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The Lord of the Rings: The Card Game» Forums » General

Subject: Why the core set doesn't have 3 copies of each card? rss

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Joan Altamirano
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Hello anyone knows why the core set doesn't have 3 copies of each card?

I mean I want to build a deck with 3 Henamarth Riversong for example but the box only has 1 copy? Do I have to buy 3 Core sets to get 3 copies???

Some other allies have 2 copies only, the same for events....

An the unexpected courage attachment also has one only copy
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Paul M.
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This is the case for all of FFG's Living Card Games. Some people, including myself will purchase two core sets to get more of the single cards, but once you start purchasing the adventure packs, those cards you feel are missing don't matter nearly as much. Other cards come along with a similar function.
A second core for LoTR is nice for the extra threat trackers, tokens and encounter card sets.
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David K.
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This has been discussed time and time again right here in these very forums. There are varying opinions. It's some entertaining reading if you search for the threads.

You can either buy 3 core sets, or proxy the cards.
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Ray Greenley
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If you want three copies of every card, then yes, you do have to buy 3 core sets.

Why? I'd venture that it was necessary to keep the production costs of the game reasonable while still offering enough card variety to make workable starting decks. I DON'T think that it was a plot by FFG to sell more core sets, although I'm sure they're not too disappointed if people feel the need to do so. I only have one core set and I don't plan on buying any more. I'll just deal with only having one or two copies of certain cards. The game is still a lot of fun. ;^)
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Wally Jones
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The answer for 99 of 100 questions is...............

MONEY
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Scott M.
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As stated above, IF you only have the base game you will need 3 of the core to have three of every card...

that being said...

I started with the base game (1 copy) and quickly realized that the expansions have cards that duplicate or are better than what the equivalent base game does.

I am gladd i did not spend more than the 1 base game set and have had a blast building much more efficient decks using expansion cards.

you can track my progress in my profile. Im currently on the first mission of Khazad-Dun
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Bookwormral Bookwormral
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The answer may be money but also I would have said balance. If you can 'guarantee' riversong, steward of gondor etc by having 3 copies of each they become too powerful. Riversong's fantastic ability costs only 1 partly because there is the 1 in 50 gamble of putting him in you deck. If you had three he would cost 2 or 3 to maintain balance.
meeple
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Richard Morris
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Bookwormral wrote:
The answer may be money but also I would have said balance. If you can 'guarantee' riversong, steward of gondor etc by having 3 copies of each they become too powerful. Riversong's fantastic ability costs only 1 partly because there is the 1 in 50 gamble of putting him in you deck. If you had three he would cost 2 or 3 to maintain balance.
meeple
Sorry, but IMHO this is just nonsense. If FFG were that worried about game balance (and there is no sign of such a worry that I have seen from them), they would have rules that you cannot have more than 1 of such a card in a deck (or in the game).

The reason that there were not enough cards to have three of each was probably because the retail price of the core set would have had to be too high. I have no problem with that. The reason that there are only one of some (often very good) cards, whilst there are three of other (often quite poor) cards seems to undoubtedly be down to money. FFG (obviously) want you to buy as much as possible, including multiple core sets. They could have provided a 'catch up' pack with the 'missing cards' and a couple more threat counters. They could have had two starter sets: with complete sets of cards for 2 spheres (and 2 threat counters) each. There were probably other purchaser friendly ways they could have gone. They chose not to.
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Tony Irwin
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Hey Joan - I think the answer is because they can get away with it.

When you compare the LCG model to how CCGs get distributed, FFG seem like the best of a bad bunch. No matter how distasteful this situation seems it's still a heck of a lot better than the nonsense I used to go through collecting CCGs.

Recently though I bought and played the Star Trek Deck Building game and was stunned by the "completeness" of the boxed set. "This," I thought "is what I should be getting into." Also, paying money for a massive box of cards once a year suits me a lot better than dribbling away money for little packs throughout the year.

I've also noticed that AEG were selling complete sets of a recent run of Legend of the Five Rings. That's good good news! Things are changing! It's perhaps some consolation that FFG won't be able to get away with this kind of stuff for much longer.
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Tony Irwin
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AnnuverScotinExile wrote:
Bookwormral wrote:
The answer may be money but also I would have said balance. If you can 'guarantee' riversong, steward of gondor etc by having 3 copies of each they become too powerful. Riversong's fantastic ability costs only 1 partly because there is the 1 in 50 gamble of putting him in you deck. If you had three he would cost 2 or 3 to maintain balance.
meeple
Sorry, but IMHO this is just nonsense. If FFG were that worried about game balance (and there is no sign of such a worry that I have seen from them), they would have rules that you cannot have more than 1 of such a card in a deck (or in the game).

The reason that there were not enough cards to have three of each was probably because the retail price of the core set would have had to be too high. I have no problem with that. The reason that there are only one of some (often very good) cards, whilst there are three of other (often quite poor) cards seems to undoubtedly be down to money. FFG (obviously) want you to buy as much as possible, including multiple core sets. They could have provided a 'catch up' pack with the 'missing cards' and a couple more threat counters. They could have had two starter sets: with complete sets of cards for 2 spheres (and 2 threat counters) each. There were probably other purchaser friendly ways they could have gone. They chose not to.


Yeah, I absolutely agree. They chose to impose a rarity system on the core set with commons, uncommons, and rares exactly the same way that CCG companies do: want three rares? You'll have to buy more sets. Unfortunately the uncommons and rares aren't only just the most powerful cards - I think they're the most interesting cards, they give real distinctiveness to each sphere.

On the cost aspect of it: LotR LCG is the most badly over-produced card game I've ever purchased. The idea that they would cut down on cards (which is what the game is: cards) but still provide an absolute mess of tokens and threat dials you can punch out and assemble and hold together with little clips is stunning to me.

The game looks incredible when it's all laid out on the table. It's like a card game with top class board game sensibilities. In fact it's exactly what you'd hope for when you hear that a board game publisher is going to do a card game. Until you realise "Wait, I'm paying for all this stuff..."

I remember playing the game with a friend the week after I got it. He loved the tatics deck and asked "Is there a way I can buy one of these decks without buying all... this... [here he waved his hand to indicate the large box with as-yet-unused quests in it, the A4 full-colour rule book, and all the many little bits and pieces strewn right across the table.]

I had to explain "no". FFG aren't willing to sell you a complete playset of cards - but they do want you to have this boxful of beautiful chrome. cry
 
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Joan Altamirano
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Ok I understand everything

It does not matter, the game is awesome so I won't need a second core set.... I will do as you say and use the cards for the adventure packs to complement the decks.... I already ordered almost the entire Mirkwood set (missing the Hunt for Gollum only) and some of the Dwarf set.... (and I already have Khasad Dum and Numenor
 
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Robbie M.
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Tony Irwin wrote:
I've also noticed that AEG were selling complete sets of a recent run of Legend of the Five Rings. That's good good news! Things are changing! It's perhaps some consolation that FFG won't be able to get away with this kind of stuff for much longer.

Or...other companies are following FFG's lead and are looking for more "player friendly" distribution methods.
 
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Bart Rachemoss
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Tony Irwin wrote:
I've also noticed that AEG were selling complete sets of a recent run of Legend of the Five Rings. That's good good news! Things are changing! It's perhaps some consolation that FFG won't be able to get away with this kind of stuff for much longer.
I've read elsewhere the L5R "expires" all older cards by making them illegal thus forcing players to constantly buy new sets of cards while their current collections becomes worthless. IMO this is hardly a model of consumer friendliness.

I realize the LCG model is not perfect but it is vastly better than what came before it.
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Matt Shinners
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BitJam wrote:
Tony Irwin wrote:
I've also noticed that AEG were selling complete sets of a recent run of Legend of the Five Rings. That's good good news! Things are changing! It's perhaps some consolation that FFG won't be able to get away with this kind of stuff for much longer.
I've read elsewhere the L5R "expires" all older cards by making them illegal thus forcing players to constantly buy new sets of cards while their current collections becomes worthless. IMO this is hardly a model of consumer friendliness.

I realize the LCG model is not perfect but it is vastly better than what came before it.


L5R is most definitely a CCG that cycles sets out so people have to buy new product.

They released 2 sets recently that were Direct-to-Consumer: Forgotten Legacy and The Shadow's Embrace. The former was a set of cards that were of a higher power than the normal cards so that people would be forced to buy direct from AEG. The latter was a set that was supposed to be released blind-buy, but production problems with the latest edition of the game resulted in a slipped schedule that was kept on track by releasing a planned expansion set in the DTC method. Retailers weren't ecstatic.

To OP - they do this to keep the cost of the core set down while still balancing the decks, and to sell more copies. Most people will be happy with the contents of a single core set, so they try to make them balanced, with a few interesting cards that show up rarely. For those who want a playset of each card, they make sure the interesting ones aren't included in multiples so they have a reason to buy 3 core sets.

Is this as consumer-friendly as just giving everyone what they want for the low-low price they demand? No. But it's significantly more consumer-friendly than blind-buy, and there isn't a large enough market for a company as large as FFG (they sell a large amount of product through Target and B&N now, so hobbyists aren't the dominant force in their market) to release a "top-up" pack and make it worth dedicating those resources and shelf-space (not to mention having to deal with consumer confusion) when they could make money elsewhere. FFG has met consumers more than half-way in the collectible card world. If you want a playset, spend the $75-$120 for it - that's hardly a ridiculous sum to ask for a luxury version of a luxury good.
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