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Subject: Cheating or good strategy? rss

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Mikey Lucas
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Keizer
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I got this game yesterday and played it yesterday with my wife and another couple. I used this method once, and only once because I didn't know how I felt about it. When it came to my turn, no one was paying attention so on my action I took four gold and then kept 3 district cards. Is that cheating? Just teasing I am better than that but I don't know by how much.

The situation was this; throughout the game I was low on district cards. Always having to take two as an action then only keeping one. So I either had one district card with some gold or would have no district cards because I built it along with 0 gold because I built something. I got sick of this after several turns. Finally I became the king! I couldn't get the architect for a long time and it still was not available when I was king, due to it being in the face up pile. So I took the magician. I then organized the remaining character cards in rank order from left to right, they went as follows 1,2,4,6. I memorized this order and passed it to next player. Now as everyone drew cards I knew exactly what card they drew. So the player that had the cards I wanted as the magician, I knew who she picked. Needless to say I took all of her cards and gave her 0 in return.

Morally I don't know if this is cheating or just clever strategy. I am hoping to get your opinions on this. I felt it really wasn't cheating but also not being fair by doing it or at least telling them about it. I understand that it does take from some of the fun of the game. Like I mentioned I only did it once out of two games. I had a lot of self control.

I also understand that it also matters on how they fan out the cards once they pick them up, left to right or right to left. I realized this afterwards but I got lucky they fanned them all out left to right because I did not pay attention to that.

Please post your thoughts.

Long live the queen!
 
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T. H.
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It's probably cheating. ;-)
But then, they could just shuffe the cards up when they receive them.

Anyway, for the Magician, it is not important to know who has which character, if I remember correctly. Only the Assassin and the Thief name a character they want to assassinate/rob. The Magician just names a player.
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Jerry Martin
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I would say it is cheating. The idea is that you are NOT supposed to know what they are picking. If you can infer it from game state then you are fine, but watching what they pick feels wrong to me as well.


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Sworddancer wrote:
It's probably cheating. ;-)
But then, they could just shuffe the cards up when they receive them.

Anyway, for the Magician, it is not important to know who has which character, if I remember correctly. Only the Assassin and the Thief name a character they want to assassinate/rob. The Magician just names a player.


Correct, the magician can pick any player to trade cards with, you don't need to know their character.
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Oliver Paul
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Sworddancer wrote:
It's probably cheating. ;-)
But then, they could just shuffe the cards up when they receive them.

Anyway, for the Magician, it is not important to know who has which character, if I remember correctly. Only the Assassin and the Thief name a character they want to assassinate/rob. The Magician just names a player.


Yeah, the magician can always take cards, he doesn't have to "guess" a character. He just points at someone and says "muhahaha"
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Tiamat
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Cheating AND good strategy.
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Matt Shinners
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That's cheating.
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David Me
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Actually, it's neither cheating nor good strategy. I save both terms for more actions that more closely meet their respective definitions.

But it is a lot more SPORTING to tell everyone at the beginning of the game to shuffle their cards a tiny bit each time they get them.
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zombie homer
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Our assassin card has a scratch mark that one of us noticed. He quickly highlighted that the card is compromised and we opaque-sleeved the cards.

Had he not admitted, and started to win more games than before, will you call him a cheat?

Part of the fun is deduction. So I'm gonna vote your move as cheating.
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David Me
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Yep, using a mark on a card to help would be much closer to cheating.
 
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Steve
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Organizing the remaining character cards in rank order from left to right is stacking a 'deck' to your advantage. You cheated. If you had memorized the cards as they stood before passing them then you could argue that you didn't cheat.
 
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Sight Reader
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pogimike wrote:
Morally I don't know if this is cheating or just clever strategy.

To some extent, the "code of conduct" depends on the expectations of other players. Is this a ruthless, in-your-face, no-holds-barred "blood" game or a casual, relaxing, friendly social experience? Did you make it clear what kind of game it was in advance?


In friendly games, victory is only one of many priorities. In addition to game rules, your behavior is ethically limited by social objectives as well. Thus, if everyone is there for a rollicking, roll-on-the-floor, laugh-till-your-ribs hurt party, then angrily shutting everyone up so you can do 20 minutes of analysis-paralysis would be insensitive to the social goal.

In ruthless "blood" games, the one and only priority is victory: any other enjoyment is secondary. Opponents are expected and assumed to be doing anything possible to win within the confines of the rules and the rules only. If this was the kind of game you were playing, then any fault for your actions lies with the other players for not adequately protecting the secrecy of their selections.

If the emphasis for your opponents was to relax or build relationships instead, then your technique may have violated rules more important than those found in the rulebook. To avoid these questions, I would make sure everyone knows where game expectations lie on the axis from competitive to casual. Otherwise, you risk a game where some play by social rules that others intend to ignore.
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fer moros
South Korea
Kwang-Ju
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man,

Despite of the fact that others pointed out:
Magician picks whoever wants to pick on direct visual,
interesting how you found this, don't you think? or may be the others were cheating on you by not telling you?... what a table!

... thanks for the tip, this -pseudocheating- can be applied to assassin or thief. And not that I want to use it... but I guess that certain people in my group.. have been using this trick.. angry


Thanks and happy games!
Fer
PS. and I nearly fall on your opening, funny.
 
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Sight Reader
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Where did the OP go, by the way? I didn't read it carefully: I assumed he was card counting the Assassin or Thief, lol.

It would be amusing if there was a power that gets triggered if you could successfully "accuse" a player or two of taking a certain roles. Maybe that would be a fun variant for guys like Assassins or Thiefs?
 
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