GeekGold Bonus for All Supporters at year's end: 1000!
8,324 Supporters
$15 min for supporter badge & GeekGold bonus
20 Days Left

Support:

Recommend
5 
 Thumb up
 Hide
17 Posts

No Retreat! The Russian Front» Forums » General

Subject: City counterblow avoidance technique - intended or not? rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
Jeff Johnson
Canada
Victoria
British Columbia
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Here's a question for Carl:

There's a gamey technique that can be used when:

you're defending in a friendly city hex with a weak unit with no other friendly units adjacent, and

the enemy is adjacent, strong enough you can't get good odds, and places a CB

Specifically, you rail your defender out, and then rail someone back in. This avoids the counterblow entirely. It's not without risk, since the other guy might have a move card.

Is this tactic meant to represent anything specific in the historical narrative, or just an unintended artifact of the rail move rules?

4 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Thomas Büttner-Zimmermann
Germany
München
Bavaria
flag msg tools
badge
Wiggle It!!!
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Sounds cheesy to me - but valid.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
David desJardins
United States
Burlingame
California
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
He doesn't place his counterblows until after you end your movement phase. You can't rail units after that.
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Russ Williams
Poland
Wrocław
Dolny Śląsk
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmb
DaviddesJ wrote:
He doesn't place his counterblows until after you end your movement phase. You can't rail units after that.

Good point.

What about CB markers that were left over from your opponent's previous combat phase? This "rail them out, then rail them back" technique would work to let you avoid attacking those enemy units marked with CB, right? Or am I similarly confused as the OP?
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Carl Paradis
Canada
montreal
Québec
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Mhhh...

The Counterblow does represent a "spoiling attack" done by the other side.

It could be this way too: You just move the unit in contact elsewhere, then bring in another unit by rail later on. It does not have to be the same unit!

And, yes it's allowed in the rules. And I had seen this possibility when making the game:

1- You do have to "spend" a Rail move to do it.
2- The Opponent could have a move card to get the place anyway!
3- It does represent the difficulty of capturing built-up areas "on the run".
4- You cannot do this with Cities that do not have a land-based supply line (ex: besieged Sevastopol or Odessa), as rail moves are not possible to these.

BUT a case could be made that since it's a "spoiling attack" and the hex is contested, then a "rail move" in the place is not really possible!!!

In that case an errata could be added:

"You cannot rail move a unit in a hex if an unresolved "Counterblow" maker is still there".

But not sure if it's worth the trouble, or if gameplay-wise it,s a good idea.











10 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Glenn Martin
Canada
Ottawa
Ont.
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Carl. I just want to thank you for the excellent customer support and attention to players you give.
5 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Carl Paradis
Canada
montreal
Québec
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
fluffyevil wrote:
Carl. I just want to thank you for the excellent customer support and attention to players you give.


Thanks for the good words!

Hey, It's my Hobby!!! It's not like I get paid for doing this or anything...
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Fabrice Dubois
France
La Garenne Colombes
Hauts de Seine
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
licinius wrote:
Hey, It's my Hobby!!! It's not like I get paid for doing this or anything...

Always the same song
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Carl Paradis
Canada
montreal
Québec
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
fdubois wrote:
Always the same song


LOL! Well let's say hten that I'm NOT doing any games for YOU!
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Fabrice Dubois
France
La Garenne Colombes
Hauts de Seine
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Last time we talk (a long time ago), you was doubtful to manage to find the time to do another games.

I am very pleased that :
- at the end, you found the time
- all your No Retreat's games will receive the GMT's deluxe treatment

Can't wait to buy NR2,NR3....and i have to play NR1 again ASAP.

1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Carl Paradis
Canada
montreal
Québec
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
fdubois wrote:
Last time we talk (a long time ago), you was doubtful to manage to find the time to do another games.


LOL! Well.. I'm still a bit doubtful: am late for meeting the deadline of Deluxe NR2, but I'll try... cry

As for NR3 it should be on the P500 this year I suppose. I will add the Poish 1939 campaign to that package!
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jeff Johnson
Canada
Victoria
British Columbia
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
russ wrote:
DaviddesJ wrote:
He doesn't place his counterblows until after you end your movement phase. You can't rail units after that.

Good point.

What about CB markers that were left over from your opponent's previous combat phase? This "rail them out, then rail them back" technique would work to let you avoid attacking those enemy units marked with CB, right? Or am I similarly confused as the OP?


I'd probably post more clearly before 1 am shake Yep - it was a CB placed by a combat result, not by a card. And the city defender could just move out (wouldn't need to rail out).
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Agung Waspodo
Indonesia
Depok
Jawa Barat
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I'm currently bogged down in trenches of the first world war in PoG, but seeing these NR posts I can't help but put this awesome game on my war-table once again.

I can't wait for the North African edition.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Carl Paradis
Canada
montreal
Québec
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
dahusband wrote:
I'm currently bogged down in trenches of the first world war in PoG, but seeing these NR posts I can't help but put this awesome game on my war-table once again.

I can't wait for the North African edition.


Cool, thanks for the good words.

PoG is a great game!!!

Have you seen this awesome variant?

http://www.banquetdesgeneraux.com/rubrique4.html

As for NR: The North African Front, today I have taken the day off my regular job to polish off the Event Cards. Do not forget also that there will be a "bonus" invasion of Crete game included (probably with a solitaire system). The components will be event better than the first GMT edition of NR I think!!!

And About "NO Retreat!", you can odrer a set of "improved" cards with pictures on them, here:

http://www.artscow.com/gallery/playing-cards/no-retreat-the-...



http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/723894/creating-an-artscow-d...

3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Russ Williams
Poland
Wrocław
Dolny Śląsk
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmb
Oakfed wrote:
Yep - it was a CB placed by a combat result, not by a card. And the city defender could just move out (wouldn't need to rail out).

But if they don't move out by rail movement, then they can't move back in at the end of the turn (unless you have some special card event that lets you move after combat), so the opposing player could then move into the city by normal movement to seize it on their turn right after your turn. Right?
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Chris McDonald
United States
Louisville
Colorado
flag msg tools
badge
mbmbmbmbmb
russ wrote:
Oakfed wrote:
Yep - it was a CB placed by a combat result, not by a card. And the city defender could just move out (wouldn't need to rail out).

But if they don't move out by rail movement, then they can't move back in at the end of the turn (unless you have some special card event that lets you move after combat), so the opposing player could then move into the city by normal movement to seize it on their turn right after your turn. Right?


Not if some other unit moves in by rail. The idea is unit A walks out, then at the end of the turn, unit B rails in to take its place. I don't see this as a real problem, but it is a quirk.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Russ Williams
Poland
Wrocław
Dolny Śląsk
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmb
cfmcdonald wrote:
russ wrote:
But if they don't move out by rail movement, then they can't move back in at the end of the turn (unless you have some special card event that lets you move after combat), so the opposing player could then move into the city by normal movement to seize it on their turn right after your turn. Right?


Not if some other unit moves in by rail. The idea is unit A walks out, then at the end of the turn, unit B rails in to take its place.

Ah OK, good point! I was only thinking in terms of the same unit returning, doh.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.