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A Few Acres of Snow» Forums » Variants

Subject: Here is my attempt to stem the HH rss

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cliff curtis
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I purchased the second edition of this game a few weeks ago and have never played 1st ed. It took me about 5 games to figure out the HH and i did not even know that that was what is was called or that it even existed at the time. Once I did, I was very sad.

The game is really broken. How could this game have ever have been test played? How could these "test players" not see the overwhelming british military advantage anfd the thin deck strategy? Anyway i guess that point is mute now.

I have combed these forums over the last few days and have seen alot of great ideas that people have thought about. I sat down myself and thought a lot and came up with a mabey simple fix. It may not be historically acurate, but i say bullox to historical accuracy if the game is so far tilted to one side that the game is not worth playing.

How about Removing 2 brit regs, and making the indians capable of fightting? Also, only one use of the home support per turn (this would stop abuse by the french) I feel that this would make recruiting indians more important and make preist and indian leaders more valuable.In turn, this would force both sides to build their decks more and oviod the ultra thin deck problem. The brits would still have the money advantage and the force pool would be approximatly even to generate a mor ebalanced game?

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Roger McKay
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When I got back into board gaming about 10 years ago, I was impressed by how well the Euro games were play tested. Rules worked extremely smoothly. It was a pleasure after seeing the mess that CCGs were.

Now, though, as the industry has gotten bigger, the standards seem to have declined. Both in rule testing and in printing and component quality.

It is sad to see, but not unexpected. The bigger an industry gets, the more people get into it solely as a means to make money. That means cutting costs, and that results in lower standards.
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Clyde W
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And yet this board game is currently rated 87th of all time...shake
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zollom
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A friend of mine and I were just discussing the impact of giving the Indians an attack power yesterday. The French player could acquire a lot while the Brit is building his forces. Then try to attack through the middle of the board if the Brit player fails to fortify NY. In a few games it could work. You'd have to draw the right cards but it's worth a shot.

My take on this conundrum we are having over the past 1 1/2 years is that many people have many different ideas of what the game should be. War game or Euro game? Historically accurate not historically accurate. Why have people collect points if you have an end game condition(which is where I'm at right now. Why not end the game and count up VP? That will force the Brit to think about something else besides overall victory through the HH) All the time making for an impossible solution if everyone argues over & over again.

My suggestion, play it the way you want and have fun. Don't even try to offer any suggestions because you'll always get slammed by others. So screw'm!

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Bill Eldard
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French steps:

1. Buy two Settlers cards a quickly as possible. This mean selling furs on the first turn if the hand is right, or in the second turn.

2. Put the Regular Infantry in reserve. Put the Trader in rserve after the Settlers cards have been bought.

3. Upgrade cubes to disks at every availability.

4. Continue to expand westward by playing combinations of locations that have already been upgraded. This adds points while getting the cards you need in your hand.

When the French run out of disks, count the French player should do okay even if he/she's lost Louisbourg.

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Beau Bocephus Blasterfire
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Do you think a minimum number of deck size would solve the problem? It seems to me the most obvious solution if the thin deck strategy couldn't be abused.
 
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Tom
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bbblasterfire wrote:
Do you think a minimum number of deck size would solve the problem? It seems to me the most obvious solution if the thin deck strategy couldn't be abused.
I had thought so too, but then I realized that you can just create the deck consisting of only money engine (3 cards for the British), other cards with ship symbol to use them as military units in siege, governor card and fill the rest of the deck with military units, so you can reach the set minimum number of cards.

Also, the thin deck strategy isn't really the issue: Tim showed that even with Limited Governor rule (no starting deck thinning) you can win 100% of games as the British, so the "normal deck" is broken too. You would need to throw cards like Bateaux and Trader into British starting deck and then disallow to governor any card from starting deck, limit reserve somehow and maybe then some balance could be reached.
 
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Beau Bocephus Blasterfire
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solkan1 wrote:
I had thought so too, but then I realized that you can just create the deck consisting of only money engine (3 cards for the British), other cards with ship symbol to use them as military units in siege, governor card and fill the rest of the deck with military units, so you can reach the set minimum number of cards.

Also, the thin deck strategy isn't really the issue: Tim showed that even with Limited Governor rule (no starting deck thinning) you can win 100% of games as the British, so the "normal deck" is broken too. You would need to throw cards like Bateaux and Trader into British starting deck and then disallow to governor any card from starting deck, limit reserve somehow and maybe then some balance could be reached.

What if you were required to maintain a certain amount of other cards which couldn't be discarded that could be used to clog up the engine sort of speak. I still believe that there has to be a solution for fixing the game.
 
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Clyde W
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The solution is most likely adding new content and/or altering the map.
 
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Beau Bocephus Blasterfire
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Any suggestions on how to alter the map to fix the problem or what specific content could be used to fix it?
 
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Clyde W
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No one is interested in that type of solution. Martin, a year and a half ago, tried to fix the game without altering or adding components and failed. He obviously doesn't want to alter or add.
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Tom
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bbblasterfire wrote:
What if you were required to maintain a certain amount of other cards which couldn't be discarded that could be used to clog up the engine sort of speak. I still believe that there has to be a solution for fixing the game.
Yes, this is more or less what I said in my last sentence about non governable Bateux and Trader (among other non governable cards) in the British starting deck.

There's also a simple variant to weaken HH: every time you start a naval siege, roll a die: 1-3 - you immediately lose the siege, 4-6 - everything goes normally. The game is balanced then but I guess that's not what most of people would accept. Without naval sieges, the game is actually very well balanced.
 
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Jon M
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The problem is not so much in how far to nerf the Brits but that the game without the HH is quite finely balanced.

So anything that boosts the French means the Brits have to go full on HH to try to win.

Likewise anything that nerfs the Brits too much and you hand it to the French and still require the HH for the Brits to be competetive.

It's like a Shakspearean tragedy, the seeds of the games downfall are in how it is put together. Any attempt to fix it is doomed to create a different one sided game.
 
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Tom
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Jon_1066 wrote:
It's like a Shakspearean tragedy, the seeds of the games downfall are in how it is put together. Any attempt to fix it is doomed to create a different one sided game.
Not necessarily. Remove the naval sieges from the game and it becomes finely balanced (when both HH and Pemaquid Piledriver are impossible). It removes the historical route of course, which is not desired, but stil the game is balanced then. To enable historical route find a way to introduce weakened naval sieges, so that they succeed in 50% of cases (currently 100% of the British naval sieges are succesful) and you have a nicely balanced game.
 
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Clyde W
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solkan1 wrote:
Jon_1066 wrote:
It's like a Shakspearean tragedy, the seeds of the games downfall are in how it is put together. Any attempt to fix it is doomed to create a different one sided game.
Not necessarily. Remove the naval sieges from the game and it becomes finely balanced (when both HH and Pemaquid Piledriver are impossible). It removes the historical route of course, which is not desired, but stil the game is balanced then. To enable historical route find a way to introduce weakened naval sieges, so that they succeed in 50% of cases (currently 100% of the British naval sieges are succesful) and you have a nicely balanced game.
Doesn't the game become a "who can get lucky with draws to settle out northwest" then? I mean, it's it really a war game then at that point.
 
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Tom
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clydeiii wrote:
Doesn't the game become a "who can get lucky with draws to settle out northwest" then? I mean, it's it really a war game then at that point.
I find the game still competitive then, there are still raids and the possibility of inland sieges. The luck of draw may decide the game with equally good opponents, but then the little points difference will tell how balanced the game was. But the better player will win most of games, I'm pretty sure of that.
Of course, adding weakened naval sieges would make it more of a war game and I think they should be present, just not as strong as with standard rules.
 
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Jari Kemppainen
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solkan1 wrote:
Of course, adding weakened naval sieges would make it more of a war game and I think they should be present, just not as strong as with standard rules.

What we had done with my son (14 years), is that we reduced the money collection value of all the British cards by one (one is still minimum)and removed one British regular infantry. After that I as French player, could resist the siege of Halifax or Port Royal.

An other story is that my son is not willing to play the game anymore. He was so dedicated to siege all the time.
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Beau Bocephus Blasterfire
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How has it affected the balance of the game when using other tactics? Is it possible that in an effort to gimp one tactic that the balance was ruined for other tactics?
 
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