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Outcasts (fan expansion for BattleCON)» Forums » General

Subject: Outcasts Accelerator Program rss

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Jessey
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Hello World!

In the interest of seeing some of these things released sooner than later I am going to use this thread to "pre-release" files and receive feedback on nearly done characters. Subscribe if you're interested in helping out (or just want sneak peaks!). The files in this thread are not official, or final (when they go up on BGG then they are "done" - of course, I am always ready to revise and update released characters if balance or wording problems crop up)

I have Shihai Desuka almost ready and would like to offer the file to anyone willing to try her out (baseline testing is done and some specific matches have been tested thoroughly).

She's one of the more volatile designs and so has been quite tedious to balance. You'll understand when you see her... let me put it this way, her Unique Ability is called "Option Select" and it's inspired by the video game "feature" of the same name.

The file is linked to my dropbox below, and below that is a list of match-ups I am interested in specifically (although, any feedback based on actually having played her is appreciated. While theory-crafting is fine, we're beyond that level of feedback. What is needed is testing). Of course, spelling and wording adjustments are always welcome suggestions.

An Scath Siorai (testing targets)
- Demitras
- Rukyuk
- Lixis
- Queen's Revenge (Finisher)

Vlastia Vozduk

War Zone Arena Board (testing targets)
- FUN!

The war zone is an arena that requires its own special board. Battle against your opponent in the middle of a pitched battle! You are in the prime target zone for the artillery and must account for where the stones will land.

Print out the board. You will also need a cube or some other marker to track the artillery target location. Place that cube on the middle box of the top row of the track that is below the spaces.

At the Start of Beat, before resolving player actions, move the marker along the track a number of spaces equal to the total of the Priority of all players (so if player 1 has Priority 4 and player 2 has Priority 2 then you move the marker 6 spaces). When you move the marker follow the arrows. The space that lines up with the position of the marker will be impacted by a catapult stone at the end of the turn.

At the End of Beat any player in the space indicated by the Artillery Marker takes 2 damage and any player in a space adjacent to that space loses 1 life.
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Yannick Carriere
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Hi Jessey,

Thank you for giving an advance peak and opportunity to playtest her. The artwork is awesome and her UA is simple and clean, although less so to master.

I'm busy playtesting Brad's Devastation characters for the moment. I believe he said that the end of April is his cutoff date. So I'm priorizing Devastation. In May I will be able to playtest your character(s). Best of luck.

By the way, what/who is Soul Channelling?
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Jessey
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Bolga wrote:
By the way, what/who is Soul Channelling?


Soul Channeling is her second overdrive finisher.
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Sascha Parsa
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Is it intended that "Forbidden" isn't a direct movement? So far all movements that specified a target space to move to were direct movements. It prevents weird scenarios where you can't actually move into the space you designated (Lixis' Lance/Paradigm of Haste/Seth's Mimic). And the War and Devastation rules don't cover those scenarios so far.

About Soul Channeling: Both effects only work if you managed to hit the opponent with Soul Strike earlier. There are scenarios where you don't want to replace your UB with the opponent's one (i.e. Seth). Is this all as intended?

About Illegal: Is it intended to switch the cards in discard 1 with the cards in discard 2 OR do I switch the cards in the discard with two arbitrary attack pairs from my hand OR do I take my discard (discard 1 and 2) into my hand and chose new discards 1 and 2 from my hand?
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Jessey
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Phyr wrote:
Is it intended that "Forbidden" isn't a direct movement? So far all movements that specified a target space to move to were direct movements. It prevents weird scenarios where you can't actually move into the space you designated (Lixis' Lance/Paradigm of Haste/Seth's Mimic). And the War and Devastation rules don't cover those scenarios so far.


I'm not sure I understand the concern. However, if there is a way to word it that is more consistent with rules and the devastation wording template then please suggest something. I think the way I've worded it the intent is clear, but that's a different issue when it comes to rules text.

Quote:
About Soul Channeling: Both effects only work if you managed to hit the opponent with Soul Strike earlier. There are scenarios where you don't want to replace your UB with the opponent's one (i.e. Seth). Is this all as intended?


The second effect always triggers, Soul Strike hit or not. I put it in its own paragraph to try and convey that, maybe I need to have it also occur first. It was intended as a consolation in case you never landed Soul Strike.

Soul Channeling was, unlike most secondary ODFs, intended to be something really weird and fun. It really isn't made for all possible matchups (as you noted, Seth), but can be a really killer move in others (Cadenza). It also, sometimes, has the effect of making your opponent more scared of Soul Strike because of your ODF, and mind games are fun.

Quote:
About Illegal: Is it intended to switch the cards in discard 1 with the cards in discard 2 OR do I switch the cards in the discard with two arbitrary attack pairs from my hand OR do I take my discard (discard 1 and 2) into my hand and chose new discards 1 and 2 from my hand?


Switch the cards in Discard 1 with the cards in Discard 2. In the next draft, I'll use up some of that white space and write out the effect in more detail.
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Sascha Parsa
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Well, there is an easy fix for the wording of Soul Channeling (by putting the condition at the right place):
Choose an opponent: If you hit that opponent with Soul Strike this game, Soul Strike becomes a copy of that character's Unique Base of your choice until the end of the game.

Until the end of the game, whenever you deal damage to that opponent, gain 1 life.

Quote:
Switch the cards in Discard 1 with the cards in Discard 2. In the next draft, I'll use up some of that white space and write out the effect in more detail.
D'awww. I was kinda hoping for the last option.

For "Forbidden" the rule of thumb to get as close as possible to the designated space should work. Quite like the advance and retreat rules when it comes to blocked spaces.

Clashes still are resolved according to normal rules, I guess, by placing only one base face down upon the former one?
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Jessey
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Looking back at your comments, Forbiddon is "direct" movement (you go directly to the target space, not occupying any of the intervening space on the way). Do I then just need the word "directly" added in there?
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Sascha Parsa
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Yes. That is all that is needed. I just edited in another question into my former post while you posted.
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Jessey
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Yes, Shihai Clashes just like everyone else... Clashes are really strong against her (because they effectively nullify the advantage her Unique Ability grants her). Subsequently, Cherri's a royal pain
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Sascha Parsa
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You are right about Cherry, because she can force clashes regardless of the bases played. In general I'd say that clashes are a tool that Shihai can use to negate certain bases of the opponent. Seth vs Shihai is a most intriguing matchup as both can deny certain bases to the opponent, either by choosing the clashing base or Seth's UA.
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Sascha Parsa
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I just noticed something... Shihai's UA can be used to choose between two different Special Actions like Finish and Cancel. That's awesome and super strong.
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Jessey
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Phyr wrote:
I just noticed something... Shihai's UA can be used to choose between two different Special Actions like Finish and Cancel. That's awesome and super strong.


And now you can (clearly) see why she's been tedious to balance
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Jessey
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A PbF game here (and some games on my own) have been played against Seth and I am now confident she is a fair match for him. During the game however, concern was raised about her ability to perform against fast characters so Heketch/Demitras has been added to the list.
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Nate K
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I'll play as or against Shihai versus a fast character.

...Actually, I can mod such a game if you'll like to play, Jessey.
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Jessey
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I'm far too busy to play a PbF well. I'm happy modding, and happy to mod multiple games
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Nate K
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Fair enough. I'll play, then. I think I'd prefer to play as or against Heketch. I'm not much of a Demitras fan.
 
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Sascha Parsa
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I'd be up for another round.
But I don't think that Heketch is really that much of a problem. His priority is only slightly higher and it won't be that hard to force clashes or even win priority for Shihai. Demitras on the other hand can make clashing virtually impossible.

I have to slight preference to play Heketch in that matchup.
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Jessey
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I think Sascha's got it Nate, unfortunately Demitras will be a more effective stress test. So who will take up which mantle?

Also, a new - entirely not yet announced - character has been added to the Accelerator. I noticed I happened to have all the components made for her, so I've put it into a printable format and added An Scath Siorai above.
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Nate K
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Phyr wrote:
I'd be up for another round.
But I don't think that Heketch is really that much of a problem. His priority is only slightly higher and it won't be that hard to force clashes or even win priority for Shihai. Demitras on the other hand can make clashing virtually impossible.


That's possibly true. And Demitras has a low damage output with occasional huge bursts, which could be really bad for Shihai. Alright, we should probably go with him.

Do you want Shihai again, or do you want to try playing against her?
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Sascha Parsa
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Gonna first look into Demitras cards again. ^^
I'd prefer Demitras. Pressure is on you, Nate.
Well, is it actually? It's mine to lose.
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Nate K
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Sounds good. I'll wait to send in my starting discards until tonight, though. I'll want to review Demitras' options for opening moves.
 
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Sascha Parsa
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My plan is already set. ninja
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Jessey
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Made the thread in Outcasts this time: Demitras v Shihai
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Yannick Carriere
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Looking at her cards, I have a few comments:

Soul Channeling: I like Phyr's suggested modificated wording of the effect. It's clearer.

Soul Strike: I suggest the following modification to make it clearer: "The opponent's Unique Ability does not take effect during the next beat."

Forbidden: Add the word 'directly' after the word 'Move'.

Cheap: The On Hit effect should read: "You lose 1 Life." And the End of Beat effect should use the word 'opponent' instead of 'player'.

Taboo: The last sentence should read: "If you clash, you lose 1 Life."

Flawless: You can delete the word 'then' from the SoB effect.

Illegal: To make it even clearer: "Reveal: The cards in your Discard 1 and your Discard switch places."

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Jessey
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Awesome! Thanks (and double thanks for putting all the changes in one neat place that's easy for me to check against as I make them!)

Shihai will be getting some slight errata after we finish the (one sided) match against Demitras, so if you are planning on trying her out wait a bit (and try Siorai instead!)
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