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Reiner Knizia» Forums » General Creator Forum

Subject: Will Dr. Knizia ever create another world like Blue Moon? rss

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Mike DiLisio
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I've come to discover that I'm really attracted to games with an overarching pseudo-history involved. I've bought all of the Tempest games because I love the concept, and probably my favorite Knizia game of all is Blue Moon City (I also really enjoy the card game, but not to the same degree), which involves a relatively developed history. I'd actually love to read the Blue Moon book, but AFAIK it's only available in German.

My question is really right there in the subject line. Does anyone think Knizia will attempt another shared world type of game series? Also, does anyone know how much of the development of Blue Moon was initiated by Knizia, and how much (if any) came from requests by Fantasy Flight? I really can't overstate how much I enjoy Blue Moon City, and I think that some of that has to be because of the immersion factor due to the Blue Moon mythology (probably not the right word, but you get the idea).

I know that there are many here who have vocally proclaimed that Knizia is past his prime, not making gamer's games (not that BMC is particularly complex), selling out, etc., but I still think there's a lot left in the tank. Thoughts? Rants? Ramblings? All are welcome.
 
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Walt
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I may be wrong here, but I think the publisher created Blue Moon. I'm certain BMC was created because the publisher wanted to re-use the Blue Moon art; Dr. K has said so. So, it's up to publishers deciding such lavish art is profitable.
 
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Christopher Dearlove
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Tall_Walt wrote:
I may be wrong here, but I think the publisher created Blue Moon.


I think you're wrong there. I'm not a definitive source on this stage of development, but I'm reasonably sure. (I know various things have been credited to people in Reiner's circle, including the name Blue Moon - and more - to the late Favid Farquhar.)

Quote:
I'm certain BMC was created because the publisher wanted to re-use the Blue Moon art; Dr. K has said so.


I don't actually recall Reiner saying anything on the subject in public, though he may well have done. From what I saw (and I had a good view) Reiner and the publisher wanted a new game in that world. Who first raised it with the other I have no idea. Reusing the art I heard from Reiner, before the game (that became BMC) existed and ideas were being thrown around, but probably both thought it obvious. (Things that are obvious don't need to be said.) I know I've commented that reusing the art and the size of the box were about the first two decisions (after it being in the BM universe and before it was about BMC - though that came soon after).

Quote:
So, it's up to publishers deciding such lavish art is profitable.


Publishers are responsible for art. Designers create games that may or may not need much art. Professional designers produce designs where the art requirement (and hence cost) is consistent with the expected market. That sort of thing is what makes you more than just a designer of good games.
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Mike DiLisio
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I appreciate your thoughts Christopher, as I know you have at the very least a well-established play testing relationship with Knizia. It does appear increasingly likely that if he were to create another overarching world, it would likely be at the request of a publisher. Since my original post, Fantasy Flight repackaged Blue Moon into Legends, so they must have felt some viability in the concept. (Well perhaps that, and the ridiculous prices being commanded for the OOP game and expansion decks). It seems to me that what has changed for Dr. Knizia isn't his skills as a designer, but rather the market and tastes of gamers. While many clamor for more "gamer's games" from him, what sells are the more streamlined, simple games. I actually quite enjoyed Prosperity, which was a step up in complexity (although certainly not heavy), but it doesn't appear to have made much of a mark at all on the general public (I personally feel the art direction and components have a lot to do with that).
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Walt
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Dearlove wrote:
I don't actually recall Reiner saying anything on the subject in public, though he may well have done.

It was at a talk/Q&A at 2007 OrcCon in Los Angeles I attended, podcast on Boardgame Babylon.

My recollection of what Dr. K. said is that Kosmos contacted (or discussed during usual talks) the BM concept in mechanics terms. I'm not sure if it was stated who conceived the basic story. As usual, the final art was all in Kosmos's hands. Wanting to compete with MtG and such, the art was expensive, thus Kosmos asked to reuse the art in BMC.

Boardgame Babylon v31, 28 February 2007:
8:35 future of BM (none)
19:00 origin of BMC
http://hwcdn.libsyn.com/p/1/c/8/1c8c42ae798e19c2/bgb_v31.mp3...|
 
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Christopher Dearlove
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Tall_Walt wrote:
My recollection of what Dr. K. said is that Kosmos contacted (or discussed during usual talks) the BM concept in mechanics terms.


I'm pretty sure I saw a precursor to BM with the same basic climbing mechanism, but a lot simpler. I'd be very surprised if a publisher suggested mechanisms as such. Marketing approach, and therefore structure (in the sense of multiple decks etc.) now that's a different thing.
 
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