Recommend
 
 Thumb up
 Hide
26 Posts
1 , 2  Next »   | 

Android: Netrunner» Forums » Strategy

Subject: Shaper list: Chaos and Anarchy rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
David Jackman
United States
Indianapolis
Indiana
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
So, here is my take on Chaos Theory.

The main premise is this:

A very efficient method of dealing with low-strength ice is fixed strength breakers and ways to pump them.
A very effecient method of dealing with high-strength ice is Emergency Shutdown.

Deck Created with CardGameDB.com Android: Netrunner Deck Builder

Identity:
Chaos Theory: Wunderkind (Cyber Exodus)


Total Cards: (40)

Event: (19)
Emergency Shutdown (Cyber Exodus) x3
Test Run (Cyber Exodus) x3
The Maker's Eye (Core) x3
Diesel (Core) x3
Modded (Core) x3
Sure Gamble (Core) x3
Stimhack (Core) x1

Hardware: (9)
The Personal Touch (Core) x3
Dinosaurus (Cyber Exodus) x3
Rabbit Hole (Core) x3

Program: (9)
Mimic (Core) x2
Yog.0 (Core) x2
Morning Star (What Lies Ahead) x1
Snowball (Trace Amount) x1
Magnum Opus (Core) x3

Resource: (3)
The Helpful AI (What Lies Ahead) x3

Influence Values Totals -
Anarch: 9
Criminal: 6
Shaper: 56



It is fairly self-explanatory - your full rig consists of Yog, Mimic, and Morningstar (or snowball), one of which will be on our Dino, and Magnum opus. Test run to tutor for breakers without needing to spend influence on special order. Use Personal Touches, Dinosaurus, and Helpful Ai for bumping appropriate icebreakers, and Emergency shutdown on anything still out of reach strength-wise.

A single stimhack because I had 1 card and 1 influence left, and it will be useful if things get to the endgame.

Thoughts?
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Robert Robinson
United States
Maine
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Saan wrote:


wow
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Mad Scientist Philip von Doomula
United States
Orono
ME
flag msg tools
"I'm a leaf on the wind. Watch how I soar."
badge
I got in everyone's hostile little face. Yes, these are wooden cubes from boardgaming. Yes, I'm comfortable with that. I am enlightened.
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
You have 6 Dinosaurus. whistle

ninja
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
David Boeren
United States
Marietta
Georgia
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Saan wrote:
A very efficient method of dealing with low-strength ice is fixed strength breakers and ways to pump them.
A very efficient method of dealing with high-strength ice is Emergency Shutdown.


Emergency Shutdown requires you to get into HQ. So what if that's where the high-strength ice is? You can use the 1xStimhack for that, but if after testing that proves insufficient maybe add in some other aids.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
David Jackman
United States
Indianapolis
Indiana
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Quarashi wrote:
You have 6 Dinosaurus. :whistle:

:ninja:


They are so cute I doubt my opponent would mind, haha.

(EDIT: -3 dinos, +3 rabbit hole)
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
David Jackman
United States
Indianapolis
Indiana
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
dboeren wrote:
Saan wrote:
A very efficient method of dealing with low-strength ice is fixed strength breakers and ways to pump them.
A very efficient method of dealing with high-strength ice is Emergency Shutdown.


Emergency Shutdown requires you to get into HQ. So what if that's where the high-strength ice is? You can use the 1xStimhack for that, but if after testing that proves insufficient maybe add in some other aids.


Well, if their high strength ice is on HQ, dont run HQ. :P You dont need to de-rez it if you dont want to run their hand, since that is all it is protecting.

That said, there are other options when push comes to shove - You can get even a Mimic up to fairly high strength by using Personal Touch, Dinosaurus, and Helpful AI.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Martin Presley
United States
California
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Stimhack is actually useless late-game because your plan is to run all fixed-strength breakers, which Stimhack won't help. Magnum Opus won't help as much as you'd think either, because its robust, long-term economy doesn't help the efficient, money-light Anarch suite.

If I was devoted to running Morningstar, Mimic, and Yog.0 in a Shaper deck, I'd stick with Kate, using an Aesop-centered economy rather than Magnum Opus, and try to find a way to squeeze in Datasuckers. Just an alternative to think about.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Chris H
msg tools
mb
I built something very much like this, but dropped the Shutdowns for Special Orders and dropped my ice count to 1 for each. Originally I had Helpful AIs, but dropped them for Public Symphony (not sure on this card yet).

As for ice, I have datasucker and femme fatal instead of snowball.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Steven Tu
South Africa
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
shazzner wrote:
I built something very much like this, but dropped the Shutdowns for Special Orders and dropped my ice count to 1 for each. Originally I had Helpful AIs, but dropped them for Public Symphony (not sure on this card yet).

As for ice, I have datasucker and femme fatal instead of snowball.


Why, oh why do people still call Icebreakers Ice? Was it a leftover from Original Netrunner? (genuine question, not being factitious)
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Thomas R
United States
New York
flag msg tools
Avatar
Tuism wrote:
shazzner wrote:
I built something very much like this, but dropped the Shutdowns for Special Orders and dropped my ice count to 1 for each. Originally I had Helpful AIs, but dropped them for Public Symphony (not sure on this card yet).

As for ice, I have datasucker and femme fatal instead of snowball.


Why, oh why do people still call Icebreakers Ice? Was it a leftover from Original Netrunner? (genuine question, not being factitious)


Not a holdover from the original game, no. But it is possibly a valid linguistic artifact. Saying "As for ice" while meaning "As for dealing with ice" a valid, if ambiguous, English short-hand. I can't say that's what everyone means when they say it, but it's at least possible.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Daryl McLaurine
United States
Chicago
Illinois
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
anathomical wrote:
Tuism wrote:
shazzner wrote:
I built something very much like this, but dropped the Shutdowns for Special Orders and dropped my ice count to 1 for each. Originally I had Helpful AIs, but dropped them for Public Symphony (not sure on this card yet).

As for ice, I have datasucker and femme fatal instead of snowball.


Why, oh why do people still call Icebreakers Ice? Was it a leftover from Original Netrunner? (genuine question, not being factitious)


Not a holdover from the original game, no. But it is possibly a valid linguistic artifact. Saying "As for ice" while meaning "As for dealing with ice" a valid, if ambiguous, English short-hand. I can't say that's what everyone means when they say it, but it's at least possible.


...shake

It's "I.C.E." From Gibson's 'Neuromancer', and the entire Cyberpunk genre.

Intrusion Counter Electronics. The Black Ice were countermeasures that (illegally) caused some sort of harm to the user (Since, technically, it was impossible to, since everything was in some sort of UI, but then again, serious 'Cowboys' ran direct brain interface UI's, which was also illegal, giving the person the ability to make their runs at the speed of thought...well...technically...sound, since it still had to deal with body limitations, the illegal bit being that this allowed for counterhacks, thus, 'Black Ice'.) and Icebreakers, systems that countered Black Ice, were in themselves, I.C.E. systems. So, 'Ice' is correct linguistic shorthand.

Take that, Steampunkers. whistlelaugh
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Steven Tu
South Africa
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Black Omega wrote:
anathomical wrote:
Tuism wrote:
shazzner wrote:
I built something very much like this, but dropped the Shutdowns for Special Orders and dropped my ice count to 1 for each. Originally I had Helpful AIs, but dropped them for Public Symphony (not sure on this card yet).

As for ice, I have datasucker and femme fatal instead of snowball.


Why, oh why do people still call Icebreakers Ice? Was it a leftover from Original Netrunner? (genuine question, not being factitious)


Not a holdover from the original game, no. But it is possibly a valid linguistic artifact. Saying "As for ice" while meaning "As for dealing with ice" a valid, if ambiguous, English short-hand. I can't say that's what everyone means when they say it, but it's at least possible.


...shake

It's "I.C.E." From Gibson's 'Neuromancer', and the entire Cyberpunk genre.

Intrusion Counter Electronics. The Black Ice were countermeasures that (illegally) caused some sort of harm to the user (Since, technically, it was impossible to, since everything was in some sort of UI, but then again, serious 'Cowboys' ran direct brain interface UI's, which was also illegal, giving the person the ability to make their runs at the speed of thought...well...technically...sound, since it still had to deal with body limitations, the illegal bit being that this allowed for counterhacks, thus, 'Black Ice'.) and Icebreakers, systems that countered Black Ice, were in themselves, I.C.E. systems. So, 'Ice' is correct linguistic shorthand.

Take that, Steampunkers. whistlelaugh


Thanks for the definition of ICE

But he was referring to saying "as for ice" being a shorthand for "as for dealing with ice"

Interesting historical context though
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Ony Moose
United Kingdom
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
ICE stands for "insidious cortical electrocution." Don't believe the corporate lies!
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Daryl McLaurine
United States
Chicago
Illinois
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Tuism wrote:

But he was referring to saying "as for ice" being a shorthand for "as for dealing with ice"

Interesting historical context though


Yes, I got that.

The statement applies. Icebreakers are still "I.C.E.". Ice.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Aaron Blumenthal
United States
Seattle
Washington
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
anathomical wrote:
Tuism wrote:
shazzner wrote:
I built something very much like this, but dropped the Shutdowns for Special Orders and dropped my ice count to 1 for each. Originally I had Helpful AIs, but dropped them for Public Symphony (not sure on this card yet).

As for ice, I have datasucker and femme fatal instead of snowball.


Why, oh why do people still call Icebreakers Ice? Was it a leftover from Original Netrunner? (genuine question, not being factitious)


Not a holdover from the original game, no. But it is possibly a valid linguistic artifact. Saying "As for ice" while meaning "As for dealing with ice" a valid, if ambiguous, English short-hand. I can't say that's what everyone means when they say it, but it's at least possible.


While I like the idea, I can explain why I've caught myself making the same mistake. I typically think that ICE is the centerpoint of interaction in the game, and see icebreakers as the mirrored role for Runner. Corp = defend (with ICE) and advance, Runner = attack (with icebreakers) and steal. Why I focus on ICE first, and not icebreakers is beyond me. Maybe it's how short the word is, or...?

On the decks posted: I'm feeling ambivalent about Emergency Shutdown in this deck, because of the HQ-success constraint. I also don't think you need the Deisel, that deck is going to move fast on it's own.

One direction I've gone with CT is to have minimal tutor (test run), and stack icebreakers of all levels, paying for them between modded, Personal Workshop, and splashing Liberated. I'm forgoing Stimhack, but the combo with Workshop and Stimhack is pretty damn cool.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
MD Chis
United States
New York
flag msg tools
mb
hoobajoo wrote:
Stimhack is actually useless late-game because your plan is to run all fixed-strength breakers, which Stimhack won't help. Magnum Opus won't help as much as you'd think either, because its robust, long-term economy doesn't help the efficient, money-light Anarch suite.

If I was devoted to running Morningstar, Mimic, and Yog.0 in a Shaper deck, I'd stick with Kate, using an Aesop-centered economy rather than Magnum Opus, and try to find a way to squeeze in Datasuckers. Just an alternative to think about.


Totally agree with this. You're basically playing an Anarch deck. Have you considered playing this out of Whizzard instead?
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
David Jackman
United States
Indianapolis
Indiana
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
mdc273 wrote:
hoobajoo wrote:
Stimhack is actually useless late-game because your plan is to run all fixed-strength breakers, which Stimhack won't help. Magnum Opus won't help as much as you'd think either, because its robust, long-term economy doesn't help the efficient, money-light Anarch suite.

If I was devoted to running Morningstar, Mimic, and Yog.0 in a Shaper deck, I'd stick with Kate, using an Aesop-centered economy rather than Magnum Opus, and try to find a way to squeeze in Datasuckers. Just an alternative to think about.


Totally agree with this. You're basically playing an Anarch deck. Have you considered playing this out of Whizzard instead?


I have indeed.

Basically, the three things I wanted to combine in a deck was:

Fixed Strength Breakers
As many ways to pump breakers as possible
Emergency shutdown

Given these three, I found that Shaper was the way to go from an influence perspective. Anarch is a close second, but they dont have in-faction tutor for icebreakers, which is a problem.



That said, I think this should be a Kate deck, as others have mentioned.

EDIT:

-Chaos Theory
+Kate
-1 Stimhack
+3 Tinkering
+3 Public Sympathy.

Reasoning: As correctly pointed out, Stimhack is pointless, even for filler.

Tinkering can allow early rushes with a single breaker, allowing Yog to smash Wall of Static and Ice wall, or a single morning star to smash, well, anything.

Public Sympathy because there is no anti-damage cards in the deck, and this will allow me to run and draw with a big more impunity.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Andrew
United States
Seattle
Washington
flag msg tools
Anarch's use Wyldside and redundancy instead of tutors. It works just fine especially with 1xcrypsis for back-up tutoring off of Djinn.

Personal workshop would be nice, you can put personal touches on it and then wait to instal as needed. But, that does conflict with modded and Kate somewhat.

If you went back to Chaos Theory then you have an extra MU and could spend that last influence on a datasucker which would help a LOT.

No infiltration? That's pretty risky.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Mike Aubuchon
United States
State College
Pennsylvania
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
AnSteWe wrote:
Anarch's use Wyldside and redundancy instead of tutors. It works just fine especially with 1xcrypsis for back-up tutoring off of Djinn.


What's with all the absolutes lately? Special Order is still perfectly good in an Anarch deck if you have the room for it. Anything that makes your deck more consistent is good.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
David Jackman
United States
Indianapolis
Indiana
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
aubiewankenobi wrote:
AnSteWe wrote:
Anarch's use Wyldside and redundancy instead of tutors. It works just fine especially with 1xcrypsis for back-up tutoring off of Djinn.


What's with all the absolutes lately? Special Order is still perfectly good in an Anarch deck if you have the room for it. Anything that makes your deck more consistent is good.


Eh, there is an argument for not too much redundancy with icebreakers and tutors as well. After all, once your suite is set up, you want to avoid dead draws as much as possible.

" Anything that makes your deck more consistent is good." sounds an awful lot like an absolute. :)

As far as infiltration - you have Test Run to get back stuff after a nasty encounter with Archer or rototurret, and Public Sympathy to make sure you dont die to a 3 counter junebug.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Mike Aubuchon
United States
State College
Pennsylvania
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
I did say "good", not "the best" or "important" or even "necessary". angry
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Martin Presley
United States
California
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
aubiewankenobi wrote:
AnSteWe wrote:
Anarch's use Wyldside and redundancy instead of tutors. It works just fine especially with 1xcrypsis for back-up tutoring off of Djinn.


What's with all the absolutes lately? Special Order is still perfectly good in an Anarch deck if you have the room for it. Anything that makes your deck more consistent is good.


When more consistency comes at the cost of flexibility, that can sometimes be very bad, depending on how much you give up and what your deck's overall plan is. However saying that Anarchs use Wyldside instead of tutors isn't wrong, since when you look at their card set, you can see that tutors have a comparatively small effect on the speed of rig-building. Add to this the fact that Special Order will take an extra click and credit, plus all the great tools Anarchs have to run without all their breakers, and you can see how it doesn't make sense to put this in their decks.

aubiewankenobi wrote:
I did say "good", not "the best" or "important" or even "necessary". angry


Yes, but you did say 'anything'.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Mike Aubuchon
United States
State College
Pennsylvania
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
It didn't occur to me that I might not have been clear; when I suggested that consistency is good, I meant to imply that since the goal of the game is to win, cards that make you win more often are good. I'm sorry I didn't spell that out.

On the other point, I've played an anarch deck since the game came out. I've always had special orders in it. They've always been good. You can be sarcastic and dismissive until the heat death of the universe, but it won't make you any more right.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
David Jackman
United States
Indianapolis
Indiana
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
aubiewankenobi wrote:
It didn't occur to me that I might not have been clear; when I suggested that consistency is good, I meant to imply that since the goal of the game is to win, cards that make you win more often are good. I'm sorry I didn't spell that out.

On the other point, I've played an anarch deck since the game came out. I've always had special orders in it. They've always been good. You can be sarcastic and dismissive until the heat death of the universe, but it won't make you any more right.


I think the point being made here is more along the lines of 'Anarch doesnt require Special Order', rather than 'Anarchs using special order are idiots'.

Running special order is fine, but Im sure you can also see that running lots of draw via wyldside and early game aggression before icebreakers also fits into the anarch skillset.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Martin Presley
United States
California
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
aubiewankenobi wrote:
It didn't occur to me that I might not have been clear; when I suggested that consistency is good, I meant to imply that since the goal of the game is to win, cards that make you win more often are good. I'm sorry I didn't spell that out.


So you were saying something so simplistic, broad, and reductionist as to be tautological. My bad, keep up the good work, Madden.

aubiewankenobi wrote:
On the other point, I've played an anarch deck since the game came out. I've always had special orders in it. They've always been good. You can be sarcastic and dismissive until the heat death of the universe, but it won't make you any more right.


Are you. . . . wait for it. . . . absolutely sure about that?
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
1 , 2  Next »   | 
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.