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Le Havre: The Inland Port» Forums » Rules

Subject: Can You Throw Away Goods? rss

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Gillum the Stoor
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In the thread Intentional Overpay Allowed?, DaMilli asked "Am I allowed to intentionally pay more resources for buildings than I owe?"

davypi pointed out that you might want to do this because "Moving the cube two spaces left makes the kiln action less valuable if you are close to the edge of the warehouse."

Hanno answered that this was definitely allowed.

Here is a similar question: can you "throw" away goods by moving a goods counter left or down anytime you want?

For example, suppose that my wood token is in row 3, column 10 (call this position 3-10), so I have 13 wood (see illustration below). I can't use Wood Trader (which lets me move wood up), because one can't go up from 3-10. But if I threw away 1 wood, to take me to 3-9 (12 wood), I could use Wood Trader to pay 2 Francs and 4 food to move my wood counter up to 9-9 (18 wood). I threw away 1 wood to gain 6: a net of +5.

There are similar examples with many other buildings.

It seems that, if you can overpay, you should be able to throw away goods as well. But it would be good to get confirmation.

 
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Thomas Staudt
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Rutesheim
Baden-Württemberg
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I would guess no as the rules don't say anything about it.

The rules say that money overpaid is lost, so this is in there.

I would prefer if this was not possible, as part of the game is cleverly planning not to get into such situations.
It would be like having a rule saying "If you played badly, simply adjust the game state to your liking"

But also eagerly awaiting the official reply ...
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Marcelo Paschoalin
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Santo André
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I don't believe you can throw away goods, but I'm pretty sure you can overspend. That could be a way to throw away, but only during a situation you are forced to spend something.
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Gillum the Stoor
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ashman wrote:
I would prefer if this was not possible, as part of the game is cleverly planning not to get into such situations. It would be like having a rule saying "If you played badly, simply adjust the game state to your liking"

I don't think that it's quite like that, because I think that such an approach (as opposed to others) can be explained thematically.

I was basing my reasoning on the observation by JonBen in another thread:
Quote:
It's worth noting that the horizontal and vertical movements on the warehouse board are thematic. The horizontal movement is gaining/loosing a standard resource and the vertical movement is gaining/loosing an upgraded resource. In Le Have you would flip a wood over to get coal, here you push the wood marker up. It's pretty clever and really motivates the whole warehouse mechanic.

When you apply Kiln, for example, you paying a unit of "raw clay" (measured horizontally) for a unit of "brick" (measured vertically) - brick having three times the value of raw clay.

If your clay counter is at position 18-4, you have 6 units of brick (worth 3 each) and 4 units of raw clay. One of application of Kiln could convert to 7 units of brick (row 21) and 3 units of raw clay. But there is no 21-3 on the board. So you "overpay" by (or throw away) one unit of raw clay and end up at 21-2 (which is on the board).

For the Wood Trader, suppose you have 1 unit of boards (worth 3) and 10 units of logs (1 each), to be at 3-10. Wood Trader lets you pay a Franc and 2 food to get a unit of boards, i.e., to go to 6-10. But there is no 6-10 on the board. So you "overpay" with one unit of logs (what Wood Trader wouldn't be happy for a few logs in addition to his money and food!) to go up to 6-9. (I admit that this is a little more of a stretch than the Kiln example.)

Thus, the useful cases of "throwing away" - meaning going left or down - can be thought of as cases of "overpaying."

Not allowed would be a "throwing away" of moving down and to the right simultaneously. Even though this loses 2 units, it doesn't make sense thematically. It's not really throwing away or overpaying - it's converting bricks back to raw clay or boards back to logs.

Thus, I would not say that you can go from 6-0 to 3-1 (down and right) just so you can use Business Office to collect 5 Francs. The Business Office will give you 5 Francs for 1 unit of Boards and 1 unit of Logs together. If you have only Boards and no Logs (as implied by 6-0), there's no way that throwing away can get you Logs.
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Hanno Girke
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Schwabenheim an der Selz
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As you want an official ruling, here it is.
You can't tampe with your good by voluntarily moving it to a less valued position.
As written in other topics, you can consider moving UP as getting an improved good with the value of 3. But you can never get "change" on one of those goods if you pay with it.
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