Recommend
 
 Thumb up
 Hide
16 Posts

Merchant of Venus (second edition)» Forums » Rules

Subject: Movement rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
Rosen Kazakov
msg tools
From what i understand from reading the rules ,if you arent on a spaceport/planet , movement is mandatory and you MUST spend all your movement points. That doesnt make any sense to me .

First of all , if i dont want to , why i must move my ship ? Thematicly doesnt makse sense, why can my pilot just stops for a rest, chilling in that endless space ?

And second , why I MUST spend all my movement points ? If have rolled for example 12 total movement speed, and i want to use just 6 and stop , why shouldnt i do that ? Thematicly , again it doesnt makse sense . My pilot decides why flying he wants to stop and take a short brake , why wouldnt he be allowed to do that ?




Anyways , thanks for your input.Its a great game and i really like it.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Roger Rigby
United States
Spring Hope
North Carolina
flag msg tools
designer
Designer & Inventor Emeritus
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Why must I drive 55mph? Because that is the rule that has been mutually agreed upon. Anything faster and you are cheating.
4 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Stephen Allen
Australia
TERALBA
NSW
flag msg tools
The space left intentionally blank
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
So you're an expert on space travel now? Stopping in space is equally as hard as going. It's not like driving a car.

As most of the galaxy is unexplored, I imagine the game is set in a time when space travel is still difficult and plotting a safe course to where you want to go is also difficult, unless you have the assistance of a space port to pull you in.
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Manary Corte
Brazil
São Paulo
São Paulo
flag msg tools
Best game of all time...
badge
...Twilight Imperium 3!
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Don't forget that you can always take a break by stopping on an asteroid.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Ron
Austria
Vienna
flag msg tools
“It's all in the mind.” ― George Harrison
badge
Devoted Follower of the Most Holy Church of the Evil Bob. Possessed and down the road to become chaotic, evil & naughty. All hail the Evil Bob and his Stargate.
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
My favorite explanation:

If fuel for a spaceship is as expensive as fuel for my car, I'd think twice before firing those retrorockets just to make a lunch break mid-space meeple
4 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Box of Delights
United Kingdom
flag msg tools
designer
Visit me at www.boxofdelights.net
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I think your question is the same as the inverse question, "why can't I move more spaces than I roll" - thematically, as per your question, it is the same question.. why must my pilot stop and not choose to keep going. The answer is the same for both.. it is to simulate the lack of control you have over your ship, and the only way to get more control is to upgrade your ship use use nav dice. Maybe I stretched it a little bit, but I think the idea is that you can overshoot a nav point as easily as undershoot (although overshooting is less likely when you CAN actually stop - not use all your dice movement - once you reach your destination).
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Rosen Kazakov
msg tools
ricky2002 wrote:
I think your question is the same as the inverse question, "why can't I move more spaces than I roll" - thematically, as per your question, it is the same question.. why must my pilot stop and not choose to keep going. The answer is the same for both.. it is to simulate the lack of control you have over your ship, and the only way to get more control is to upgrade your ship use use nav dice. Maybe I stretched it a little bit, but I think the idea is that you can overshoot a nav point as easily as undershoot (although overshooting is less likely when you CAN actually stop - not use all your dice movement - once you reach your destination).



Sorry dude, what you are saying doesnt make ANY sense whatsoever. Its quite obvious for any game why u cannnot move MORE spaces than those allowed by your dice roll or game rules/ mechanics - you would move greater distance than your opponents for a start , giving you an unfair advantage , and because it would unbalance the game mechanics if everyone would move as far as he wants to .

Not wanting to spend your entire allowed movement is something entirely different and it is allowed in EVERY board game that involves rolling dice for movement ( and also in those that doesnt involve dice - in all those games rules says "move UP to "X " spaces ). Not using your full movement should be something completely natural , you shouldnt be forced to do it.

After playing some games with the official movement restrictions . me and my group are already playing with house rule that you are allowed not to spend all whole movement points , and the game is played just fine , its not less balanced or anything in any way.


 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Aaron Bredon
United States
Sunnyvale
California
flag msg tools
badge
mbmbmbmbmb
Saifur wrote:
[q="ricky2002"]
Not wanting to spend your entire allowed movement is something entirely different and it is allowed in EVERY board game that involves rolling dice for movement ( and also in those that doesnt involve dice - in all those games rules says "move UP to "X " spaces ). Not using your full movement should be something completely natural , you shouldnt be forced to do it.


No, it is not allowed in EVERY board game that involves rolling dice. It is specifically not allowed in Monopoly, Snakes & Ladders, Talisman, and MOST other board games that involve rolling dice. The general rule for dice-based board games is that you must move EXACTLY what you roll unless something allows you to stop.
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Scott Lewis
United States
Thornton
Colorado
flag msg tools
NFHS Football & Basketball
badge
Dread Our Coming, Suffer Our Presence, Embrace Our Glory (Solonavi War Cry)
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Saifur wrote:
Not wanting to spend your entire allowed movement is something entirely different and it is allowed in EVERY board game that involves rolling dice for movement ( and also in those that doesnt involve dice - in all those games rules says "move UP to "X " spaces ). Not using your full movement should be something completely natural , you shouldnt be forced to do it.

I can't think of any roll-and-move games right off the top of my head where you aren't forced to move your full distance (except in cases where you move over certain squares that force you to stop, or spaces that have special "you are allowed to stop here" exceptions).

Maybe you know of some that I've overlooked? As the post above me states, most such games I know of do NOT allow you to move less than what you rolled. If Monopoly did this, for example, Monopoly would be an even worse game than it is, nobody would ever choose to land on someone else's property.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Rosen Kazakov
msg tools
Monopoly ? Are you for real ? LOL , omfg , we are talking about serious board games here , not games for kids , sorry. Now lets see :

1.Descent - Journey to the Darkness , with 5 expansions - you can move you hero as many spaces as you want , within the limit of maximum allowed movement for each specific hero. You may not move at all if you want to.

2.Spartacus the board game - you may move you gladiator during the arena phase as manany spaces as you want , within the limit of maximum allowed movement for each specific gladiator. You may not move at all if you want to.

3. Rex - Fall of an empire - you may move your units UP to 2 spaces , or four if you control spaceport. You may not move at all if you want to.


4. Arkham Horror - you investigators may be moved to any location as long it is within their character sheet allowed maximum movement. You may move to 1 , or 2 or 3 sections of the board. You may not move at all if you want to.


5.Letters from Whitechapel - Investigators have maximum of 2 movement spaces , on the black squares on the map , but they may move only one if they want to , or not move at all.



6.Middle - Earth quest - you may move as many spaces as you want as long as you have cards to discard. You may not move at all if you want to.


7. War of the ring - using dice with "banner " symbol , you may move up to two armies one space each , or one army two spaces. You may not move at all if you want to.



Want me to give you 20 or 50 more examples ? Anyways , everybody is entitled to his own opinion , for me , its thematicly wrong to force the player in mandatory movement or spending his whole movement points if he doesnt want to . I will keep playing with this house rule.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Manary Corte
Brazil
São Paulo
São Paulo
flag msg tools
Best game of all time...
badge
...Twilight Imperium 3!
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Saifur wrote:
Monopoly ? Are you for real ? LOL , omfg , we are talking about serious board games here , not games for kids , sorry. Now lets see :

1.Descent - Journey to the Darkness , with 5 expansions - you can move you hero as many spaces as you want , within the limit of maximum allowed movement for each specific hero. You may not move at all if you want to.

2.Spartacus the board game - you may move you gladiator during the arena phase as manany spaces as you want , within the limit of maximum allowed movement for each specific gladiator. You may not move at all if you want to.

3. Rex - Fall of an empire - you may move your units UP to 2 spaces , or four if you control spaceport. You may not move at all if you want to.


4. Arkham Horror - you investigators may be moved to any location as long it is within their character sheet allowed maximum movement. You may move to 1 , or 2 or 3 sections of the board. You may not move at all if you want to.


5.Letters from Whitechapel - Investigators have maximum of 2 movement spaces , on the black squares on the map , but they may move only one if they want to , or not move at all.



6.Middle - Earth quest - you may move as many spaces as you want as long as you have cards to discard. You may not move at all if you want to.


7. War of the ring - using dice with "banner " symbol , you may move up to two armies one space each , or one army two spaces. You may not move at all if you want to.



Want me to give you 20 or 50 more examples ? Anyways , everybody is entitled to his own opinion , for me , its thematicly wrong to force the player in mandatory movement or spending his whole movement points if he doesnt want to . I will keep playing with this house rule.


Apart from Letters of Whitechapel, Middle-Earth Quest and Rex, which I don't know, the examples you gave can't be appied to Merchant of Venus IMHO, because in none of these games you actually roll for movement.

In these games you have a fixed amout of movement points you can spend or not. Forcing players to move the exact amount they have would break the game, as they would never be able to choose what to do.

This is not Merchant of Venus's case, as you can always stop on planets, on spaceports and on asteroids, and you can stop even when continuing to move would mean backtracking.
4 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Scott Lewis
United States
Thornton
Colorado
flag msg tools
NFHS Football & Basketball
badge
Dread Our Coming, Suffer Our Presence, Embrace Our Glory (Solonavi War Cry)
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
None of those examples you provided are roll-and-move games. MoV is a roll-and-move game.

Can you find some examples of games where your movement is determined by a number on a die where you can choose to go less than the amount you rolled? Games with fixed movement points are a different type of movement mechanism.

Runebound could probably count, although in Runebound you aren't rolling "numbers", so I'm not sure it's the same thing.
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Aaron Bredon
United States
Sunnyvale
California
flag msg tools
badge
mbmbmbmbmb
Saifur wrote:
Monopoly ? Are you for real ? LOL , omfg , we are talking about serious board games here , not games for kids , sorry. Now lets see :


Monopoly (played by the rules, not as kids play) is a serious, cutthroat economic game, even if it is somewhat dated.

Here are some other examples - pachisi, Formula D, Backgammon. There are countless others.

In general, in roll-and-move games when you have paths to follow, you must move the full distance you rolled unless something allows you to stop.

Saifur wrote:


1.Descent - Journey to the Darkness , with 5 expansions - you can move you hero as many spaces as you want , within the limit of maximum allowed movement for each specific hero. You may not move at all if you want to.

2.Spartacus the board game - you may move you gladiator during the arena phase as manany spaces as you want , within the limit of maximum allowed movement for each specific gladiator. You may not move at all if you want to.

3. Rex - Fall of an empire - you may move your units UP to 2 spaces , or four if you control spaceport. You may not move at all if you want to.

4. Arkham Horror - you investigators may be moved to any location as long it is within their character sheet allowed maximum movement. You may move to 1 , or 2 or 3 sections of the board. You may not move at all if you want to.

5.Letters from Whitechapel - Investigators have maximum of 2 movement spaces , on the black squares on the map , but they may move only one if they want to , or not move at all.

6.Middle - Earth quest - you may move as many spaces as you want as long as you have cards to discard. You may not move at all if you want to.


None of the above apply, as they do NOT use dice for movement - they are not roll-and-move games.

Saifur wrote:


7. War of the ring - using dice with "banner " symbol , you may move up to two armies one space each , or one army two spaces. You may not move at all if you want to.


This also does not apply - the dice tell you whether to move, not how much to move.

Saifur wrote:

Want me to give you 20 or 50 more examples ? Anyways , everybody is entitled to his own opinion , for me , its thematicly wrong to force the player in mandatory movement or spending his whole movement points if he doesnt want to . I will keep playing with this house rule.


If you want to give examples, make them relevant - they must be games where you roll dice each turn to tell you how many to move, and your movement is limited by the dice.
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
David Bancroft
United States
Elk Grove
California
flag msg tools
badge
Durp
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
It's the mechanic of the unknown. You never truly know where you will end up in space. I think that's what the designer wanted otherwise it's to predictable. A little random in your games is fun I think. I like it and I think it fits the theme.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
David Tolin
United States
Beaumont
Texas
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Saifur wrote:
ricky2002 wrote:
I think your question is the same as the inverse question, "why can't I move more spaces than I roll" - thematically, as per your question, it is the same question.. why must my pilot stop and not choose to keep going. The answer is the same for both.. it is to simulate the lack of control you have over your ship, and the only way to get more control is to upgrade your ship use use nav dice. Maybe I stretched it a little bit, but I think the idea is that you can overshoot a nav point as easily as undershoot (although overshooting is less likely when you CAN actually stop - not use all your dice movement - once you reach your destination).



Sorry dude, what you are saying doesnt make ANY sense whatsoever. Its quite obvious for any game why u cannnot move MORE spaces than those allowed by your dice roll or game rules/ mechanics - you would move greater distance than your opponents for a start , giving you an unfair advantage , and because it would unbalance the game mechanics if everyone would move as far as he wants to .


You've completely missed his point. He was suggesting that--thematically--it's the same question (not mechanically). You asked why, thematically, you couldn't just stop in space rather than using your whole movement. He pointed out that, thematically, that's the same question as 'why can't I just move as far as I want?' In both cases, the answer is because it's the rules of the game. In neither case is it necessarily thematically accurate.

On another note, if you've really house-ruled it in your group to allow ships to stop at less than full movement, that's completely your prerogative. Just be aware that you've stripped a significant gameplay mechanic out of the game. Making it far easier on the players. I'm also not sure how you're dealing with Navigation spaces, using this variant. I suppose you just end your movement if you don't like the direction you've rolled? Kinda makes it sound like a stoopid-baby-game, such as Monopoly. ninja
5 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Arthur Peterson
United States
Cane Ridge
TN
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
One word: inertia.
6 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.