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Subject: Marines too wimpy to take a crap in front of a woman rss

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David desJardins
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jarredscott78 wrote:
Step 1: Make sure the physical standards are accurate for what is required to do the job.


But there's not some sharp cutoff for "required to do the job". If you can lift 200 pounds, is that enough? What if you have to carry someone weighing 210 pounds? Or 250 pounds? It seems clear that stronger is better, for some jobs, but there's no way to draw a single line that defines "strong enough".
 
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DaviddesJ wrote:
jarredscott78 wrote:
Step 1: Make sure the physical standards are accurate for what is required to do the job.


But there's not some sharp cutoff for "required to do the job". If you can lift 200 pounds, is that enough? What if you have to carry someone weighing 210 pounds? Or 250 pounds? It seems clear that stronger is better, for some jobs, but there's no way to draw a single line that defines "strong enough".

Is this why you don't support legal ages for sexual consent or to drive or to buy alcohol?
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Chris R.
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Women in Combat?

I'm confused. Is Obama going to add women to combat, or is Obama going to turn all the men into women?

Oops, too late.
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David desJardins
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jarredscott78 wrote:
Is this why you don't support legal ages for sexual consent or to drive or to buy alcohol?


The reason I do support a legal age to buy alcohol (for example) is because, for practical reasons, you need an objective criterion that can be applied by every store clerk everywhere, and prosecutions or administrative actions for violating the rule can be clearcut.

You don't need that for hiring, because you can use judgment in whom you hire. So, even though I would rather hire a software engineer who can type faster, I wouldn't go about hiring software engineers by setting a cutoff for typing speed, and only considering candidates above that cutoff. I'd get better results if I can weigh a lot of different factors.
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Les Marshall
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phosrik wrote:
I honestly don't care if gays or women are in the military or not. That said, there is one and only one function of our military and that is to defend our country. Its priority is not to appease every social group out there. If including gays and women in the front lines helps to improve its effectiveness then I'm all for it. If their inclusion proves detrimental then I am against it.


Problem A) those who call for the exclusion of gays and women often offer no evidence on the issue impairment on effectiveness. B) The military is their to protect and defend the constutition and the country. Can't say it's very effective if it's ignoring the constitution.
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Jorge Montero
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Euroncrowseye wrote:

David, I sincerely hope you aren't going to start claiming there are no physical differences between men and women. There are many reasonable arguments to make, that is not one of them.

Soldiers are not all about bulk, no. But they do have to haul a lot of gear around with them, be able to do it for great lengths of time and be able to operate efficiently using them. They rarely have to engage in hand to hand but it does sometimes happen.


There are many women out there, probably including pretty much every women in the military, that could outlast me in a long trek with heavy equipment, light equipment, or running buck naked. If I somehow joined a military, there's nothing that would make me more capable of being in a combat unit than an enlisted women.

Set up a test that reflects the job, and use it to judge who can serve in a unit.
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David desJardins
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Euroncrowseye wrote:
David, I sincerely hope you aren't going to start claiming there are no physical differences between men and women.


Is it ok if I start claiming you're a sexist pig?
 
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Daniel
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Equality! Yeah! Now everyone can buy into propaganda and kill and die in foreign wars that have nothing to do with national security.
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bjlillo wrote:
I think it's pretty difficult to murder children at their school unless we have the protection of the 2nd amendment.


Dude, that is so Right. I am going to get a dozen AR-15's tonight!
 
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David desJardins
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Euroncrowseye wrote:
But seriously? You're claiming that men aren't better at physical activity?


No. It seems like you're an illiterate sexist pig, since I said nothing about men being (on average or collectively or individually) better or worse at any given physical activity.

However, now I'll mention that women have performed consistently better at endurance swimming. Since "who's better at physical activity" seems to be important to you.

They also have an advantage in squeezing into tight spaces.
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49xjohn wrote:
bjlillo wrote:
I think it's pretty difficult to murder children at their school unless we have the protection of the 2nd amendment.


Dude, that is so Right. I am going to get a dozen AR-15's tonight!


Idiot. You'll be overpaying out your ass for them.
 
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David desJardins
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COMPNOR wrote:
49xjohn wrote:
bjlillo wrote:
I think it's pretty difficult to murder children at their school unless we have the protection of the 2nd amendment.


Dude, that is so Right. I am going to get a dozen AR-15's tonight!


Idiot. You'll be overpaying out your ass for them.


He didn't say he was going to pay for them. He could use the first one to shoot 11 sleeping guys and take theirs. That's what the Second Amendment is for, right?
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COMPNOR wrote:
49xjohn wrote:
bjlillo wrote:
I think it's pretty difficult to murder children at their school unless we have the protection of the 2nd amendment.


Dude, that is so Right. I am going to get a dozen AR-15's tonight!


Idiot. You'll be overpaying out your ass for them.


Why is that? Tell me, COMPNOR.
 
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J
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They are very popular with the fringe that likes to shoot up people, or have kids that like to shoot up people.
 
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49xjohn wrote:
COMPNOR wrote:
49xjohn wrote:
bjlillo wrote:
I think it's pretty difficult to murder children at their school unless we have the protection of the 2nd amendment.


Dude, that is so Right. I am going to get a dozen AR-15's tonight!


Idiot. You'll be overpaying out your ass for them.


Why is that? Tell me, COMPNOR.


Because the hysteria has driven up the price, that a Bushmaster or a Double Star or a Stag isn't worth the price you'll end up paying.

If you were smart, you would have bought them months ago, so that you could turn around and make a profit on some unsuspecting tool who wouldn't know an AR from a CZ.
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Dave G
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sikeospi wrote:
Women in Combat?

I'm confused. Is Obama going to add women to combat, or is Obama going to turn all the men into women?

Oops, too late.


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Agent J
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He's looking real sharp in his 1940's fedora. He's got nerves of steel, an iron will, and several other metal-themed attributes. His fur is water tight and he's always up for a fight.
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djgutierrez77 wrote:
sikeospi wrote:
Women in Combat?

I'm confused. Is Obama going to add women to combat, or is Obama going to turn all the men into women?

Oops, too late.




That sign is confusing.
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Born To Lose, Live To Win
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Jythier wrote:

That sign is confusing.


I have to agree, with that punctuation, I'm thinking he is for baby-murdering muslims for president. Which means he probably is Al Qaeda and should be killed with a drone. Yeah, he might be innocent and a trial might reveal that, but you can't take chances with terrorists and he has stated that he supports killing babies so, following Obama precedent, hellfire (irony powers activate!) missile away!
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Scott Russell
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DaviddesJ wrote:
qzhdad wrote:
People that are willing to go into the military should be allowed much more leeway in how they blow off steam.


Why? It's ok if only 10% of the people are offended? What did you think of the Owen Honors videos? If he and everyone involved had paid more attention sooner to the actual policies of the US Navy that he was sworn to uphold, wouldn't that have been better for everyone?

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2011/01...


Setting a standard for "allowable" levels of offensiveness is an interesting problem. I'll be the first to admit that I don't have an answer and am not convinced that there will ever be an objective standard that works.

Going by the description of the videos, I think it was really stupid to air them all over the ship. They also sounds inappropriate for an high ranking officer to be involved in making. It seems to show a lack of judgement that would at least call his command into question, but without further indications of unsuitability, I doubt that I would have removed him from command. (It sounds like he wasn't filming people secretly or specifically targeting any one person or people, but rather making fun of policies. If he were doing either of those I think he should be gone.)

Having not really answered, let me return a question. I am assuming that you agree with the decision to fire him. Had the videos been made by him earlier in his career would your decision change? For example, when he was a lieutenant, an ensign, a college student or a high school student?

Do you have a specific policy that you think he was violating?
 
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David desJardins
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For high-ranking military officers, any reprimand means your career is over. I don't know if that's "fair", but it's just how it works. As soon as you say that he did something inappropriate, he has to be relieved of command and retire soon, if not immediately. There are more well-qualified candidates than there are positions for them to rise to, so one strike means you're out. The standards for lower-ranking officers are not as strict and the punishments are less severe. Obviously you wouldn't drum a lower-ranking officer out of the military over this, the point is that he's in a position where much more is expected of him.
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Rich S
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DaviddesJ wrote:
For high-ranking military officers, any reprimand means your career is over. I don't know if that's "fair", but it's just how it works. As soon as you say that he did something inappropriate, he has to be relieved of command and retire soon, if not immediately.

And I have a problem with that. The people you want in command are the ones that will do the job the best. So what if the guy says the word fag too many times. Most of my bosses in life have been a-holes in some way, shape, or form too. But most of them also got the job done.

So what would you prefer if you were in the Navy? An a-hole captain that was going to give you the best chance at survival or a nice and polite captain that had no idea what he was doing. If you employ a one strike rule against all captains, I guarantee the later is what you will get and many will die because of some bonehead decision that the nice guy made. Nice and polite is good, but not at the expense of ability.

Do you have any idea what it's like to be out to sea for months at a time? I'm guessing not. I don't either but I have known several who have. People tend to get a little weird out there after a while. Expecting total and complete professionalism from everyone under those circumstances is asking for too much. Even they are human too you know.

I'm not saying that they should have completely swept what Honors did under the rug. A reprimand was probably in order. But I also saw many, many officers coming to his support as well and not a single person coming forward to claim offence. So killing the career of a capable ship captain over that seems pretty harsh.
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Euroncrowseye wrote:
If those inside are uncomfortable with behaviour it should stop, but ending traditions and routines which build camaraderie because civilians are offended is utterly pointless.

the guy who wrote that Op-Ed is not inside anymore.

These same things were said about integrating Blacks and Whites in the military. It was also said about Gays.

I wonder what makes certain people feel that U.S. military is so weak compared to other countries that already allow women in combat?
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Tobias Strobe
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phosrik wrote:
So what if the guy says the word fag too many times.


It probably doesn't matter if you're not a fag. As a fag, I'd be concerned that this dude doesn't have my best interests in mind when he orders me to put my life on the line. Hearing the word "fag" directed at me has been a prelude to violence, so it's not exactly welcome vernacular when coming from a stranger.

Also, if he said, "Hey jibba-jabba neeeeeegro motherfucker! Get your chicken-and-waffle ass in line and trust me not to get you killed, homeboy, 'cause I knowz just wut you need, porch monkey spearchucker monkeyman!" I expect African-American soldiers would have a hard time trusting him. When you work with people, even if those people are in the business of war, it's not a good idea to insult their identity for no good reason.
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Ilthuain wrote:
When you work with people, even if those people are in the business of war, it's not a good idea to insult their identity for no good reason.

You just don't understand, those are the kind of societal niceties that they need to keep intact.
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COMPNOR wrote:
49xjohn wrote:
COMPNOR wrote:
49xjohn wrote:
bjlillo wrote:
I think it's pretty difficult to murder children at their school unless we have the protection of the 2nd amendment.


Dude, that is so Right. I am going to get a dozen AR-15's tonight!


Idiot. You'll be overpaying out your ass for them.


Why is that? Tell me, COMPNOR.


Because the hysteria has driven up the price, that a Bushmaster or a Double Star or a Stag isn't worth the price you'll end up paying.

If you were smart, you would have bought them months ago, so that you could turn around and make a profit on some unsuspecting tool who wouldn't know an AR from a CZ.


You could not pay me to own such a device. What is the specific purpose of owning, or wanting to own, this kind of weapon? That is what I would like to know, and that is what none of you sick motherfuckers will ever tell anyone. Why is that?
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