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Troyes: The Ladies of Troyes» Forums » Rules

Subject: Uprising + Other Building-related Event rss

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Frank Otte
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We had exactly this situation with Uprising in the Bishopric and afterwards a Theological Conflict:

Blue had three meeples in the Bishopric before the Uprising. Uprising randomly positioned two of blues meeples at the rightmost spaces of both rows of the bishopric and the remaining one expelled.

Afterwards came Theological Conflict. There was no valid die roll anymore left for it, because all results would lead to a second expelled blue meeple. What should we do now?

a) Ignore the event?
b) Ignore the restriction, that only one meeple may be expelled at the same time on the same building of the same color?
c) Something different?
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Frank Otte
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I have an assumption for a solution of this dilemma based on the rules.

Assumption: In the mentioned case, as an exception, a second meeple of the same color is expelled.

Reason: Uprising states "(...) If there is a seventh citizen, lay it down on the building for the rest of the round, as if it had been expelled."

Conclusion: The citizen expelled by Uprising is not really expelled, it is treated as expelled. Therefor, a second citizen of the same color has place on the picture of the building at the same time.
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Frank Otte
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No, I will not disagree. Because I know, that my interpretion is equally weak. "as if it had been expelled" can also mean, that this meeple was not expelled by shifting, but by mixing the meeples. Just a hint about a "non-regular expelling". That would mean, that the limit of one per color does still counts.

The real pitty is, that we are forced to fish in murky waters, because the rules don't specify it.

And nothing about corner cases here, please. If two players have encountered and told about this situation within weeks (with a higher dark number of course, not to mention all the players, who dont know or engage in this forum), you should better ask, why the game designers didn't came across this case within hundreds of tests.
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Alain Orban
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louper wrote:
Now that Uprising can be in play along with another event which places gray figures in buildings (such as Wayfarers), it's possible for Uprising, for example, to result in a meeple being expelled before Wayfarers is resolved. Wayfarers could then result in a meeple of the same color as the one Uprising removed to be removed. However, that color should be "protected" from being expelled again. In this case, does Wayfarers just not do anything?

(The reverse, in which Wayfarers is resolved before Uprising, appears to be handled in the rules as the rules state for Uprising that if there's already a meeple that has been expelled, that meeple is added to the mix instead of a gray one.)

you're right, Wayfarers just do nothing seeing that you can't expell 2 citizens of the same colour.
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Alain Orban
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Hermjard wrote:
We had exactly this situation with Uprising in the Bishopric and afterwards a Theological Conflict:

Blue had three meeples in the Bishopric before the Uprising. Uprising randomly positioned two of blues meeples at the rightmost spaces of both rows of the bishopric and the remaining one expelled.

Afterwards came Theological Conflict. There was no valid die roll anymore left for it, because all results would lead to a second expelled blue meeple. What should we do now?

a) Ignore the event?
b) Ignore the restriction, that only one meeple may be expelled at the same time on the same building of the same color?
c) Something different?

The effect of the theological conflict would then be: "nothing happens".
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Frank Otte
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Sorry, that I have to add a quite complicated follow up question: Assuming in the above example, blue had only one meeple in one rightmost space of one row of the bishopric. The rightmost space of the second row is occupied by a meeple of another color, lets say green. Contrary to Blue, Green has no expelled meeple on the bishopric up to now. Does that mean,

1) Green gets automatically expelled because of the Theological Conflict, without any roll, because that's the only valid possibility.

2) For the Theological Conflict a die is rolled. If the die shows the row of the green meeple, it is expelled. If it shows the row of the blue meeple, nothing happens.

3) Nothing happens.

Similar situations could be constructed for the town hall and for the palace. Basically you can generalize the above. If, in the case of an event, which expells a meeple from the main building, at least one row is "blocked" by colors of already expelled meeples

1) You repeat the roll, until you get a valid result (or don't roll at all, if only one valid result is possible, and automatically apply the only valid result).

2) You roll one and only one time. If you get an invalid result, nothing happens, otherwise you apply the result.

3) If at least one invalid result is possible, you don't roll at all, and nothing happens.

Btw, I assume (1), but I am by far not sure.

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Alain Orban
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Hermjard wrote:
Sorry, that I have to add a quite complicated follow up question: Assuming in the above example, blue had only one meeple in one rightmost space of one row of the bishopric. The rightmost space of the second row is occupied by a meeple of another color, lets say green. Contrary to Blue, Green has no expelled meeple on the bishopric up to now. Does that mean,

1) Green gets automatically expelled because of the Theological Conflict, without any roll, because that's the only valid possibility.

2) For the Theological Conflict a die is rolled. If the die shows the row of the green meeple, it is expelled. If it shows the row of the blue meeple, nothing happens.

3) Nothing happens.

Similar situations could be constructed for the town hall and for the palace. Basically you can generalize the above. If, in the case of an event, which expells a meeple from the main building, at least one row is "blocked" by colors of already expelled meeples

1) You repeat the roll, until you get a valid result (or don't roll at all, if only one valid result is possible, and automatically apply the only valid result).

2) You roll one and only one time. If you get an invalid result, nothing happens, otherwise you apply the result.

3) If at least one invalid result is possible, you don't roll at all, and nothing happens.

Btw, I assume (1), but I am by far not sure.


your always roll the dice and see what happens.
if you have to expell a color already expelled, you do nothing.
if you have to expell a color not yet expelled, you expel it !
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Frank Otte
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So (2) seems to be the right answer. Thanks for your determining!
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Alain Orban
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Hermjard wrote:
So (2) seems to be the right answer. Thanks for your determining!

yes, (2) is the right answer.
you're welcome.
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