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Subject: Need Help with Two WIP/Ideas rss

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Pablo Schulman
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Hi I need help/sugestions with both designs I’m currently working on. The problem is I don’t know how to procede after the Idea phase. You see: in both of them I started with an isolated mechanic AND a theme, but after that I don’t know how to move on.

First Idea:

Theme: Alchemy
Mechanic: Dice Rolling

Idea: Dice drafting game with yatzeeesque experiment cards.

Players would draft cards dice from a common pool and use those dice to gain VP by achieving objectives on yatzeesque cards (5 straight, 4 of a kind and such).
I was trying to come up with ways to improve this aspect like a die face having more than the benefit of being an ingredient (like a face which wouldn't be an ingredient but gives you VP or so)

Second Idea:

Inspired by the mancala of Trajan (didn’t play it, just read rules) but thinking it was a waste to use a Roman theme, instead of na African one.
Unlike Trajan, each pit of the mancala is not related to a minigame. The important would be the color in the last pit sowed. If you have a certain combination in a pit you would be able to use the powers of a Orixa (think a sacrifice to a god to use its power). But I don’t know what they could be (the powers), and I don’t know how the game could be played! Area map, abstracted kingdom, hex map.

A summary of possible Orixa:

Xango: the third king of the Oyo Empire, after his death became known as an Orixa related with thunder and leadership. Might be something related with player order? Breaking ties?

Ogum: Warrior Orixa, related with the crafting of Iron, a technology highly appraised. Techs, Spawnning of warriors, war? (except that I'm not a huge of battles or AT games...)

Orixa Oko: orixá of agriculture. I thought it would be related with maintenance of the mancala, like sowing new seeds on it.

Oxum: female orixa, associated with fertility, protection of babies and wealth (she likes luxury). Maybe trading? Making money?

Exu: Messenger orixa, sometimes trickster, sometimes just evil. Accept almost everything you offer. Might be good to use him as replacement (like a lower level of each other God) or to play pranks or curses on other players...

So, I need a structure to go with those ideas, please help me! Any help would be HIGHLY appreciated.
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Sturv Tafvherd
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You lost me with the 2nd idea (Mancala-based). I know Mancala, but the theme you're trying to put on top of it is way beyond me.

However, I might be able to help push with the first idea...

PSchulman wrote:

First Idea:

Theme: Alchemy
Mechanic: Dice Rolling

Idea: Dice drafting game with yatzeeesque experiment cards.

(A) Players would draft cards from a common pool and use those dice to gain VP by achieving objectives on yatzeesque cards (5 straight, 4 of a kind and such).
(B) I was trying to come up with ways to improve this aspect like a die face having more than the benefit of being an ingredient (like a face which wouldn't be an ingredient but gives you VP or so)


I'd suggest you pin down the (A) part, and then go for (B).

So you'll need to come up with dice roll combinations, put them on the cards, and then assign VPs to them. You might want to just abstract this out at first, and then look for a way to hone in with the alchemy theme. For example, you might decide that red-red-red-any-any is worth 5 VP; later on, you can refine that to be iron-iron-iron-any-any is worth 5 VP.

The card drafting part is somewhat important, since it lets the players select their level of riskiness. I like it. You'll have to work on whether or not the drafting process is hidden or semi-hidden (ie, are the cards passed around as one set? Or are there several sets of cards being passed around like in a MtG booster draft?) You'll also have to figure out whether or not you reveal a card that you've completed, or if you somehow keep track of the dice rolls you made, and then assign the cards at the end.

You'll also want to figure out if you are only using one set of faces for the dice; or if you want to have two or three different dice (3 of the 5 dice, for example, might have Metals, and the other 2 of the 5 dice might have Non-Metals).

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Cory J
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I agree with Stormtower, I have no idea what you're doing with your second suggestion.

But I actually like the theme you have going for the first one. I would suggest trying to figure out how close you want these combos to come to Yahtzee, and whether you're able to shoot for more than one combo at once. Would you have a hand with five or six combos in it, or can you only go for one at a time?

I think it could also be more thematic if you were to have a dice-drafting mechanic as well, where some dice have more or certain elements than others to help you along with your combos, etc.
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Sturv Tafvherd
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Just to put more traction to the first idea ...

3 Dice : Metal Set
-- faces: Iron, Copper, Nickel, Lithium, Sodium, Calcium

3 Dice : NonMetal Set
-- faces: Hydrogen, Oxygen, Carbon, Chlorine, Nitrogen, Helium


Cards

-- Water aka Hydrogen dioxide (H(2) O(1) -- 2 vp
-- Salt aka Sodium Chloride (NaCl) -- 1 vp
-- Sodium Hydroxide (NaOH) -- 2 vp
-- Iron Oxide (FeO) -- 1 vp
-- Hematite (Fe(2) O(3)) -- 8 vp

And then you can also have cards that depend on other cards being completed...

-- Rust -- requires Water to be completed before hand, and now roll Fe(2) O(3)

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Pablo Schulman
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Thx for the suggestions.

It seems I screwed up when writing, It was supposed to be a DICE drafting, not a card drafting, geez.

Amyrin wrote:
I agree with Stormtower, I have no idea what you're doing with your second suggestion.

But I actually like the theme you have going for the first one. I would suggest trying to figure out how close you want these combos to come to Yahtzee, and whether you're able to shoot for more than one combo at once. Would you have a hand with five or six combos in it, or can you only go for one at a time?

I think it could also be more thematic if you were to have a dice-drafting mechanic as well, where some dice have more or certain elements than others to help you along with your combos, etc.


The idea would be to have six faces:

Lead/Tin
Copper
Iron
Mercury
Silver
Gold (gold doesn't give anything, only some VP)

I was trying to come up with some other use for each face besides being used as ingredients for experiments.

Also, I don't know how I could distribute experiments. Let the, available to everyone, bling drawing, draft?

Could be good if I had dice-changing cards?

The cards would be kind of Iron-Iron-Iron-Copper-Copper maybe +2 energy or so...

About shooting for more than one combo... If by dice drafting, players would draft the number of dice required in any experiment + 1 at most, so only one. I kind of want to have some risk on trying to complete, not just to be a given, know what I mean?
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Cory J
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PSchulman wrote:
Thx for the suggestions.

It seems I screwed up when writing, It was supposed to be a DICE drafting, not a card drafting, geez.

Amyrin wrote:
I agree with Stormtower, I have no idea what you're doing with your second suggestion.

But I actually like the theme you have going for the first one. I would suggest trying to figure out how close you want these combos to come to Yahtzee, and whether you're able to shoot for more than one combo at once. Would you have a hand with five or six combos in it, or can you only go for one at a time?

I think it could also be more thematic if you were to have a dice-drafting mechanic as well, where some dice have more or certain elements than others to help you along with your combos, etc.


The idea would be to have six faces:

Lead/Tin
Copper
Iron
Mercury
Silver
Gold (gold doesn't give anything, only some VP)

I was trying to come up with some other use for each face besides being used as ingredients for experiments.

Also, I don't know how I could distribute experiments. Let the, available to everyone, bling drawing, draft?

Could be good if I had dice-changing cards?

The cards would be kind of Iron-Iron-Iron-Copper-Copper maybe +2 energy or so...

About shooting for more than one combo... If by dice drafting, players would draft the number of dice required in any experiment + 1 at most, so only one. I kind of want to have some risk on trying to complete, not just to be a given, know what I mean?


Ah, well then. You could try some sort of mechanic ala Elder Sign. Have a number of cards in the play area with the alchemical recipes on them, and on your turn you try and complete one of those recipes. Perhaps for completing them you get to draw extra dice... I'm sure there are an endless number of ways you could go about having the recipes put into play, either communal or drawn into a hand.
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Pablo Schulman
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Stormtower wrote:
You lost me with the 2nd idea (Mancala-based). I know Mancala, but the theme you're trying to put on top of it is way beyond me.

However, I might be able to help push with the first idea...

PSchulman wrote:

First Idea:

Theme: Alchemy
Mechanic: Dice Rolling

Idea: Dice drafting game with yatzeeesque experiment cards.

(A) Players would draft cards from a common pool and use those dice to gain VP by achieving objectives on yatzeesque cards (5 straight, 4 of a kind and such).
(B) I was trying to come up with ways to improve this aspect like a die face having more than the benefit of being an ingredient (like a face which wouldn't be an ingredient but gives you VP or so)


I'd suggest you pin down the (A) part, and then go for (B).

So you'll need to come up with dice roll combinations, put them on the cards, and then assign VPs to them. You might want to just abstract this out at first, and then look for a way to hone in with the alchemy theme. For example, you might decide that red-red-red-any-any is worth 5 VP; later on, you can refine that to be iron-iron-iron-any-any is worth 5 VP.

The card drafting part is somewhat important, since it lets the players select their level of riskiness. I like it. You'll have to work on whether or not the drafting process is hidden or semi-hidden (ie, are the cards passed around as one set? Or are there several sets of cards being passed around like in a MtG booster draft?) You'll also have to figure out whether or not you reveal a card that you've completed, or if you somehow keep track of the dice rolls you made, and then assign the cards at the end.

You'll also want to figure out if you are only using one set of faces for the dice; or if you want to have two or three different dice (3 of the 5 dice, for example, might have Metals, and the other 2 of the 5 dice might have Non-Metals).



Just expanding on this.

One of my ideas was a double draft. First objective cards,starting from last to first player, only one set (draw from a deck). Then dice draft, from first to last player. I think this would balance positions. (So a round would be: roll dice, draft experiments, draft dice/gain benefits, complete experiments.

I like your idea about multiple color dice, this would add more variables into the game.

Also, dice with diferent faces? Hmm...
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Michael Dew
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Stormtower wrote:
Just to put more traction to the first idea ...

3 Dice : Metal Set
-- faces: Iron, Copper, Nickel, Lithium, Sodium, Calcium

3 Dice : NonMetal Set
-- faces: Hydrogen, Oxygen, Carbon, Chlorine, Nitrogen, Helium


Cards

-- Water aka Hydrogen dioxide (H(2) O(1) -- 2 vp
-- Salt aka Sodium Chloride (NaCl) -- 1 vp
-- Sodium Hydroxide (NaOH) -- 2 vp
-- Iron Oxide (FeO) -- 1 vp
-- Hematite (Fe(2) O(3)) -- 8 vp

And then you can also have cards that depend on other cards being completed...

-- Rust -- requires Water to be completed before hand, and now roll Fe(2) O(3)

Isn't that chemistry, not alchemy?

To stay true to the alchemy theme, I think you'd need to have some mechanism where certain elements are transformed into gold. Perhaps the cards are the recipes with which the elements are turned into gold?

Also, the VPs need to reflect the difficulty in achieving the particular result. If each die is going to have a unique element on each face, then achieving an "iron-iron-iron" result is no more difficult than achieving an "iron-duck-chocolate shake" result (unless, of course, ducks and chocolate shakes do not actually appear on any of the dice). My point being, 3-of-a-kind is no less probable an outcome than any other set of 3 results, we just assign more value to it because they're all the same value. The VP rewards should reflect the probability of the outcome.
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