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Subject: Republican plan to steal the next few elections rss

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Xander Fulton
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Gerrymandering - it's what's for dinner!

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If the Virginia plan had been in place across the country, as Republicans are now planning to do, Mitt Romney would have been elected president even though he lost by more than 5 million votes.


...yeah, that's my favorite part. Change to proportional vote allocation only in Democrat-leaning states (so even if Republicans lose the state, they still get a huge chunk of the votes). Republican-leaning states stay the way they are (so even if 49% of the state votes Democrat, the Republicans get all the votes).

Seems legit!
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J
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It's what you have to do when your policies lose you 5 out of the last 6 popular votes. It's the electoral math that counts of course.

I do favor a proportional allotment of electoral votes rather than winner take all, but I think it should be across the board. This GOP plan to rig the system is desperate and disgusting.
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Eric "Shippy McShipperson" Mowrer
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I'm glad the liberals have taken the high road on gerrymandering.
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Rich Shipley
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Sounds like a good way to start the next Civil War.
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Josiah Fiscus
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ejmowrer wrote:
I'm glad the liberals have taken the high road on gerrymandering.


The whole business disgusts me and this is exactly why. Sure, the GOP are the bad guys right now, but as soon as the pendulum swings, the left are just as likely to take the low road.
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Les Marshall
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happyjosiah wrote:
ejmowrer wrote:
I'm glad the liberals have taken the high road on gerrymandering.


The whole business disgusts me and this is exactly why. Sure, the GOP are the bad guys right now, but as soon as the pendulum swings, the left are just as likely to take the low road.


Unfortunately you are correct. The left often pulls the exact same manipulative shenanigans. Why else would Harry Reid and company compromise on the filibuster? It was the Dem's who made the confirmation process political with Bork so now the GOP makes the nomination process so difficult in return.

However, the recent few years of suspect voting machines, long lines at the polling stations, voter ID laws and taking people off the rolls are examples of a corrupt mindset that is as ugly as ever in our history. Gerrymandering is almost non controversial compared to the other tactics in use today
 
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Win at any cost, that is what is good for the country!

ANY COST.
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Boaty McBoatface
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49xjohn wrote:

Win at any cost, that is what is good for the country!

ANY COST.
Is that not the American way?
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Boaty McBoatface
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Why not just have direct elections for office?
 
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XanderF wrote:
Gerrymandering - it's what's for dinner!

Quote:
If the Virginia plan had been in place across the country, as Republicans are now planning to do, Mitt Romney would have been elected president even though he lost by more than 5 million votes.


...yeah, that's my favorite part. Change to proportional vote allocation only in Democrat-leaning states (so even if Republicans lose the state, they still get a huge chunk of the votes). Republican-leaning states stay the way they are (so even if 49% of the state votes Democrat, the Republicans get all the votes).

Seems legit!


That's what freedom is about, you liberal moronic communist Obamic slave.
FREEDOM!!!
 
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jbrier
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bjlillo wrote:
Sounds good to me.


I guess the Constitution is only sacred when the other guys are pissing on it.
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Boaty McBoatface
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I find it ironic that the party that bang on about fears of dictatorship (and supporters who want guns to stop it) are the same party trying to (in effect) take away voting rights. Dictatorship is OK as long as it can pretend to be democratic through rigged elections.
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Rich Shipley
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happyjosiah wrote:
ejmowrer wrote:
I'm glad the liberals have taken the high road on gerrymandering.


The whole business disgusts me and this is exactly why. Sure, the GOP are the bad guys right now, but as soon as the pendulum swings, the left are just as likely to take the low road.


So they're both equally bad because one side is advocating doing something rotten? You might want to blame people for what they actually do rather than what you can imagine them doing.
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Josiah Fiscus
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rshipley wrote:
happyjosiah wrote:
ejmowrer wrote:
I'm glad the liberals have taken the high road on gerrymandering.


The whole business disgusts me and this is exactly why. Sure, the GOP are the bad guys right now, but as soon as the pendulum swings, the left are just as likely to take the low road.


So they're both equally bad because one side is advocating doing something rotten? You might want to blame people for what they actually do rather than what you can imagine them doing.


Imagine? Do you really mean to say that democrats have never gerrymandered? Or perhaps that they never will again? It's pretty easy not to cheat when you are already winning. Doesn't make you any better than the cheating loser if your actions would be the same in their shoes.
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Boaty McBoatface
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happyjosiah wrote:
rshipley wrote:
happyjosiah wrote:
ejmowrer wrote:
I'm glad the liberals have taken the high road on gerrymandering.


The whole business disgusts me and this is exactly why. Sure, the GOP are the bad guys right now, but as soon as the pendulum swings, the left are just as likely to take the low road.


So they're both equally bad because one side is advocating doing something rotten? You might want to blame people for what they actually do rather than what you can imagine them doing.


Imagine? Do you really mean to say that democrats have never gerrymandered? Or perhaps that they never will again? It's pretty easy not to cheat when you are already winning. Doesn't make you any better than the cheating loser if your actions would be the same in their shoes.
Could you give some examples?
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Boaty McBoatface
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DCAnderson wrote:
happyjosiah wrote:
rshipley wrote:
happyjosiah wrote:
ejmowrer wrote:
I'm glad the liberals have taken the high road on gerrymandering.


The whole business disgusts me and this is exactly why. Sure, the GOP are the bad guys right now, but as soon as the pendulum swings, the left are just as likely to take the low road.


So they're both equally bad because one side is advocating doing something rotten? You might want to blame people for what they actually do rather than what you can imagine them doing.


Imagine? Do you really mean to say that democrats have never gerrymandered? Or perhaps that they never will again? It's pretty easy not to cheat when you are already winning. Doesn't make you any better than the cheating loser if your actions would be the same in their shoes.


This is pretty hardcore gerrymandering though. I don't know of anything really comparable to this in scale.
Restricting the number of terms a president can hold because you cannot beat him?
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Rob M.
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slatersteven wrote:
I find it ironic that the party that bang on about fears of dictatorship (and supporters who want guns to stop it) are the same party trying to (in effect) take away voting rights. Dictatorship is OK as long as it can pretend to be democratic through rigged elections.

My distinct recollection is that during the Bush years the fears of a fascist takeover and dominance of government were well and thoroughly discussed by the Democrats. Your pointing at "the party that bang on about..." is insufficiently encompassing.
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Boaty McBoatface
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Gutrender wrote:
slatersteven wrote:
I find it ironic that the party that bang on about fears of dictatorship (and supporters who want guns to stop it) are the same party trying to (in effect) take away voting rights. Dictatorship is OK as long as it can pretend to be democratic through rigged elections.

My distinct recollection is that during the Bush years the fears of a fascist takeover and dominance of government were well and thoroughly discussed by the Democrats. Your pointing at "the party that bang on about..." is insufficiently encompassing.
I don't recall ever seeing an argument based upon a need to defend against dictatorship.
 
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Dave G
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happyjosiah wrote:
rshipley wrote:
happyjosiah wrote:
ejmowrer wrote:
I'm glad the liberals have taken the high road on gerrymandering.


The whole business disgusts me and this is exactly why. Sure, the GOP are the bad guys right now, but as soon as the pendulum swings, the left are just as likely to take the low road.


So they're both equally bad because one side is advocating doing something rotten? You might want to blame people for what they actually do rather than what you can imagine them doing.


Imagine? Do you really mean to say that democrats have never gerrymandered? Or perhaps that they never will again? It's pretty easy not to cheat when you are already winning. Doesn't make you any better than the cheating loser if your actions would be the same in their shoes.


You've obviously never tried to talk to Rich before. Think Drew, but liberal and a little dumber.
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Dave G
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happyjosiah wrote:
ejmowrer wrote:
I'm glad the liberals have taken the high road on gerrymandering.


The whole business disgusts me and this is exactly why. Sure, the GOP are the bad guys right now, but as soon as the pendulum swings, the left are just as likely to take the low road.


Exactly--this is disgusting because it's not only possible, but encouraged by our political system. This kind of thing really pisses me off, whomever is doing it.
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happyjosiah wrote:
Imagine? Do you really mean to say that democrats have never gerrymandered? Or perhaps that they never will again?


I think people going to the "both sides gerrymander" well (which is true - although the most recent election results make it fairly clear that the GOP has gerrymandered much more successfully than the Dems, for what that is worth, by a simple comparison of popular vote to percentage of House seats won) obliviates the actual issue here, which is that the GOP plan is not "let's gerrymander House seats even further" but "let's take those gerrymandered districts and use them to decide how the Electoral College is allocated," which is totally unprecedented and makes the antidemocratic nature of gerrymandering look like child's play in comparison.

Saying "both sides do bad behaviour X" is not by any means proof of "both sides will do bad behaviour Y."
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bjlillo wrote:
mightygodking wrote:
Saying "both sides do bad behaviour X" is not by any means proof of "both sides will do bad behaviour Y."


You're just mad because they thought of it first.


I point out logical fallacy, BJ exercises said logical fallacy immediately. It's probably all that football you watch. It DOES THINGS TO BRAIN.
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Dave G
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mightygodking wrote:
happyjosiah wrote:
Imagine? Do you really mean to say that democrats have never gerrymandered? Or perhaps that they never will again?


I think people going to the "both sides gerrymander" well (which is true - although the most recent election results make it fairly clear that the GOP has gerrymandered much more successfully than the Dems, for what that is worth, by a simple comparison of popular vote to percentage of House seats won) obliviates the actual issue here, which is that the GOP plan is not "let's gerrymander House seats even further" but "let's take those gerrymandered districts and use them to decide how the Electoral College is allocated," which is totally unprecedented and makes the antidemocratic nature of gerrymandering look like child's play in comparison.

Saying "both sides do bad behaviour X" is not by any means proof of "both sides will do bad behaviour Y."


But they will. As soon as the Dems have control of some "red" states where they can steal a proportion of votes that makes it worthwhile, they'll do the exact same thing. Sure, the GOP started it, but the only way to combat it is to repay in kind. And it won't change, because assclowns like BJ don't have a problem with it because it works in their favor and assclowns like Rich want to feign shock and point fingers at how the "other guys" are the only people who would ever think of stooping so low rather than addressing the inherent flaws in a system that allows this kind of cynical manipulation.
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djgutierrez77 wrote:
But they will. As soon as the Dems have control of some "red" states where they can steal a proportion of votes that makes it worthwhile, they'll do the exact same thing.


Nebraska has been using a variant of what the GOP is proposing here since 1996 (assigning some electoral votes by district and then the remainder by popular vote). Maine has been doing it since 1972. This isn't some wild new electoral idea nobody thought of before; nobody did it because they recognized that on a large scale it would be dramatically unfair given the nature of Congressional districts.

Saying that Dems will "do the exact same thing" when somebody does it to them first and using that as proof of moral equivalence is like me saying that if I, without provocation, punch you in the face, you're just as bad as me if you hit me back. The political degradation in the USA over the last twenty years is very much a story of "GOP abandons unwritten agreement about how government is supposed to function; Dems follow suit because if they don't, they're effectively conceding defeat."
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bjlillo wrote:
It's nice to see you Democrats feigning interest in fair elections for once. Too bad things like verifying that voters are eligible to vote or that they are who they say they are doesn't register on your radar.


oh good BJ is going to this bullshit again I can't wait for his umpteenth citing of the Milwaukee report which doesn't say what he says it does
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