GeekGold Bonus for All Supporters at year's end: 1000!
7,766 Supporters
$15 min for supporter badge & GeekGold bonus
22 Days Left

Support:

Recommend
4 
 Thumb up
 Hide
24 Posts

Tomb: Cryptmaster» Forums » General

Subject: +1 to my Game collection? rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
Karl
United States
Slippery Rock
Pennsylvania
flag msg tools
badge
:l
Avatar
mbmb
So recently I ordered the Dice pack for Tomb at Miniature Market;
Which gives you an additional 10 green, 10 blue and 10 red extra dice.
I figured that I'd just get some extra dice for the first Tomb game that I actually own, so the rolls would go faster.

Today I received a rather large box containing this:

Being the honest guy I am, I sent them an e-mail and explained the situation. For a short moment though, I just kinda stood there looking at the game wondering if, somehow, Christmas had come around again...

The mistake, no doubt, happened when they pulled it from their warehouse since the SKU numbers are quite similar - AEG5010-1 (for the dice pack) and AEG5010 (for the game)...

For a short while I will be a happy owner of this game though.. Hmm, should this count towards my game collection perhaps..?
11 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Neil Edmonds
United States
Washington
flag msg tools
badge
Do you need more card ideas for the D&D Adventure System games?
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Congratulations on your honesty. It's refreshing news when there are so many examples of people doing the wrong thing.

If you didn't own it you should considering buying it.

Cryptmaster updated and clarified the rules from the original Tomb game. It also featured new heroes, monsters, cards, and game boards that integrate well with the original Tomb game. Plus, you'd have those extra dice!
5 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Kenneth Stuart
United States
Hawthorne
California
flag msg tools
Avatar
mb
Many times the distributer will let you keep an improper shipment because it isn't worth paying the return shipping prices. If they really want it back, they'll respond within a few business days. If over a week goes by, I'd say consider it yours!
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Karl
United States
Slippery Rock
Pennsylvania
flag msg tools
badge
:l
Avatar
mbmb
So I got a pretty fast reply from Miniature Markets Customer Service Representative...

I must say that for being honest with them, complimenting their site, being understanding about their mistake and also saying that I plan on still being their customer (this was included in the mail that I sent them)... Their reply was very dry, drone-like and not very appreciative of the fact that I reached out to them. I really did not expect them to say that I could keep the game, but I at least figured that in their first sentences the words "Thank you" would appear.

There was absolutely no positive tone, appreciative comment or reply to what I wrote to them. The CSR person actually had the gall to ask me if I wanted to buy the game at a discounted price, a negligible amount. I get it, it's a company, they want to make money, that's the idea of a company. But that "offer" left a sour taste in my mouth - not the actual amount of the discount, but the fact that they treated this as a way to do more business.

They did offer to send me a prepaid return label, since I had said that I would send the game back to them once I would be able to. So I guess they at least acknowledged that part. However, there was no mention of the Dice that I had actually ordered. I guess they want to hear back about their business proposition first...

Here is another thing, there was -NO- apology offered at all, not that I felt any inconvenience about the whole thing. Though there was a "Thank You" in the CSR's pre-generated signature, which is most likely a requirement rather than a personal preference.
I think that's what really has me pissed off the most, the lack of sincerity.

But I suppose that this is what you get for being an honest, appreciative, understanding and supportive customer*. No wonder it took less than 24 hours for them to reply.

*I'll still be the same honest, supportive, understanding and appreciative person that I was before this reply. I'll just take my next check-out elsewhere...
12 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Kenneth Stuart
United States
Hawthorne
California
flag msg tools
Avatar
mb
Wow, way to be the better man! I'm surprised a business would be rude enough to only mention their concerns in a communication and complete neglect the customer.

Make sure they are actually going to give you your purchase (or full refund) before sending it back. Seems to me like they'd have the audacity to take their game back and leave you with nothing.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Karl
United States
Slippery Rock
Pennsylvania
flag msg tools
badge
:l
Avatar
mbmb
So after spending quite some time thinking (read: cool off) over how to reply to this CSR, I finally just wrote that I would like for them to reply with a copy of my initial message about the situation.

I've decided to call them and ask for a manager, and ask what their customer support policy is. Specifically if it is their policy to do business like this.

Perhaps this might seem like overkill to some people, but I'm done with poor customer service.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Karl
United States
Slippery Rock
Pennsylvania
flag msg tools
badge
:l
Avatar
mbmb
So today I received a reply to that mail, my initial message was included. Their "offer" was repeated, but this time the CSR at least mentioned the Dice that I had initially ordered. Still no apology though.

I'll send back the game, obviously, get my ordered dice. But I'm unlikely to stay a repeat customer of theirs.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Justin B
Canada
Winnipeg
Manitoba
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Pretty sad that you waste your time fixing their mistake and they don't bother to thank you.
6 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jennifer Derrick
United States
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
This happened once to me with something on Amazon. Ordered something and got something else (worth more money) by mistake. When I told them about it, they fell all over themselves to make it right and told me that if I wanted to keep it, I could and they'd still send the correct item at no additional charge, or if I wanted to return it they would send a shipping label and have UPS pick it up so I wouldn't have to make a trip to the UPS store.

Shame the store you worked with (and more stores out there) aren't as service oriented. If it's not my mistake, it shouldn't be up to me to fix it and the least a store can do is be nice about it if I'm offering to solve your problems for you.
7 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Mike Waleke
United States
Portland
OR
flag msg tools
or zombies or ...
badge
"Time is an illusion. Lunchtime doubly so." Douglas Adams
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I have only ordered from Miniature Market once (some Mage Knight Dungeons minis). And when they arrived they were just loose in the box, and one was horribly broken. (Several others were broken as well but I was able to fix those with glue) I told them about it and sure they offered to refund the money, but they also said that If I wanted a replacement I would have to pay shipping. (the mini was like $1.79 shipping was way around $5) I took the credit but haven't used them again because of it.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
United States
Wurtsboro
NY
flag msg tools
admin
designer
badge
We always have time for the things we put first.
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Added to OLGS Geeklist:

http://boardgamegeek.com/listitem/987774?commentid=3586901#c...
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Boaty McBoatface
England
County of Essex
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I would have done the same as you, but would also now (as I think they sound like a right fly by night outfit) not return the game until the goods you paid for arrive (and I would tell them that).
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Chris Fee
United States
Corning
New York
flag msg tools
designer
badge
No fair! They're using brains against us! We removed our brains to make room for guns and explosives!
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I've ordered from MM many times and the two times there were mistakes (missing minis), they were quick to fix it and apologized immediately on my contacting them.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Kai Mölleken
Germany
45147 Essen
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I had a situation which was a bit similar. Some months ago I ordered sleeves for several games. When I opened the package I saw that there were several more packs of sleeves than what I paid for. I contacted the seller telling him about his mistake.
I got an immediate friendly reply in which the seller wondered how that could have happened, thanked me very much for my honesty and told me that I may keep them. In return I have decided to keep buying my sleeves from him. Not because I hope that he could make the same mistake twice but just because I really appreciated the way he replied.
7 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Karl
United States
Slippery Rock
Pennsylvania
flag msg tools
badge
:l
Avatar
mbmb
indigopotter wrote:
I didn't even know this list existed, you learn something new every day.. Thanks for including it Indigopotter.

slatersteven wrote:
I would have done the same as you, but would also now (as I think they sound like a right fly by night outfit) not return the game until the goods you paid for arrive (and I would tell them that).
I took you up on your advice here and replied to the CSR that I would send them the game back with a prepaid shipping label, once I had received the Dice I ordered.

I'm almost expecting them to tell me to send the game back first. We'll see what they say...
3 
 Thumb up
0.05
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jarrett Dunn
United States
Tulsa
OK
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Gripen wrote:
So I got a pretty fast reply from Miniature Markets Customer Service Representative...

I must say that for being honest with them, complimenting their site, being understanding about their mistake and also saying that I plan on still being their customer (this was included in the mail that I sent them)... Their reply was very dry, drone-like and not very appreciative of the fact that I reached out to them. I really did not expect them to say that I could keep the game, but I at least figured that in their first sentences the words "Thank you" would appear.

There was absolutely no positive tone, appreciative comment or reply to what I wrote to them. The CSR person actually had the gall to ask me if I wanted to buy the game at a discounted price, a negligible amount. I get it, it's a company, they want to make money, that's the idea of a company. But that "offer" left a sour taste in my mouth - not the actual amount of the discount, but the fact that they treated this as a way to do more business.

They did offer to send me a prepaid return label, since I had said that I would send the game back to them once I would be able to. So I guess they at least acknowledged that part. However, there was no mention of the Dice that I had actually ordered. I guess they want to hear back about their business proposition first...

Here is another thing, there was -NO- apology offered at all, not that I felt any inconvenience about the whole thing. Though there was a "Thank You" in the CSR's pre-generated signature, which is most likely a requirement rather than a personal preference.
I think that's what really has me pissed off the most, the lack of sincerity.

But I suppose that this is what you get for being an honest, appreciative, understanding and supportive customer*. No wonder it took less than 24 hours for them to reply.

*I'll still be the same honest, supportive, understanding and appreciative person that I was before this reply. I'll just take my next check-out elsewhere...


Uh what they are doing IS illegal:

https://postalinspectors.uspis.gov/investigations/MailFraud/...

They cannot bill you, try to convince you to pay for it, or even continue communication with you. This is considered a violation of federal law BTW (their actions) and IS fraud. The product is 100% yours as it was unsolicited... Companies really need to know the law better, especially if they are doing mail order. Also you have the right to demand the product you ordered or stop payment since you haven't received it yet.
4 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Andreas Krüger
Germany
Krefeld
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I think fraud requires intention - this was just a mistake. The OP did order a very similar product. The company did not approach the OP after the mistake, the OP contacted them instead. Maybe US law is different, though.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
James Deignan
United States
Fremont
California
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Gripen wrote:
So I got a pretty fast reply from Miniature Markets Customer Service Representative...

I must say that for being honest with them, complimenting their site, being understanding about their mistake and also saying that I plan on still being their customer (this was included in the mail that I sent them)... Their reply was very dry, drone-like and not very appreciative of the fact that I reached out to them. I really did not expect them to say that I could keep the game, but I at least figured that in their first sentences the words "Thank you" would appear.

There was absolutely no positive tone, appreciative comment or reply to what I wrote to them. The CSR person actually had the gall to ask me if I wanted to buy the game at a discounted price, a negligible amount. I get it, it's a company, they want to make money, that's the idea of a company. But that "offer" left a sour taste in my mouth - not the actual amount of the discount, but the fact that they treated this as a way to do more business.

They did offer to send me a prepaid return label, since I had said that I would send the game back to them once I would be able to. So I guess they at least acknowledged that part. However, there was no mention of the Dice that I had actually ordered. I guess they want to hear back about their business proposition first...

Here is another thing, there was -NO- apology offered at all, not that I felt any inconvenience about the whole thing. Though there was a "Thank You" in the CSR's pre-generated signature, which is most likely a requirement rather than a personal preference.
I think that's what really has me pissed off the most, the lack of sincerity.

But I suppose that this is what you get for being an honest, appreciative, understanding and supportive customer*. No wonder it took less than 24 hours for them to reply.

*I'll still be the same honest, supportive, understanding and appreciative person that I was before this reply. I'll just take my next check-out elsewhere...


I commend you for your honesty. I'm not sure I would have had the same reaction given the reply you received from the company.

I would expect something more like, "Thank you very much for your honesty, Karl. We are sending you a prepaid return label with your original dice order by priority overnight and hope that you will consider MM in your future purchases. As a thank you for your communication and to account for your inconvenience, your original dice order will also contain a gift certificate to be applied to a future MM purchase." Of course, I still feel that customer service and repeat business supersedes and is part of profit margin.

I wouldn't expect much more than maybe five bucks, but you're trying to make it right. Figure their loss on return shipping and their profit margin, they couldn't give you too much or it might make it better for them as a company to just let you keep the game. Their profit margin couldn't possibly be too high given their low prices.

All that said, in light of the company's reply, if it had been me, I probably would have written back. "Thank you for the reply. I expect that my original order of X will be fulfilled per our purchasing agreement. As postal laws allow me to keep unsolicited deliveries, you can disregard my previous communications."

Long and short of it Karl, you're a better man than I am.

EDIT: For legal link information: http://www.consumer.ftc.gov/articles/0181-unordered-merchand...
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jarrett Dunn
United States
Tulsa
OK
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Thamos von Nostria wrote:
I think fraud requires intention - this was just a mistake. The OP did order a very similar product. The company did not approach the OP after the mistake, the OP contacted them instead. Maybe US law is different, though.


Sending someone an unsolicited item and then requesting payment is Postal fraud as defined by the law. US law is fairly cut and dry, you do X then Y is the result (or it tries to be). And yes I would bring up the fact that continuing to attempt to collect on an unsolicited product would be considered fraud by the postal service, thus they then have full knowledge that if they continue to ask for payment and continue to be rude they may be in for legal ramifications by the gov't.

Note: We aren't talking about some game publisher here, we are talking about a company that:

1. Can afford to hire a CSR.
2. Does their business almost completely via shipping/online orders.

They should be WELL aware of the laws regarding their specific business model and if they are not they should not be in the business. As is said, ignorance of the law is no excuse and this is a long standing and fairly (at least in the US) law. Heck I've known about it since I was a kid.
5 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Karl
United States
Slippery Rock
Pennsylvania
flag msg tools
badge
:l
Avatar
mbmb
This morning I called them and asked for a manager, whom I spent some time talking about the issue. He did apologize numerous times and told me that they do make a point of adding on such offers in situations like this. I let him know that they should perhaps look into what they are actually allowed to do instead of assuming. I'm no lawyer, did not say I was. I simply told him that there has been some discussion going on as to them breaking or not breaking a federal law, and that he probably should check up on that.

As is stands, I asked for my originally ordered Dice (which incidentally had been shipped without them letting me know!?!), told them that I would wait for a prepaid shipping label for the game to arrive and that I wanted to be refunded for the initially purchased dice. All of which the manager complied with without any problems, he apologized again and that was that.
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Silver Bowen
United States
Austin
Texas
flag msg tools
Woo! Gonna get some
badge
44, that's me!
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I've had good luck (and good customer service) in my dealings with MM (and plan on ordering from them again).

That said, the law is clear in this case. If something arrives addressed to you, it is yours. No ifs, ands, or buts. In your particular case, the retailer would in no way be absolved of fulfilling your original agreement (RE: the dice). How you handle the situation is your business (and your moral choice), but you are under no legal obligation to return the game or to pay for it.

Just saying.

And I'm not a lawyer, BTW. Nor do I portray one on TV.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Robert Ruescher
United States
West Milford
New Jersey
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmb
Perhaps this might seem like overkill to some people, but I'm done with poor customer service.[/q]

The reason we have such poor customer service is because many people are poor customers, lazy, indifferent, etc..

If you feel a need to complain, then you should, it is how customer service departments get the message, and in which areas need improvement.

+1 for being proactive.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Mike Forrey
United States
Dallastown
Pennsylvania
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Gripen wrote:
This morning I called them and asked for a manager, whom I spent some time talking about the issue. He did apologize numerous times and told me that they do make a point of adding on such offers in situations like this. I let him know that they should perhaps look into what they are actually allowed to do instead of assuming. I'm no lawyer, did not say I was. I simply told him that there has been some discussion going on as to them breaking or not breaking a federal law, and that he probably should check up on that.

As is stands, I asked for my originally ordered Dice (which incidentally had been shipped without them letting me know!?!), told them that I would wait for a prepaid shipping label for the game to arrive and that I wanted to be refunded for the initially purchased dice. All of which the manager complied with without any problems, he apologized again and that was that.


Switch to CSI and you'll never have these issues. I once ordered a copy of Runebound the base game and got a copy of the old coffin box Runewars instead. I called them up and told them what happened and they over nighted my Runebound game to me and told me the Runewars was mine to keep. Spent thousands with them and always 110% satisfaction.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Karl
United States
Slippery Rock
Pennsylvania
flag msg tools
badge
:l
Avatar
mbmb
bearn wrote:
Switch to CSI and you'll never have these issues. I once ordered a copy of Runebound the base game and got a copy of the old coffin box Runewars instead. I called them up and told them what happened and they over nighted my Runebound game to me and told me the Runewars was mine to keep. Spent thousands with them and always 110% satisfaction.
CSI has been the OLGS for me ever since, and MM has missed out on a lot of my casholas.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.