mind? As the designer of the game, Jerry doesn't need an external source to be authoritative.
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Chris
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oh it's the designer =)
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Jerry Hawthorne
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pseudotheist wrote:
nobeerblues wrote:
Peristarkawan wrote:
Oh, wow. So in Chapter 1, after the mice drop through the grate into the Sewer, they basically have three turns to swim to the other side and get out of the water (assuming nothing blocks the current from pushing them)?
Yes.

So, in the King's Tunnels, going from the ladder to the large platform, or the large platform to the small platform, you literally have one opportunity to Scurry up the other side of the stream, before being swept away?
I'm not sure I'm following you. The King's Tunnels seems to be a fairly easy water based obstacle.
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Greg
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Yeah, that's not that difficult.
 
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Todd France
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nobeerblues wrote:
I'm not sure I'm following you. The King's Tunnels seems to be a fairly easy water based obstacle.

Really? I must be misinterpreting something. As I interpret the map, from the ladder platform it's impossible to reach the small platform by the stream on the left. If you jump into he right stream as far upstream as possible, at the end of your turn you're swept down to the space just before the black exit space. From that space it looks to me like the walls block your movement to the big platform, and you have to climb back to the ladder platform to start over. If the intent was to be able to reach both sides of the stream from that space, then it would've been fairly trivial to make the map MUCH clearer with only slight alterations. Removing the pebble on the corner, or nudging the line in the river up by 1/4" on that side would make that intention clear; instead I'm left to interpret that it's all supposed to be wall.

Crossing from the large platform to the small platform is a nearly identical circumstance.

This layout made perfect sense to me when you could swim upstream, but seems like a seriously difficult traverse now. In chapter 4 we had 3 non-ranged mice against an Elite Rat warrior on the small platform; I'm pretty sure he would've killed us all under these rules. Or maybe I just need to roll better and it won't be a problem.
 
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Ian Kelly
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pseudotheist wrote:
As I interpret the map, from the ladder platform it's impossible to reach the small platform by the stream on the left.


As I read it, you could jump in with your movement and then immediately use your action to scurry up onto the left platform, but if you missed then you would be swept downstream. From there you would have two full turns to climb back up onto the ladder platform.

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If you jump into he right stream as far upstream as possible, at the end of your turn you're swept down to the space just before the black exit space. From that space it looks to me like the walls block your movement to the big platform, and you have to climb back to the ladder platform to start over. If the intent was to be able to reach both sides of the stream from that space, then it would've been fairly trivial to make the map MUCH clearer with only slight alterations. Removing the pebble on the corner, or nudging the line in the river up by 1/4" on that side would make that intention clear; instead I'm left to interpret that it's all supposed to be wall.


I disagree with that interpretation. The pebble separating the water space from the far side of the stream is much smaller than the base of a mouse figure, so per the adjacency rules these two spaces seem clearly adjacent to me. I would say that jumping into the upstream space, you have one scurry action plus one full turn to attempt to climb out onto the far side. If you miss all of those, then I think that the dark space is still within reach of the ladder side, so you would still have one more full turn to try to climb out on that side.
 
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Kris Genschmer

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I was under the impression that anytime you move into water, either from non-water space to water, or water to water, your turn ended. So how can you make a scurry action?
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Greg
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Krisgensch wrote:
I was under the impression that anytime you move into water, either from non-water space to water, or water to water, your turn ended. So how can you make a scurry action?


Your movement (not your turn) ends when moving into a water space. So you have to stop your movement upon entering a water space, but then you can use a Scurry action to move again. But the water rules still apply, so if you use Scurry to move from one water space to another, you still end your move on the second water space. But if you are adjacent to a land space, you can use Scurry to attempt to climb out.
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Julian Wasson
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I was playing this wrong the opposite way originally. I had interpreted "your movement ends" to mean "you cannot move for the rest of the turn" not "lose your remaining movement points for this move action." It seemed... pretty harsh.

Knowing that you can scurry, just not upstream, it seems like a good balance.
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Justin Davis
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nobeerblues wrote:
(Crud, I just looked back at the rulebook, and it is not mentioned that a mouse cannot move against the current, this is an oversight. Mice cannot move against the direction of he current.)


This is good to know, but I wish this was included in the FAQ on the Plaid Hat site. Seems like a VERY important rule omission that players need to know about.
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Jerry Hawthorne
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Ruskicowboy wrote:
nobeerblues wrote:
(Crud, I just looked back at the rulebook, and it is not mentioned that a mouse cannot move against the current, this is an oversight. Mice cannot move against the direction of he current.)


This is good to know, but I wish this was included in the FAQ on the Plaid Hat site. Seems like a VERY important rule omission that players need to know about.
this is important. It will be in the next FAQ.
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Hadn't realized that we couldn't move against the current, definitely good to know though!

Is it confirmed then that scurry can be used both to move a second space in water, and be able to test twice to climb out of water? (Our group had also never considered this)
 
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